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From: northern snowfall <dbailey27@ameritech.net>
To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu
Subject: Re: [9fans] design clairvoyance & the 9 way
Date: Wed,  7 May 2003 19:20:37 -0500	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <3EB9A2D5.6090909@ameritech.net> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <Pine.LNX.4.30.0305071048580.10670-100000@athena>

>
>
>``Your conventional `good citizen' can be depended
>on not to be too thoughtful.  His ideas, beliefs,
>and practices are those of other people.  He loves
>and hates with them.  He is unreflectively loyal to
>the institutions under which he lives, and to the
>men who administer them.  But the really educated
>good man has no right to go along without question.''
>	- Henry Raymond Mussey
>
Somehow, I find it hard to believe that simply because
I've come to the same conclusion that other people
have, I'm a blindly loyal follower. The fact is I have
questioned. That is *why* I got interested in OS
research. That is *why* I forced myself to read the
entire BSD kernel and plan9 kernel before I even
fully understood the C language. That is *why* I
chose to take on my own OS development initiatives
to push myself further than what I've learned from
the above, and other, experiences. If two brilliant
men both surmise that E=MC2, is only the first one
that brings the subject to public light seen as
genius? Or, are they both respected for the hard
work they've done.
If you noticed, I said that there was merit in a lot of
the work done by the patchwork-quilt appendages
to the UNIX world, and others. If it wasn't for
Windows, I wouldn't even *be* involved in
computers, today. Just because these things have
design problems relating to their eventual growth
and extension doesn't mean they're any less usable
or worthy of praise. However, it *does* mean that
developers have to be wary in implementing new
techniques. VPN in a Windows environment is a
superb example of this. Look how many problems
the design of their driver architecture had when
attempting to implement a secure wide-area-network
infrastructure. Rather than pursuing a solution that
would afford e-business some security, they patched
in a simple driver that afforded horrible overlay of
crypto to a sickly protocol that was easily manipulated
by security analysts with a wide range of skill:
www.atstake.com, www.team-teso.net, etc. The
problems do not seem to end here. It isn't necessarily
that things *can't* be fixed, as much as it is that
to implement true dynamic flexibility in an Operating
System, certain things need to be adhered to. Namespaces,
presenting everything as files for simple resource
exportation, runes, plumbing, embedded authentication
semantics, to name a few, are all great examples of
ways to extend the capability of an OS for *years* of
research, when implementing new ideas, testing theory,
or whatever you're doing. UNIX simply failed to have
these things and because of the way the OS has been
structured from years of hacking and rehacking, it
would just be another *hack* to attempt implementation
of these ideas. We've seen attempts at these hacks
in projects like SELinux at the NSA and it is very
telling that their work seems to prove that, though name
spaces in a *NIX environment is a great ambition, the
underlying VFS/Net framework presents a serious
problem to the abstraction of isolated resource management,
severely crippling the implementation. So, what you
end up with is almost a redesigned Linux. Isn't it more
sensible to move to another OS with these ideas built
from the ground up, rather than spending a large amount
of time attempting to redesign the core of an OS whose
design is proven to be non-adherent to your goal?
Sheesh.

>



  parent reply	other threads:[~2003-05-08  0:20 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 700+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2003-04-23  9:16 [9fans] same functions everywhere paurea
2003-04-23 15:05 ` Russ Cox
2003-04-23 15:29   ` paurea
2003-04-23 15:32     ` Fco.J.Ballesteros
2003-04-23 17:33       ` rob pike, esq.
