Re: [9fans] File/cpu servers..?

Re: [9fans] File/cpu servers..?

[Russ Cox]

  I'm also awaiting a concise set of instructions for installing a
  self-contained terminal/CPU-server/disk-server. It would be ideal if
  WORM backups, DNS, and the whole set of Plan9 services could be
  functional on one system. I think people at the Labs are working on
  getting out a basic document.

I plan to have such an addendum to the
Getting Started document late tonight.

For now, I will note the following.
The intended use of the system is to have
separate machines for everything -- a file
server, a cpu server, and terminals.
That said, it is probably unrealistic
to expect single users to dedicate a
minimum of three machines to get a Plan 9
network going.

There are ways to have a combination
cpu/auth/file server via kfs, and
in fact I configured one last night and
am using a terminal booted from it at
the moment.  You currently can't have
WORM-style backups on kfs, though.  For
that you need to run a dedicated file
server, as the WORM management code
lives in the standalone file server code
only.

  I did this, replaced /386/9pcdisk with the resulting file, and also
  ran gzip 9pcdisk to standard out (naming the results 9pcdisk.gz) for a

You'll get an even smaller 9pcdisk.gz if you
do mk 'CONF=pcdisk' 9pcdisk.gz, which strips
the binary en route to gzip.  mk 'CONF=pcdisk' install
installs the kernels too, although as discussed
earlier, you will want to comment out the line
in /sys/src/9/pc/mkfile that tries to toss them
over to "dinar".

Russ

Re: [9fans] File/cpu service provider

[Richard Uhtenwoldt]

Russ Cox writes:

>The intended use of the system is to have
>separate machines for everything -- a file
>server, a cpu server, and terminals.
>That said, it is probably unrealistic
>to expect single users to dedicate a
>minimum of three machines to get a Plan 9
>network going.

I wish some enterprising Plan 9 hacker would
sell accounts on an expertly-maintained Plan 9
network and makes those accounts available via
a reliable connection to the internet.  Per
analogy with an "application service provider"
(ASP), such an enterprising hacker would be a
"Plan 9 file- and cpu-service provider" (9SP).

to enjoy a rich Plan 9 experience, a home user
would need only an account with the 9SP,
internet connectivity and a Plan 9 terminal
able to connect to the internet.  if I
understand correctly, the home user would be
relieved not only of the burden of installing
and maintaining u9fs(4) or fs(4) and backing up
its data, but also of the burden of installing
and upgrading (most? all?) applications.

is there some technical obstacle to this
working?  in particular, can a terminal use the
public internet to connect to a cpu server and
a file server?

Re: [9fans] File/cpu servers..?

[Ish Rattan]

Russ Cox wrote:

>   I'm also awaiting a concise set of instructions for installing a
>   self-contained terminal/CPU-server/disk-server. It would be ideal if
>   WORM backups, DNS, and the whole set of Plan9 services could be
>   functional on one system. I think people at the Labs are working on
>   getting out a basic document.
>
> I plan to have such an addendum to the
> Getting Started document late tonight.
>
> For now, I will note the following.
> The intended use of the system is to have
> separate machines for everything -- a file
> server, a cpu server, and terminals.
> That said, it is probably unrealistic
> to expect single users to dedicate a
> minimum of three machines to get a Plan 9
> network going.
>
> There are ways to have a combination
> cpu/auth/file server via kfs, and
> in fact I configured one last night and
> am using a terminal booted from it at

The details for this will be great!!

- ishwar

Re: [9fans] File/cpu service provider

[Wesley Felter]

in article 200006160020.RAA09589@ohio.river.org, Richard Uhtenwoldt at
ru@ohio.river.org wrote on 6/15/00 7:45 PM:

> I wish some enterprising Plan 9 hacker would
> sell accounts on an expertly-maintained Plan 9
> network and makes those accounts available via
> a reliable connection to the internet.  Per
> analogy with an "application service provider"
> (ASP), such an enterprising hacker would be a
> "Plan 9 file- and cpu-service provider" (9SP).

Speaking of ASPs and mutually hostile users, what kind of resource
management does Plan 9 have? Does it have some sort of hierachical CPU,
disk, and network scheduling? Does it overcommit VM?

I looked at the papers directory on the Web site, but nothing there looked
like it might answer these questions.

Wesley Felter - wesf@cs.utexas.edu - http://www.cs.utexas.edu/users/wesf/

Re: [9fans] File/cpu service provider

[rob pike]

    Speaking of ASPs and mutually hostile users, what kind of resource
    management does Plan 9 have? Does it have some sort of hierachical CPU,
    disk, and network scheduling? Does it overcommit VM?

Plan 9 doesn't do anything very sophisticated about resource management.
It should probably be smarter in general.  We're still trying to come up
with
a satisfying way to administer kernel memory - how to manage the balance
between kernel and user memory.

It doesn't overcommit VM, however.

-rob

Re: [9fans] File/cpu servers..?

[Stephen Wynne]

In message <200006151522.LAA09382@pali.cps.cmich.edu>, Ish Rattan writes:

    In context of installing a file and cpu server more
    details will be helpful.

Hi Ishwar,

I'm also awaiting a concise set of instructions for installing a
self-contained terminal/CPU-server/disk-server. It would be ideal if
WORM backups, DNS, and the whole set of Plan9 services could be
functional on one system. I think people at the Labs are working on
getting out a basic document.

Best regards,

Steve

P.S. This may not help much, but to answer your immediate question
about building kernels, Steve Kotsopoulos at
http://www.fywss.com/plan9/info/steve/plan9.admin, suggests this:

    Subject: Compiling kernels

     cd /sys/src/9/pc
     mk 'CONF=pcdisk'

I did this, replaced /386/9pcdisk with the resulting file, and also
ran gzip 9pcdisk to standard out (naming the results 9pcdisk.gz) for a
boot floppy.

[9fans] File/cpu servers..?

[Ish Rattan]

Hello,

In context of installing a file and cpu server more
details will be helpful. After terminal install, I do
not see a /386/9pccpudisk. Do I have to nmake one from
sources /sys/src/9/pc? Also, how does one make a file
server boot disk?

- ishwar

>
>The installation procedure creates a terminal.
>To bring a system up as a standalone cpu server,
>you can just change the kernel it boots
>(type 9fat:, copy /386/9pccpudisk to /n/9fat,
>and then edit /n/9fat/plan9.ini to name 9pccpudisk).
>
>Bringing up a file server is a bit more work
>and currently must be done by hand.  You'd
>have to bring it up with a boot floppy and
>then initialize the file system via the network
>and the file server "allow" command.
>Read update(8) and wrap(8) for info on
>making a boot disk and then extracting the
>plan9.9gz onto the file server.  The command
>used in the install is
>	wrap/inst -ovr /n/kfs plan9.9gz
>You'd of course want to name your file server
>rather than /n/kfs.
>
>Russ