Re: [9fans] Ick, I was not clear, sorry about that

Re: [9fans] Ick, I was not clear, sorry about that

[okamoto]

[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 79 bytes --]

In those case, we don't use the word "stolen", instead "imported".

Kenji


[-- Attachment #2: Type: message/rfc822, Size: 2368 bytes --]

From: "Boyd Roberts" <boyd@planete.net>
To: <9fans@cs.psu.edu>
Subject: Re: [9fans] Ick, I was not clear, sorry about that
Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 10:33:54 +0100
Message-ID: <014e01c07bb1$9d8d87e0$0ab9c6d4@cybercable.fr>

> It's in the 11th century, and invented and used by Japanese women.
> It was not "stolen' but invented, because chinese and japanese are
> quite different language.

the kanji were stolen and used to write japanese and
the japanese women developed the kana, from the kanji.

i guess my original sentence may have been a bit ambiguous.

Re: [9fans] Ick, I was not clear, sorry about that

[Boyd Roberts]

> In those case, we don't use the word "stolen", instead "imported".

'stolen' was just my way of saying 'adopted'.

NEC no kaishain deshita, yo.

Re: [9fans] Ick, I was not clear, sorry about that

[Ozan Yigit]

> the kana was derived from the kanji, stolen from the
> chinese in the 13th? century.  until then the japanese
> had no writing system.

i think "stolen" is a really bizarre way to put it. adoption of a writing
system usually happens as people of different regions fight, trade and
mingle; it is usually not an act of deliberation...

oz
-- 
www.cs.yorku.ca/~oz	 | if you couldn't find any weirdness, maybe
york u. computer science | we'll just have to make some!   -- hobbes

Re: [9fans] Ick, I was not clear, sorry about that

[ozan s. yigit]

boyd@planete.net (Boyd Roberts) writes:

> > Thus kana -- the ability to render phoenemes is irrelevant.
> 
> the kana was derived from the kanji, stolen from the
> chinese in the 13th? century.  until then the japanese
> had no writing system.

i think "stolen" is a really bizarre way to put it. adoption of a writing
system usually happens as people of different regions fight, trade and
mingle; it is usually not an act of deliberation...

oz

Re: [9fans] Ick, I was not clear, sorry about that

[Boyd Roberts]

> It's in the 11th century, and invented and used by Japanese women.
> It was not "stolen' but invented, because chinese and japanese are
> quite different language.

the kanji were stolen and used to write japanese and
the japanese women developed the kana, from the kanji.

i guess my original sentence may have been a bit ambiguous.

Re: [9fans] Ick, I was not clear, sorry about that

[Boyd Roberts]

> Thus kana -- the ability to render phoenemes is irrelevant.

the kana was derived from the kanji, stolen from the
chinese in the 13th? century.  until then the japanese
had no writing system.

[9fans] Ick, I was not clear, sorry about that

[Laura Creighton]

When I wrote:
> I am curious as to what font design is like in Japan or other places where
> there is a strong tradition of calligraphy and where letters, like bricks
> or phonemes do not exist.  What do Japanese font designers say it takes
> to make a good font?

What I should have written was:
>I think that the insights one finds easy to grasp about what makes writing
>beautiful will be different if you are used to thinking of letters as things
>that have the property of good-things-to-play-scrabble-with, i.e. a few
>arbitrary shapes which represent sounds and nothing else, or if your
>tradition of what is a language is different.

Thus kana -- the ability to render phoenemes is irrelevant.  Thanks Boyd.

Laura