2003-04-24 12:02         ` paurea
2003-04-24 12:20           ` Charles Forsyth
2003-04-24 14:39           ` Sam
2003-04-24 14:48             ` Sam
2003-04-29  5:04           ` Boyd Roberts
2003-04-24  1:31     ` okamoto
2003-04-29  5:43       ` Boyd Roberts
2003-04-25 10:40 ` Douglas A. Gwyn
2003-04-25 11:46   ` Fco.J.Ballesteros
2003-04-30  8:41     ` Douglas A. Gwyn
2003-04-30 20:08       ` Joel Salomon
2003-04-30 20:11         ` rsc
2003-04-30 20:29           ` Scott Schwartz
2003-05-01  9:07             ` Douglas A. Gwyn
2003-05-01 16:00               ` Scott Schwartz
2003-05-07  4:53                 ` boyd, rounin
2003-05-07 11:03                   ` northern snowfall
2003-05-07 10:40                     ` Lucio De Re
2003-05-07 13:05                       ` northern snowfall
2003-05-07 12:25                         ` Lucio De Re
2003-05-07 13:34                           ` northern snowfall
2003-05-07 13:56                             ` northern snowfall
2003-05-27  9:22                             ` Ralph Corderoy
2003-05-27 10:48                               ` northern snowfall
2003-05-07 12:33                         ` David Butler
2003-05-07 13:40                           ` northern snowfall
2003-05-07 14:33                       ` boyd, rounin
2003-05-08  9:08                       ` Douglas A. Gwyn
2003-05-08  9:49                         ` Bruce Ellis
2003-05-08 13:20                           ` rog
2003-05-27  9:22                       ` Ralph Corderoy
2003-05-07 14:17                     ` C (Was: [9fans] same functions everywhere) Sam
2003-05-07 16:32                       ` northern snowfall
2003-05-07 16:33                         ` [9fans] design clairvoyance & the 9 way Sam
2003-05-07 17:34                           ` Fco.J.Ballesteros
2003-05-07 20:01                           ` David Presotto
2003-05-07 20:34                             ` Stephen Wynne
2003-05-07 21:57                               ` Steve Kotsopoulos
2003-05-08  4:14                               ` A.S. Kukhar
2003-05-08 17:04                               ` Dan Cross
2003-05-09 19:14                                 ` boyd, rounin
2003-05-07 22:33                             ` Sam
2003-05-08  0:46                               ` northern snowfall
2003-05-08 16:04                                 ` Sam
2003-05-08 17:08                                   ` Russ Cox
2003-05-09  1:12                                   ` Geoff Collyer
2003-05-08 17:26                                 ` Dan Cross
2003-05-09  1:12                                   ` northern snowfall
2003-05-09  0:49                                     ` Dan Cross
2003-05-09  1:07                                       ` Joel Salomon
2003-05-09  2:53                                         ` ron minnich
2003-05-09  8:36                                         ` Douglas A. Gwyn
2003-05-09 14:29                                           ` ron minnich
2003-05-09 15:41                                             ` northern snowfall
2003-05-09  2:18                                       ` northern snowfall
2003-05-09  7:55                                 ` Taj Khattra
2003-05-09  9:48                                   ` northern snowfall
2003-05-09 19:52                                     ` boyd, rounin
2003-05-09 20:47                                       ` David Presotto
2003-05-10  2:56                                         ` boyd, rounin
2003-05-14 18:55                                     ` boyd, rounin
2003-05-08  4:04                               ` Russ Cox
2003-05-08  0:20                           ` northern snowfall [this message]
2003-05-19  9:46                           ` boyd, rounin
2003-05-08  9:08                       ` C (Was: [9fans] same functions everywhere) Douglas A. Gwyn
2003-05-07 14:43                     ` [9fans] same functions everywhere Russ Cox
2003-05-07 15:47                       ` northern snowfall
2003-05-07 14:53                         ` Jack Johnson
2003-05-07 16:08                           ` northern snowfall
2003-05-08  9:08                         ` Douglas A. Gwyn
2003-05-07 16:01                       ` Scott Schwartz
2003-05-08  9:08                     ` Douglas A. Gwyn
2003-05-15 15:37                     ` Brian Inglis
2003-05-15 16:19                       ` Russ Cox
2003-05-01  9:07           ` Douglas A. Gwyn
2003-05-01 13:55             ` Russ Cox
2003-05-01 17:17               ` Joel Salomon
2003-05-01 17:21                 ` rsc
2003-05-01 18:01                   ` Joel Salomon
2003-05-01 18:11                     ` rsc
2003-05-02  9:24                       ` Douglas A. Gwyn
2003-05-02 16:28                         ` rob pike, esq.
