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Thu, 15 Feb 2024 01:50:30 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <0b3cf56b-004d-4a9f-a643-a53ccb50e278@eastlink.ca> In-Reply-To: <0b3cf56b-004d-4a9f-a643-a53ccb50e278@eastlink.ca> From: Roman Perepelitsa Date: Thu, 15 Feb 2024 10:50:17 +0100 Message-ID: Subject: Re: Counting characters in command output? To: Ray Andrews Cc: zsh-users@zsh.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Seq: 29674 Archived-At: X-Loop: zsh-users@zsh.org Errors-To: zsh-users-owner@zsh.org Precedence: list Precedence: bulk Sender: zsh-users-request@zsh.org X-no-archive: yes List-Id: List-Help: , List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , List-Post: List-Owner: List-Archive: On Wed, Feb 14, 2024 at 4:37=E2=80=AFPM Ray Andrews wrote: > > What are the vectors? First must be logical necessity, second > consistency -- avoid strange exceptions -- third and fourth would > be helpfulness and tradition, with old-school guys favoring > tradition and guys like me favoring helpfulness. In any debate between tradition and helpfulness, ensure your counterpart agrees with this perspective. Should they present arguments they consider essential for necessity and consistency, and you categorize them merely as "tradition," dialogue ceases. From their standpoint, your stance appears at best inconsistent, or at worst, vague, and you fail to recognize their points even when clearly outlined. > I wish there were enough of us on this list to put things to a vote > sometimes [...] For anything to happen, somebody has to do the work. There is no point in voting if the vote has no consequences: it's not an obligation for anybody to do the work, nor does any work require an approval from voters. Bart has done the work of adding named references, so now we'll have named references. Bart designed the feature, implemented it, and wrote documentation. At each point everyone was free to contribute to this effort or to oppose it. Both of these require work, too. Compare what Bart has done to my posting an opinion on this thread. One is work, and thus has impact, the other isn't and remains inconsequential. Roman.