From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.4 (2020-01-24) on inbox.vuxu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=0.2 required=5.0 tests=DKIM_SIGNED,DKIM_VALID, DKIM_VALID_AU,FREEMAIL_FROM,MAILING_LIST_MULTI,RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2,RDNS_NONE,UNPARSEABLE_RELAY autolearn=no autolearn_force=no version=3.4.4 Received: from authenticated user by zero.zsh.org with local id 1kiOhi-00097j-CJ; Thu, 26 Nov 2020 21:21:26 +0000 Authentication-Results: zsh.org; iprev=pass (mail-wm1-f47.google.com) smtp.remote-ip=209.85.128.47; dkim=pass header.d=gmail.com header.s=20161025 header.a=rsa-sha256; dmarc=pass header.from=gmail.com; arc=none Received: from mail-wm1-f47.google.com ([209.85.128.47]:35044) by zero.zsh.org with esmtps (TLS1.3:TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) id 1kiOhO-0008tH-UK; Thu, 26 Nov 2020 21:21:08 +0000 Received: by mail-wm1-f47.google.com with SMTP id w24so3707974wmi.0 for ; Thu, 26 Nov 2020 13:21:06 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=KGOAr1P53/6PpiO3F3J7JURApCVlfKTL1N6KLFqr4Ec=; b=Yi+y33omIiB4LVEEkioG8OMPpAtT63RA5LjDnvCoj6LYIArPtqvYlYgUwMM9IZ1jjO hcoBpJG+Q73VcLQfRNzJfPfV4QfarLt7SeYEiqKmaPE149IX9g8m38SVqkmMjovARsmw olF6qyx8fLMfuLR/JY0PnS/NfxGfcNq8xaVpRD71/6ddhBIaR8HXX7BWtBtesGHLJ64i QEyfr8HDlYYmSgdGQ8Kig19pdXVV/ttCnQMvOodXjbdK0ufG7qWVToOsmuqzkYxjqS1u JV9PUem6DVnfJbfbmDgr2p3pZ8ZdE/60BYmhHZ0JfKCd9k+sB/WGQtFK+81QqVsfek4y r73A== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=KGOAr1P53/6PpiO3F3J7JURApCVlfKTL1N6KLFqr4Ec=; b=W5XxBv57SX5letvZH+xXQgU85s4rfvEUoOKwWCUPbT3s/AiMmxWqgL0pdY8YUcyTrr TVWjQ7vPoFQTFXcJk8zyTgFUfCpAZQ0kiFF8UEeNj+YoySVO3HBBDFFHfnscO+DKAtnL nl9+GBT8tFqqTDuHRczS/ZdUEwosom4asB3cBQoo1nZRZKtDx/ctxWRwAl1ch8hxSM1k onKuqqiFiynkFSDLe5IYTRtbRRMdTPXys12BJIcbGcbFlSqyubOQG/dqx2AnxxdXsa+4 4QCOGsDuakQlpbH/Y3xRSIUkCF3Dfuwl4DMZlffuAvTK79hOZT0AsdgK1EiXm7YXxR0Z YeKg== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM5323ethMXh2XJ4raLb3P/e38oAPgUZHaLvlLgGe4EK5H5ugglvoL groyuf9WwGzGxQRD/89CaI2+Hk2ZtvMXLuShiV96sZNcAM0= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJzl1wRIZ8UNHoKs4gxl5d4dPSurtz1q/B4DgzrjUOhck7ohuq/q9D2F3NNnrpI/8gEHESRCw1pp6B4o5pSKLDg= X-Received: by 2002:a1c:a145:: with SMTP id k66mr5184309wme.173.1606425666400; Thu, 26 Nov 2020 13:21:06 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <20201125131921.vay7h3xk5qn4odgg@chazelas.org> In-Reply-To: From: Felipe Contreras Date: Thu, 26 Nov 2020 15:20:55 -0600 Message-ID: Subject: Re: More rabbit-holes with unset variables To: Bart Schaefer Cc: Zsh hackers list Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Seq: 47647 Archived-At: X-Loop: zsh-workers@zsh.org Errors-To: zsh-workers-owner@zsh.org Precedence: list Precedence: bulk Sender: zsh-workers-request@zsh.org X-no-archive: yes List-Id: List-Help: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: List-Post: List-Owner: List-Archive: Archived-At: On Thu, Nov 26, 2020 at 2:42 PM Bart Schaefer wrote: > So the language you're quoting was rejected, though not for that > specific reason. Yes, but that's not what I asked. I asked who objected to the specific behavior I quoted. > In fact, unless the notion of typed variables (integer, array, etc.) > is excluded, that language is ambiguous, because (as I've mentioned > elsewhere) the behavior of an "unset" variable in other contexts (such > as assignment) is that it takes on the attributes from the assignment; > so a the only useful "declared but not set" variable is a simple > scalar. And by scalar I suppose you mean string. Yes, I agree in the context of typed variables it's much more debatable what the initial value should be. Which is why since the start I only mentioned variables for which the user didn't specify a type. -- Felipe Contreras