2003-05-05 22:16                           ` Andrew Simmons
2003-05-06  9:09                           ` Douglas A. Gwyn
2003-05-06 15:46                             ` Joel Salomon
2003-05-06 18:43                             ` rog
2003-05-07  8:43                               ` Douglas A. Gwyn
2003-05-07 15:06                                 ` rog
2003-05-07 16:25                                   ` Scott Schwartz
2003-05-08 14:40                                     ` rog
2003-05-08  9:08                                   ` Douglas A. Gwyn
2003-05-08 13:12                                     ` rog
2003-05-09  8:36                                       ` Douglas A. Gwyn
2003-05-09 13:21                                         ` rog
2003-05-09 16:19                                           ` John Murdie
2003-05-09 18:24                                             ` northern snowfall
2003-05-10 17:17                                               ` John Murdie
2003-05-10 17:59                                                 ` boyd, rounin
2003-05-10 18:04                                                 ` boyd, rounin
2003-05-12  8:56                                                 ` Douglas A. Gwyn
2003-05-12  9:26                                                   ` boyd, rounin
2003-05-12 13:19                                                   ` David Presotto
2003-05-12 13:23                                                     ` boyd, rounin
2003-05-12 14:46                                                     ` complex embedded systems was " David Butler
2003-05-12 17:21                                                       ` boyd, rounin
2003-05-12 17:45                                                   ` boyd, rounin
2003-05-12 17:22                                             ` rog
2003-05-12 17:30                                               ` [9fans] (Re:) Exception handling Sape Mullender
2003-05-12 17:32                                                 ` Russ Cox
2003-05-12 17:38                                                   ` Fco.J.Ballesteros
2003-05-12 17:42                                                     ` boyd, rounin
2003-05-13  8:28                                                       ` Fco.J.Ballesteros
2003-05-12 20:30                                                   ` Dan Cross
2003-05-12 20:37                                                     ` boyd, rounin
2003-05-12 17:32                                                 ` Russ Cox
2003-05-12 18:13                                                   ` boyd, rounin
2003-05-12 20:30                                                   ` Dan Cross
2003-05-12 20:38                                                     ` boyd, rounin
2003-05-12 17:41                                                 ` boyd, rounin
2003-05-12 17:36                                               ` [9fans] same functions everywhere boyd, rounin
2003-05-13 12:24                                                 ` rog
2003-05-14  9:27                                                   ` boyd, rounin
2003-05-09 16:46                                           ` Dan Cross
2003-05-12  8:55                                           ` Douglas A. Gwyn
2003-05-12 15:51                                             ` boyd, rounin
2003-05-12 16:48                                               ` rog
2003-05-12 16:54                                                 ` boyd, rounin
2003-05-13  8:33                                               ` Douglas A. Gwyn
2003-05-13 14:18                                                 ` boyd, rounin
2003-05-19  9:46                                         ` boyd, rounin
2003-05-08 17:11                             ` Dan Cross
2003-05-08 17:24                               ` Russ Cox
2003-05-08 18:14                                 ` Dan Cross
2003-05-08 18:21                                   ` root
2003-05-08 18:33                                     ` William Ahern
2003-05-08 19:21                                       ` Dan Cross
2003-05-08 19:06                                     ` Dan Cross
2003-05-08 18:35                                   ` Joel Salomon
2003-05-08 18:40                                     ` Scott Schwartz
2003-05-08 19:03                                       ` Dan Cross
2003-05-08 19:52                                       ` rog
2003-05-08 22:50                                         ` Dan Cross
2003-05-09  2:55                                           ` rog
2003-05-09  0:12                                             ` Dan Cross
2003-05-08 18:40                                     ` Charles Forsyth
2003-05-09  8:36                               ` Douglas A. Gwyn
2003-05-08  6:45                           ` boyd, rounin
2003-05-14  8:57                           ` [9fans] exception handling caused the Ariane 5 rocket accident Anssi Porttikivi
2003-05-15  9:21                             ` Douglas A. Gwyn
2003-05-15 12:34                               ` Dan Cross
2003-05-15 10:35                             ` Mário Amado Alves
2003-05-15 10:47                               ` boyd, rounin
2003-05-15 11:29                                 ` Jim Choate
2003-05-15 11:42                                   ` boyd, rounin
2003-05-15 11:50                                     ` [9fans] " Jim Choate
2003-05-15 11:57                                       ` boyd, rounin
2003-05-15 17:03                                       ` northern snowfall
2003-05-08  6:41                         ` [9fans] same functions everywhere boyd, rounin
2003-05-02  6:08                   ` Taj Khattra
2003-05-02 11:07                 ` FJ Ballesteros
2003-05-07  4:44           ` Boyd Roberts
2003-05-07  4:21       ` Boyd Roberts
  -- strict thread matches above, loose matches on Subject: below --
2003-11-11  1:38 [9fans] POSIXy V7 sh Dennis Ritchie
2003-11-11  2:19 ` Geoff Collyer
2003-11-11  9:09 ` Richard Miller
2003-11-12 11:14 ` Boyd Roberts
2003-11-12 13:08   ` Douglas A. Gwyn
2003-11-12 19:55     ` Steve Kilbane
2003-08-16 22:03 [9fans] 4e sam for unix Scott Schwartz
2003-08-16 23:01 ` boyd, rounin
2003-08-17  9:56   ` Steve Kilbane
2003-07-11  2:01 [9fans] Fork: useless and painful? Andrew Simmons
2003-07-11  2:17 ` David Presotto
2003-07-11  2:29   ` boyd, rounin
     [not found]   ` <presotto@closedmind.org>
2003-05-10  0:13     ` [9fans] struct problems David Presotto
2003-05-10  0:22       ` Scott Schwartz
2003-05-10  4:49       ` Skip Tavakkolian
2003-05-10  4:52         ` boyd, rounin
2003-05-10  5:20           ` Skip Tavakkolian
2003-05-10  5:19             ` boyd, rounin
2003-05-10  7:11           ` Dennis Ritchie
2003-05-10 16:53             ` matt
2003-05-10 16:58               ` boyd, rounin
2003-05-10 16:58               ` boyd, rounin
2003-05-10 18:08                 ` northern snowfall
2003-05-10 17:12                   ` boyd, rounin
2003-05-10 22:34                   ` boyd, rounin
2003-05-10 23:09             ` jmk
2003-05-10 23:16               ` boyd, rounin
2003-05-11  2:07                 ` rob pike, esq.
