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[80.223.62.132]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id l9sm1183433lfp.209.2021.02.20.00.18.46 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128/128); Sat, 20 Feb 2021 00:18:47 -0800 (PST) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable From: Marlon Richert Mime-Version: 1.0 (1.0) Subject: Re: Rewrite of zsh-newuser-install Date: Sat, 20 Feb 2021 10:18:46 +0200 Message-Id: References: Cc: Zsh hackers list In-Reply-To: To: dana , Bart Schaefer , Oliver Kiddle , Daniel Shahaf X-Mailer: iPhone Mail (18D52) X-Seq: 48085 Archived-At: X-Loop: zsh-workers@zsh.org Errors-To: zsh-workers-owner@zsh.org Precedence: list Precedence: bulk Sender: zsh-workers-request@zsh.org X-no-archive: yes List-Id: List-Help: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: List-Post: List-Owner: List-Archive: Archived-At: > On 20. Feb 2021, at 2.30, dana wrote: > Despite the title of the thread, i didn't actually expect that large of a > change to zsh-newuser-install itself. I know from comments i've seen on-li= ne > that many people find the wizard overwhelming, but i don't have any eviden= ce > that specifically points to '[nobody] wants the questionnaire'. I'm fine w= ith > getting rid of it if the others want to, i just don't know myself. While I have no quantifiable evidence for this particular case, it is a gene= ral principle of modern UX Design to give the user good defaults, which they= then can change later, rather than present them with lots of choices upfron= t. This is backed up by actual, credible usability research. And I do have l= ots of anecdotal evidence that shell users prefer to just have a default con= fig that they can edit manually. > There are also some moving parts we haven't really even discussed, like ho= w > these changes will affect packagers. Are we going to get rid of the > recommended-zshrc mechanism (option 2) that is used by Debian &al.? I don=E2=80=99t know what is the =E2=80=9Crecommended-zshrc mechanism (optio= n 2)=E2=80=9D. How does that work? > Or is this > config going to co-exist with it? Or are we going to unify them somehow? >=20 > Should we consult with some down-stream maintainers on this? Yes, I think that=E2=80=99s definitely a good idea. Is that just a matter of= asking on their mailing lists? Perhaps one idea would be to make this parametrizable a little, to make it e= asier for downstream maintainers to build their defaults on top of this. So,= instead of presenting the users with lots of questions, we instead give the= downstream maintainers an easy way to selectively override our suggested de= faults. > As for what's currently in the rewritten script... i wonder if it's really= > even necessary to ask every new user where they want to put their shell fi= les. > I don't have any evidence, but it seems like a high burden (having to read= and > answer the questions) compared to the amount of people who are actually go= ing > to feel strongly about it. I would be fine with just using the XDG Base Dir spec for this, but not ever= yone seems to agree. Hence the question. It=E2=80=99s a compromise. :)