[9fans] X11 setup problem

[9fans] X11 setup problem

[pavlovetsky]

I have problem installing X11. I mount X11.iso and after I issued the
command /n/dist/X11.setup (as was prescribed in README) I got the
following:
/n/kfs/dist/replica/client/X11.db: rc (X11.setup): can't open: '/n/kfs/
dist' does not exist.

What do you think is wrong? What to do?

Thanks a lot.

Re: [9fans] X11 setup problem

[John Floren]

On 6/19/07, pavlovetsky@gmail.com <pavlovetsky@gmail.com> wrote:
> I have problem installing X11. I mount X11.iso and after I issued the
> command /n/dist/X11.setup (as was prescribed in README) I got the
> following:
> /n/kfs/dist/replica/client/X11.db: rc (X11.setup): can't open: '/n/kfs/
> dist' does not exist.
>
> What do you think is wrong? What to do?
>
> Thanks a lot.
>

Looks like the problem here is that the iso is SO old, it expects a
kfs file system rather than the current fossil fs. If I remember, I
tried installing X11 some months ago and ran into the same problem.
Not sure what the solution is, I'm afraid. Besides, it's such an old
X, might not even be worth using.

John
--
Ph'nglui mglw'nafh Cthulhu R'lyeh wgah'nagl fhtagn

Re: [9fans] X11 setup problem

[Steve Simon]

> Looks like the problem here is that the iso is SO old, it expects a
> kfs file system rather than the current fossil fs.

Exactly, the x11 iso predates fossil.

I am sure this was discussed a fairly recently,
fbg rembembers the answer, if you google comp.os.plan9
you should find some hints.

the x11 port offers only 8 bit pixmaps to the clients
so all images must be remapped to the physical displays
depth in the server, so its slow on 16bit and 32bit displays.

This said it does work though annoyingly some programs
refuse to cooperate with 8bit displays, most notably
firefox ☹

If you are interested, the port consists of a single file
(brazil.c from memory) and I for one would find a new port
that supports 16 and 32 bit displays very useful.

Also beware, recompiling X11 from scratch takes a 20 or 30
times as long as compiling the plan9 kernel.

-Steve

[9fans] Re: X11 setup problem

[pavlovetsky]

Yes, this (I mean the age of the X11 distribution) was the first
thought arised in my mind.
Ok, the contents of X11.setup is as follows:


#!/bin/rc

>>/n/kfs/dist/replica/client/X11.db
>>/n/kfs/dist/replica/client/X11.log


Now the question is how to upgrade and make it usable with fossil. I
am asking this question since I am afraid I am still learning the
system and need help in (seems to be) simple matter.
Is there somebody who can give a clue? Thank you.

Re: [9fans] Re: X11 setup problem

[Anthony Sorace]

/n/kfs is the conventional mount point for the previous
local-disk-backed file system on terminals and cpu servers; it's
likely just an issue of point it at wherever your file system is
*really* mounted, instead (or, just mount it on /n/kfs and skip the
changes).

however, and this is important, it is *very* *strongly* recommended
that you learn to use the system without X11 first. X11 is not part of
the distribution for a reason; that port is old and slow, and was
never heavily used. no program in Plan 9 depends on, or even wants,
X11 in any way. you will find it distracting and frustrating rather
than helpful if you aren't familiar with "real" Plan 9 first, as
you'll keep expecting things to be there which aren't.

Re: [9fans] Re: X11 setup problem

[Paweł Lasek]

On 6/20/07, Anthony Sorace <anothy@gmail.com> wrote:

> however, and this is important, it is *very* *strongly* recommended
> that you learn to use the system without X11 first. X11 is not part of
> the distribution for a reason; that port is old and slow, and was
> never heavily used. no program in Plan 9 depends on, or even wants,
> X11 in any way. you will find it distracting and frustrating rather
> than helpful if you aren't familiar with "real" Plan 9 first, as
> you'll keep expecting things to be there which aren't.
>

And if someone really wants X11, it might be more sensible to port
X.Org's kdrive using /dev/draw for framebuffer.... It might be easier
than getting that old port to be usable with modern X11 apps :-)

--
Paul Lasek

[9fans] Re: X11 setup problem

[pavlovetsky]

My messages posted with delay and it looks a bit inadequate, sorry for
inconvenience.

[9fans] Re: X11 setup problem

[pavlovetsky]

On Jun 20, 2:41 pm, ano...@gmail.com (Anthony Sorace) wrote:
> /n/kfs is the conventional mount point for the previous
> local-disk-backed file system on terminals and cpu servers; it's
> likely just an issue of point it at wherever your file system is
> *really* mounted, instead (or, just mount it on /n/kfs and skip the
> changes).
>
> however, and this is important, it is *very* *strongly* recommended
> that you learn to use the system without X11 first. X11 is not part of
> the distribution for a reason; that port is old and slow, and was
> never heavily used. no program in Plan 9 depends on, or even wants,
> X11 in any way. you will find it distracting and frustrating rather
> than helpful if you aren't familiar with "real" Plan 9 first, as
> you'll keep expecting things to be there which aren't.