2003-05-11  2:26                   ` boyd, rounin
2003-05-11  3:48                 ` Dennis Ritchie
2003-05-11  3:54                   ` boyd, rounin
2003-05-10 23:26               ` boyd, rounin
2003-05-11  2:06               ` rob pike, esq.
2003-05-10 23:54             ` Skip Tavakkolian
2003-05-11  2:08               ` rob pike, esq.
2003-05-11  2:31                 ` boyd, rounin
2003-05-11  6:04                   ` rob pike, esq.
2003-05-11  7:03                     ` boyd, rounin
2003-05-12  8:56           ` Anthony Mandic
2003-05-12  9:27             ` boyd, rounin
2003-07-13 19:44     ` [9fans] Fork: useless and painful? Andrew Lynch
2003-07-11  2:32 ` boyd, rounin
2003-07-11 10:59 ` matt
2003-06-25 20:36 [9fans] ipconfig dhcp vs ndb Scott Schwartz
2003-06-25 20:44 ` David Presotto
2003-06-25 20:50   ` Scott Schwartz
2003-08-06 17:01     ` David Presotto
2003-06-24 14:41 [9fans] mail problems Apurva Mehta
2003-06-24 15:24 ` Dan Cross
2003-06-24 16:34   ` Apurva Mehta
2003-06-25  0:13     ` Russ Cox
2003-06-25  9:21       ` Richard Miller, miller
2003-06-26  1:58         ` Russ Cox
2003-06-26  2:21           ` Scott Schwartz
2003-06-26  2:30             ` boyd, rounin
2003-06-26  2:36               ` Scott Schwartz
2003-06-26  2:44                 ` boyd, rounin
2003-06-26  3:07                   ` Scott Schwartz
2003-06-26  3:13                     ` boyd, rounin
2003-06-26  3:21                       ` Dan Cross
2003-06-26  3:32                         ` boyd, rounin
2003-06-26  3:35                           ` andrey mirtchovski
2003-06-26  3:41                             ` boyd, rounin
2003-06-26  4:03                               ` andrey mirtchovski
2003-06-26  5:15                           ` okamoto
2003-06-26 10:36                             ` boyd, rounin
2003-06-26  3:53                       ` Scott Schwartz
2003-06-26 11:12                         ` boyd, rounin
2003-06-26 13:17                           ` matt
2003-06-26 13:33                             ` boyd, rounin
2003-06-26 14:23                               ` matt
2003-06-26 14:35                                 ` boyd, rounin
2003-06-26 15:49                                 ` David Presotto
2003-06-26  8:29           ` Richard Miller, miller
2003-06-25 10:49       ` Apurva Mehta
2003-06-25  0:16 ` Russ Cox
2003-06-25 10:49   ` Apurva Mehta
2003-06-19  9:34 [9fans] The new ridiculous license Keith Nash
2003-06-19 13:51 ` boyd, rounin
2003-06-19 13:54   ` David Presotto
2003-06-19 14:09     ` boyd, rounin
2003-06-19 16:44   ` Erik Terpstra
2003-06-19 17:13     ` boyd, rounin
2003-06-19 17:35     ` Dan Cross
2003-06-19 17:52       ` boyd, rounin
2003-06-19 21:33         ` Jack Johnson
2003-06-20 14:05           ` Jason Gurtz
2003-06-20 14:08             ` Lucio De Re
2003-06-20 14:30               ` Jason Gurtz
2003-06-19 21:34         ` Jack Johnson
2003-06-19 23:19           ` Dan Cross
2003-06-20  1:52             ` George Michaelson
2003-06-20  2:32               ` Geoff Collyer
2003-06-20  2:40                 ` Geoff Collyer
2003-06-20  6:55                   ` Dan Cross
2003-06-20  2:56                 ` andrey mirtchovski
2003-06-20  2:43               ` Stephen Wynne
2003-06-20  6:54               ` Dan Cross
2003-06-20  7:05                 ` Dan Cross
2003-06-23  8:56                 ` Douglas A. Gwyn
2003-06-23 15:22                 ` rog
2003-06-20  8:20           ` John Murdie
2003-06-20 15:31             ` splite
2003-06-20 17:24               ` John Murdie
2003-06-19 17:51     ` David Presotto
2003-06-19 18:15       ` boyd, rounin
