[9fans] acme design

[9fans] acme design

[cej]

> The tags scroll if you drag button1 up or down in the tag.

	actually, they appear not to scroll but just jump to the end
	what if i want to exe a cmd somewhere in the middle? just retype/paste into an ordinary frame?

> But I agree, having automatic scrolling when typing would be nice.
	having ordinary scrolling would be nice ;-)

> I can easily live without it though.
	me not.... :-(  ... it renders me unaesthetic, sorry.
	And yes, my proposal was driven perhaps more by puristic
	view on what [subjectively, of course] is/isn't perceived aesthetic,
	than true ergonomic/other advantages.

	thanks for debate, regards,

++pac.

Re: [9fans] acme design

[plan9]

++pac wrote:
>> The tags scroll if you drag button1 up or down in the tag.
> 
> 	actually, they appear not to scroll but just jump to the end
> 	what if i want to exe a cmd somewhere in the middle? just retype/paste into an ordinary frame?

Apologies if this sounds flippant, but your comment above makes me
want to ask: What do you keep in your tags?  Whole scripts or
paragraphs of text?  I use middle click on New and type in the new
pane for stuff like that.

The only times I have difficulties with text length in tags is when
using acme under Unix, as I have less control over most of the
absolute filenames.  And files under Unix tend to live in very deep
directory hierarchies.  Which incidentally, led to the introduction of
the special way environment variables are used by wily.

Robby

Re: [9fans] unix acme (was: acme design)

[Axel Belinfante]

> The only times I have difficulties with text length in tags is when
> using acme under Unix, as I have less control over most of the
> absolute filenames.  And files under Unix tend to live in very deep
> directory hierarchies.  Which incidentally, led to the introduction of
> the special way environment variables are used by wily.

Just in case you were not already aware of it:
the env var stuff can be found 'for reference'
in the CVS repository of the unix port of acme.
(it was added in one version and removed again in the next;
 I just applied the changes and it works fine)
(until the latest port update when acme stopped working
 for me on sunos 5.8 -- I'm just using a slighly older
 ports version)

I made one minor change to the unix acme-with-env-vars:
I changed the sorting of the env vars, such that the env var
matching the longest part of the file name gets used,
instead of the env var with the shortest name.
I send that fix to Russ, don't know if it got also added
'for reference' to the CVS repository - if you want it,
let me know.

Axel.

Re: [9fans] acme design

[rog]

>	having ordinary scrolling would be nice ;-)

you do have "ordinary" scrolling - just use the middle button,
as it says in the manual.

Re: [9fans] acme design

[rog]

i said:
: you do have "ordinary" scrolling - just use the middle button,
: as it says in the manual.

oops. i didn't understand the context of this (tag scrolling) until too late.
sorry.

as someone else said, if you want more text than will fit in a tag,
just click on "New" and use it as a scratch window.

there's not enough space in a tag for scrollbars.

Re: [9fans] acme design

[YAMANASHI Takeshi]

> as someone else said, if you want more text than will fit in a tag,
> just click on "New" and use it as a scratch window.

As someone else said, Edit commands typed in the New'ly
created scratch window can't be applied to contents in
other windows, if I'm correct.  And when everytime I want
to execute one of them, snarf&paste it into the intended
tagline and execute it is painful.

Rather, I have something like this at the top of a Zerox'ed
window and use them.
	| |-----------------------------------------------
	[=]/usr/nashi/src/9skk.c Del Snarf | Look
	| |-----------------------------------------------
	| |/*
	| |	Edit 5,10x/hogefuga what ever long edit commands here
	| |	Edit x/yet another long commands here
	| |*/
	| |-----------------------------------------------
	[=]/usr/nashi/src/9skk.c Del Snarf | Look Edit =
	| |-----------------------------------------------
	| |void
	| |main(int argc, char **argv)
	| | ...

# Sorry to disturb you for merely showing my custom.

> there's not enough space in a tag for scrollbars.

Agreed. But autoscrolling horizontaly without any scrollbar
when typing past the right end of a tagline could be helpful.
-- 

Re: [9fans] acme design

[Charles Forsyth]

> As someone else said, Edit commands typed in the New'ly
> created scratch window can't be applied to contents in
> other windows, if I'm correct.  And when everytime I want
> to execute one of them, snarf&paste it into the intended
> tagline and execute it is painful.

select editing commands in New window.
click button 2-1 chord on Edit in target window.

Re: [9fans] acme design

[YAMANASHI Takeshi]

Thank you, forsyth.

> select editing commands in New window.
> click button 2-1 chord on Edit in target window.

Now I've learned how to use 2-1 chord.
But 2-1 seems not to work in `/mail/fs/mbox/'.
Can somebody double-check me?

# I tried 2-1 sometime before in /mail/fs/mbox/
# and it stayed in ever swelling my need-to-study
# list since then.
-- 

Re: [9fans] acme design

[Rob Pike]

> Now I've learned how to use 2-1 chord.
> But 2-1 seems not to work in `/mail/fs/mbox/'.
> Can somebody double-check me?

unfortunate but true.  i don't remember the details but there
is some nasty reason why i couldn't get the arguments to
a 2-1 chord delivered to external applications.

-rob

Re: [9fans] acme design

[YAMANASHI Takeshi]

> > But 2-1 seems not to work in `/mail/fs/mbox/'.
>  i don't remember the details but there
> is some nasty reason why i couldn't get the arguments to
> a 2-1 chord delivered to external applications.

Thank you, rob.  Anyway, 2-1 chord solved
the narrowness of taglines for most part of mine
(html and c source editting).

By the way, I changed the return key to execute the
selected commond in a tagline, i.e type a command
in a tagline, press ESC to highlight it then RET to
execute it.  I will see how I like this or not.
-- 

Re: [9fans] acme design

[Rob Pike]

> By the way, I changed the return key to execute the
> selected commond in a tagline, i.e type a command
> in a tagline, press ESC to highlight it then RET to
> execute it.  I will see how I like this or not.

others have asked for this feature or something like it,
but i've always resisted because it seems wrong to
change the meaning of newline depending where you
type it.

still, you're not alone.

-rob

Re: [9fans] acme design

[YAMANASHI Takeshi]

robpike>
> but i've always resisted because it seems wrong to
> change the meaning of newline depending where you
> type it.

You kindly warned me.  Imho, it wasn't much comfortable
than New window and 2-1 chord anyway.


vdharani>
> but doesnt it look vi-style?

I was once a vi lover before I met with acme.
It's hard to clear away the old habit, it seems.
-- 

Re: [9fans] acme design

[vdharani]

> By the way, I changed the return key to execute the
> selected commond in a tagline, i.e type a command
> in a tagline, press ESC to highlight it then RET to
> execute it.  I will see how I like this or not.

but doesnt it look vi-style?

thanks
dharani