I understand you perfectly. My idea was that with X installed it would
be easer to port other software that uses X server.

Re: [9fans] Re: X11 setup problem

[Steve Simon]

Ok,

Installing the X11 iso on a fossil based file server.

	# start the iso9660 filesystem server
	9660srv

	disable the 9fs command by binding echo over it
	bind /386/bin/echo /rc/bin/9fs

	# mount a psudo /n/kfs pointing to the root of your fossil filesystem
	mount /srv/boot /n/kfs

	# the below is from the standard X11 install instructions.

	# mount the iso
	mount /srv/9660 /n/dist /n/juke/X11.iso

	# initialise the replica logs
	/n/dist/X11.setup

	# do the pull
	replica/pull /n/dist/X11

	# have coffee, even installing takes 10 mins...

-Steve

Re: [9fans] Re: X11 setup problem

[john]

> Ok,
>
> Installing the X11 iso on a fossil based file server.
>
> 	# start the iso9660 filesystem server
> 	9660srv
>
> 	disable the 9fs command by binding echo over it
> 	bind /386/bin/echo /rc/bin/9fs
>
> 	# mount a psudo /n/kfs pointing to the root of your fossil filesystem
> 	mount /srv/boot /n/kfs
>
> 	# the below is from the standard X11 install instructions.
>
> 	# mount the iso
> 	mount /srv/9660 /n/dist /n/juke/X11.iso
>
> 	# initialise the replica logs
> 	/n/dist/X11.setup
>
> 	# do the pull
> 	replica/pull /n/dist/X11
>
> 	# have coffee, even installing takes 10 mins...
>
> -Steve

I went ahead and installed X11 just for the hell of it, but can
anybody tell me what actually comes with the distribution?

John

Re: [9fans] Re: X11 setup problem

[Steve Simon]

anybody tell me what actually comes with the distribution?

An X11 server for plan9 and all the usual tools,
xauth, xclock, xrdb, xterm etc.

try:
	9fs boot
	du -a /n/boot | grep X11

-Steve

[9fans] Re: X11 setup problem

[pavlovetsky]

On Jun 20, 4:55 pm, pawel.la...@gmail.com (Pawe  Lasek) wrote:
> On 6/20/07, Anthony Sorace <ano...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > however, and this is important, it is *very* *strongly* recommended
> > that you learn to use the system without X11 first. X11 is not part of
> > the distribution for a reason; that port is old and slow, and was
> > never heavily used. no program in Plan 9 depends on, or even wants,
> > X11 in any way. you will find it distracting and frustrating rather
> > than helpful if you aren't familiar with "real" Plan 9 first, as
> > you'll keep expecting things to be there which aren't.
>
> And if someone really wants X11, it might be more sensible to port
> X.Org's kdrive using /dev/draw for framebuffer.... It might be easier
> than getting that old port to be usable with modern X11 apps :-)
>
> --
> Paul Lasek

Paul is right. It seems much more sensible to drop this antique thing
and port latest sources, in the end.

[9fans] Re: X11 setup problem

[pavlovetsky]

On Jun 21, 1:16 am, s...@quintile.net (Steve Simon) wrote:
> Ok,
>
> Installing the X11 iso on a fossil based file server.
>
>         # start the iso9660 filesystem server
>         9660srv
>
>         disable the 9fs command by binding echo over it
>         bind /386/bin/echo /rc/bin/9fs
>
>         # mount a psudo /n/kfs pointing to the root of your fossil filesystem
>         mount /srv/boot /n/kfs
>
>         # the below is from the standard X11 install instructions.
>
>         # mount the iso
>         mount /srv/9660 /n/dist /n/juke/X11.iso
>
>         # initialise the replica logs
>         /n/dist/X11.setup
>
>         # do the pull
>         replica/pull /n/dist/X11
>
>         # have coffee, even installing takes 10 mins...
>
> -Steve

I had different and, I am afraid, more crude aproach regarding the
part before mounting iso. Namely I did "bind / /n/kfs" and edited
replica configuration named X11 by replacing "fn clientmount { 9fs
kfs }" with "fn clientmount { status='' }". I extracted the contents
of X11.iso, edited replica configuration, and, in the end, my pull was
in the form "replica/pull /usr/anton/X11/X11". A hack, the value of
which is learning how the things work.

Re: [9fans] Re: X11 setup problem

[Steve Simon]

> I had different and, I am afraid, more crude aproach regarding the
> part before mounting iso. Namely I did "bind / /n/kfs" and edited
> replica configuration named X11 by replacing "fn clientmount { 9fs
> kfs }" with "fn clientmount { status='' }". I extracted the contents
> of X11.iso, edited replica configuration, and, in the end, my pull was
> in the form "replica/pull /usr/anton/X11/X11". A hack, the value of
> which is learning how the things work.


Working out how to do it yourself is never a hack it is A Good Thing™,
well done!

For I put a page on the wiki on installing X11, which probably applies
similarly to the other ISOs in /n/sources/extra but I haven't tested
them with this recipie.

-Steve