2003-06-19 20:14         ` ron minnich
2003-06-23  8:58           ` Douglas A. Gwyn
2003-06-20  5:01       ` Lucio De Re
2003-06-20 14:18         ` [9fans] " Jim Choate
2003-06-20 14:15           ` Lucio De Re
2003-06-20 16:44             ` Jim Choate
2003-06-20 17:06               ` Lucio De Re
2003-06-20 17:54                 ` Jim Choate
2003-06-20 18:39                   ` Stephen Wynne
2003-06-20 20:30                     ` Jim Choate
2003-06-20 19:22                   ` David Presotto
2003-06-20 19:38                     ` nehal
2003-06-20 19:38                     ` ron minnich
2003-06-20 18:57                       ` Sam
2003-06-20 20:50                         ` Jim Choate
2003-06-20 23:46                           ` Steve Arons
2003-06-21  1:16                             ` northern snowfall
2003-06-21  3:16                             ` Jack Johnson
2003-06-20 19:58                       ` Scott Schwartz
2003-06-21 10:42                       ` bwc
2003-06-21 14:00                         ` Jim Choate
2003-06-20 20:12                     ` Jason Gurtz
2003-06-20 20:46                     ` Jim Choate
2003-06-20 22:22                       ` Jon Snader
2003-06-21  0:45                         ` Tom Glinos
2003-06-21  9:16                       ` Markus Friedl
2003-06-21  9:29                         ` Lucio De Re
2003-06-21 13:56                         ` Jim Choate
2003-06-23  7:39                       ` Fco.J.Ballesteros
2003-06-20 20:48                     ` D. Brownlee
2003-06-22  3:10                     ` a
2003-06-22  3:33                       ` Christopher Nielsen
2003-06-22  4:41                         ` northern snowfall
2003-06-22 15:57                         ` Jon Snader
2003-06-22 22:13                           ` Dan Oglesby
2003-06-23  8:57                     ` Douglas A. Gwyn
2003-06-23  9:02                     ` bs
2003-06-23 11:22                       ` matt
2003-06-23 11:36                         ` boyd, rounin
2003-06-23  8:57                   ` Douglas A. Gwyn
2003-05-30 13:19 [9fans] BOF timing ron minnich
2003-05-30 15:13 ` Dan Cross
2003-05-30 15:18   ` David Presotto
2003-05-30 15:21     ` Dan Cross
2003-05-30 15:38   ` ron minnich
2003-05-30 15:52     ` Dan Cross
2003-05-30 15:58       ` ron minnich
2003-05-30 16:05         ` Scott Schwartz
2003-05-30 16:09           ` ron minnich
2003-05-30 16:33             ` [9fans] 9pm broken? Jack Johnson
2003-05-30 18:41             ` [9fans] BOF timing Dan Cross
2003-05-30 18:45               ` boyd, rounin
2003-05-30 18:52                 ` ron minnich
2003-05-30 22:57         ` Geoff Collyer
2003-05-30 23:16           ` boyd, rounin
2003-05-30 15:24 ` Jack Johnson
2003-05-29 11:09 [9fans] Mp3 Resources mp3
2003-05-29 11:17 ` boyd, rounin
2003-05-29 15:18   ` Scott Schwartz
2003-05-29 15:24     ` boyd, rounin
2003-05-29 16:05       ` Damian Gerow
2003-05-30 13:39         ` Anthony Mandic
2003-05-30 13:50           ` boyd, rounin
2003-05-30 15:02             ` rog
2003-05-30 15:09               ` boyd, rounin
2003-06-03 15:59                 ` rog
2003-05-30 15:19               ` Dan Cross
2003-05-30 15:24                 ` paurea
2003-05-30 18:53                 ` boyd, rounin
2003-05-30 18:57                   ` ron minnich
2003-05-30 19:01                     ` boyd, rounin
2003-05-29 16:14       ` Martin Harriss
2003-06-02 14:06     ` Robin KAY
2003-05-18  1:50 [9fans] suggestion: avoiding out of date binaries Fco.J.Ballesteros
2003-05-19  7:06 ` Russ Cox
2003-05-19  7:13   ` Fco.J.Ballesteros
2003-05-19  7:19     ` Russ Cox
2003-05-19  7:25       ` Fco.J.Ballesteros
2003-05-19  7:28         ` Geoff Collyer
2003-05-19  7:32           ` Fco.J.Ballesteros
2003-05-19  7:32         ` Russ Cox
2003-05-19  7:38           ` Fco.J.Ballesteros
2003-05-19  7:47             ` Geoff Collyer
2003-05-19  7:51               ` boyd, rounin
2003-05-19  8:36               ` Fco.J.Ballesteros
2003-05-19  7:55   ` Scott Schwartz
2003-05-19  8:01     ` Russ Cox
2003-05-19  8:38       ` Scott Schwartz
2003-05-19 12:48 ` Joel Salomon
2003-05-19 14:01   ` Fco.J.Ballesteros
2003-05-16 16:05 [9fans] Free Plan 9 "shell" accounts? Martin Kielhorn
2003-05-16 16:25 ` Andrew
2003-05-16 22:39 ` Geoff Collyer
2003-05-16 22:57   ` andrey mirtchovski
2003-05-17  0:04     ` northern snowfall
2003-05-16 23:50   ` northern snowfall
2003-05-16 23:59     ` northern snowfall
2003-05-17 19:21 ` Russ Cox
2003-05-19  2:54   ` [9fans] " Jim Choate
2003-05-19  3:00     ` Russ Cox
2003-05-19  3:44       ` [9fans] Latency Issues (was: Re: Free Plan 9 "shell" accounts?) Jim Choate
2003-05-19  3:49         ` Russ Cox
2003-05-19 12:44         ` Joel Salomon
2003-05-19  7:04     ` [9fans] Re: Free Plan 9 "shell" accounts? rob pike, esq.
2003-05-19  7:20       ` boyd, rounin
2003-05-18  5:13 ` Jim Choate
2003-05-18 13:05   ` Dan Cross
2003-05-18 13:43     ` Jim Choate
2003-05-18 14:17       ` Dan Cross
2003-05-18 14:26         ` Jim Choate
2003-05-18 14:36           ` andrey mirtchovski
2003-05-18 14:38           ` Dan Cross
2003-05-18 14:44             ` Jim Choate
2003-05-18 15:15               ` Dan Cross
2003-05-18 16:28                 ` Jim Choate
2003-05-18 18:34                   ` Dan Cross
2003-05-18 19:17                     ` boyd, rounin
2003-05-18 15:31               ` boyd, rounin
2003-05-18 16:29                 ` Jim Choate
2003-05-19  9:46                   ` boyd, rounin
2003-05-19  9:47                 ` Anthony Mandic
2003-05-19 10:22                   ` boyd, rounin
2003-05-19 12:24                     ` Anthony Mandic
2003-05-19 12:50                       ` boyd, rounin
2003-05-19 15:07                         ` Anthony Mandic
2003-05-20  3:31                           ` boyd, rounin
2003-05-20  3:34                             ` rob pike, esq.
2003-05-20  3:34                               ` Skip Tavakkolian
2003-05-20  3:38                               ` boyd, rounin
2003-05-20  5:33                               ` Jim Choate
2003-05-20 11:03                               ` Anthony Mandic
2003-05-20 12:30                                 ` matt
2003-05-20 12:34                                   ` boyd, rounin
2003-05-18 15:02         ` matt
2003-05-18 15:36           ` Dan Cross
2003-05-18 16:46             ` northern snowfall
2003-05-18 16:45               ` boyd, rounin
2003-05-18 18:42                 ` Reading lists (was: [9fans] Re: Free Plan 9 "shell" accounts?) Dan Cross
2003-05-18 19:11                   ` boyd, rounin
2003-05-19 22:09                 ` [9fans] Re: Free Plan 9 "shell" accounts? George Bronnikov
2003-05-20  4:20                   ` boyd, rounin
2003-05-19 13:06             ` Joel Salomon
2003-05-19 14:00               ` Fco.J.Ballesteros
2003-05-18 16:27           ` Jim Choate
2003-05-18 19:21           ` boyd, rounin
2003-05-18 19:25             ` Andrew
2003-05-18 19:35               ` boyd, rounin
2003-05-18 19:40                 ` boyd, rounin
2003-05-18 19:49                 ` Andrew
2003-05-18 19:55                   ` boyd, rounin
2003-05-18 19:59                     ` boyd, rounin
2003-05-18 21:49                       ` Dan Cross
2003-05-18 21:57                         ` boyd, rounin
2003-05-18 22:33                           ` Scott Schwartz
2003-05-18 22:39                             ` boyd, rounin
2003-05-18 22:44                             ` boyd, rounin
2003-05-18 23:13                               ` Scott Schwartz
2003-05-20  8:49                                 ` Adrian Tritschler
2003-05-21 16:40                                   ` Jason Gurtz
2003-05-21 16:48                                     ` boyd, rounin
2003-05-18 23:50                               ` northern snowfall
2003-05-18 22:55                                 ` boyd, rounin
2003-05-18 22:20                         ` boyd, rounin
2003-05-18 22:32                         ` [9fans] RFC822 & yacc boyd, rounin
2003-05-18 19:38               ` [9fans] Re: Free Plan 9 "shell" accounts? Dan Cross
2003-05-18 19:44                 ` boyd, rounin
2003-05-19 11:17                 ` SMTP stuff. Was: " Aharon Robbins
2003-05-19 12:19                   ` matt
2003-05-19 12:29                   ` boyd, rounin
2003-05-18 19:47               ` boyd, rounin
2003-05-18 15:27         ` boyd, rounin
2003-05-08 15:33 [9fans] design clairvoyance & the 9 way jmk
2003-05-08 15:41 ` David Presotto
2003-05-08 16:21   ` rog
2003-05-08 16:27     ` Russ Cox
2003-05-08 16:52       ` rog
2003-05-08 16:25   ` Russ Cox
2003-05-08 17:45     ` rog
2003-05-08 18:33       ` Russ Cox
2003-04-22 17:32 [9fans] ndb/local ron minnich
2003-04-22 17:37 ` David Presotto
2003-04-22 17:49   ` ron minnich
2003-04-22 17:52     ` David Presotto
2003-04-22 18:30       ` ron minnich
2003-04-22 18:30       ` ron minnich
2003-04-22 18:43         ` Russ Cox
2003-04-22 19:28         ` David Presotto
2003-04-22 19:41           ` andrey mirtchovski
2003-04-22 20:14             ` David Presotto
2003-04-22 20:27               ` Charles Forsyth
2003-04-22 20:35                 ` David Presotto
2003-04-22 20:59               ` ron minnich
2003-04-22 21:25                 ` Scott Schwartz
2003-04-22 21:32                   ` andrey mirtchovski
2003-04-22 21:51                   ` ron minnich
2003-04-22 20:36             ` Russ Cox
2003-04-22 20:16           ` Skip Tavakkolian
2003-04-22 20:23             ` Skip Tavakkolian
2003-04-22 21:06 ` FJ Ballesteros
2003-04-22 21:51   ` ron minnich
2003-04-22 22:40     ` David Presotto
2003-04-22 22:44       ` Scott Schwartz
2003-04-22 23:19         ` David Presotto
2003-04-22 23:02       ` Charles Forsyth
     [not found] <bd525c545ba7fe2d9c6641953a77c609@vitanuova.com>
2003-04-07 18:50 ` [9fans] fast compilers Theo de Raadt
2003-04-08  6:05   ` Dan Cross
2003-04-08  6:07     ` Dan Cross
2003-04-08  6:11     ` Scott Schwartz
2003-04-08  6:12       ` Charles Forsyth
2003-04-08 10:28         ` bwc
2003-04-08 10:46           ` Charles Forsyth
2003-04-08  6:14       ` Dan Cross
     [not found] <rminnich@lanl.gov>
2003-03-03 14:10 ` [9fans] clwalk on open directories Ronald G. Minnich
2003-03-03 17:36   ` Scott Schwartz
2003-03-03 17:39   ` Russ Cox
2003-03-10  4:53 ` [9fans] u9fs, Linux, large files no good Ronald G. Minnich
2003-03-10  5:59   ` Scott Schwartz
2003-03-10 14:42   ` Russ Cox
2003-03-10 14:52     ` Ronald G. Minnich
2003-02-23  7:35 [9fans] spam avoidance Scott Schwartz
2003-02-23 13:30 ` David Presotto
2003-02-23 18:24   ` Mike Haertel
2003-02-23 18:50     ` William Josephson
2003-02-23 18:54       ` Dan Cross
2003-02-23 18:56         ` David Presotto
2003-02-23 19:03           ` Dan Cross
2003-02-23 20:56           ` Jon Snader
2003-02-23 20:58             ` rob pike, esq.
2003-02-24  5:42               ` Dan Cross
2003-02-24  6:47                 ` rob pike, esq.
2003-02-24  6:53                   ` William Josephson
2003-02-24  2:28           ` Scott Schwartz
2003-02-24 10:05           ` Anthony Mandic
2003-03-17 10:10           ` Charles Shannon Hendrix
2003-03-17 16:04             ` Russ Cox
2003-02-23 19:02         ` Scott Schwartz
2003-02-24 10:04   ` Anthony Mandic
2003-02-13 20:00 [9fans] iSCSI matt
2003-02-13 20:08 ` Ronald G. Minnich
2003-02-13 20:13   ` David Presotto
2003-02-13 20:36     ` Christopher Nielsen
2003-02-13 20:28   ` Scott Schwartz
2003-02-14 18:12   ` Jonathan Sergent
2003-02-14 19:23     ` Ronald G. Minnich
2003-02-13 21:52 ` Dan Cross
2003-02-13 22:11   ` David Gordon Hogan
2003-02-13 22:14     ` Dan Cross
2003-02-13 22:15   ` Sam
2003-02-13 23:12     ` Dan Cross
2003-02-14  9:22     ` Richard Miller
2003-02-14 15:10       ` Ronald G. Minnich
2003-01-21  7:02 [9fans] rotzoomer -- another xscreensaver hack andrey mirtchovski
2003-01-21 10:17 ` geoff
2003-01-21 15:03   ` andrey mirtchovski
2003-01-21 21:49     ` geoff
2003-01-21 17:32 ` Russ Cox
2003-01-21 17:43   ` andrey mirtchovski
2003-01-21 17:55     ` Russ Cox
2003-01-21 18:42   ` Scott Schwartz
2003-01-21 18:55     ` Russ Cox
2003-01-21 19:07       ` [9fans] suspending screens (was: rotzoomer) andrey mirtchovski
2003-01-21 19:18         ` jmk
2003-01-21 19:00     ` [9fans] rotzoomer -- another xscreensaver hack rob pike, esq.
2002-11-14  8:53 [9fans] Serving 9p in python - anyone started that? Russ Cox
2002-11-14 17:05 ` Ronald G. Minnich
2002-11-14 18:24   ` Scott Schwartz
2002-10-24 17:54 [9fans] Essay: Is network transparency something bad? rog
2002-10-24 18:40 ` Scott Schwartz
2002-10-24 19:05   ` Ronald G Minnich
2002-10-24 19:25     ` Dan Cross
2002-10-24 19:32       ` Scott Schwartz
2002-10-25 13:10     ` Boyd Roberts
2002-10-24 22:09 ` Steve Kilbane
2002-10-28  6:57 ` [9fans] trying to reach FODEMESI Gergely
2002-01-22 18:28 [9fans] Getting started in Plan9 - help David Gordon Hogan
2002-01-23 10:04 ` Douglas A. Gwyn
2002-01-23 18:01   ` Thomas Bushnell, BSG
2002-01-23 18:19     ` Ronald G Minnich
2002-01-23 18:21       ` Scott Schwartz
2002-01-24  9:38       ` Thomas Bushnell, BSG
2002-01-23 18:46     ` Boyd Roberts
2002-01-24  9:38       ` Thomas Bushnell, BSG
2002-01-24 13:01         ` David Arnold
2002-01-24 17:35           ` Thomas Bushnell, BSG
2002-01-24 21:40             ` Dan Cross
2002-01-25 10:00               ` Thomas Bushnell, BSG
2002-01-25 22:56                 ` Dan Cross
2002-01-28 18:26                   ` Boyd Roberts
2002-01-29  9:31                     ` Douglas A. Gwyn
2002-01-29 10:44                       ` [OT] " paurea
2002-01-29 17:20                         ` Thomas Bushnell, BSG
2002-01-30  0:20                           ` [9fans] upas/fs -f/imap faltering start Matt H
2002-01-30  9:29                         ` [OT] Re: [9fans] Getting started in Plan9 - help Douglas A. Gwyn
2002-01-30 11:08                           ` paurea
2002-01-30 16:25                             ` Thomas Bushnell, BSG
2002-01-31  9:43                             ` Douglas A. Gwyn
2002-01-30 16:35                           ` Thomas Bushnell, BSG
2002-01-30 20:43                           ` Andrew Simmons
2002-01-30 22:44                             ` George Michaelson
2002-01-31  3:50                               ` [Ever more OT] " Andrew Simmons
2002-01-31  5:28                             ` [OT] " Douglas A. Gwyn
2002-01-31  5:37                               ` Lucio De Re
2002-01-31  9:43                                 ` Douglas A. Gwyn
2002-01-31 10:14                                   ` Lucio De Re
2002-02-01  9:57                                     ` Douglas A. Gwyn
2002-01-31 11:22                               ` Boyd Roberts
2002-01-31 11:53                                 ` [OT] Re: [9fans] Getting started in Plan9 - via physics Matt H
2002-01-31  6:10                             ` [OT] Re: [9fans] Getting started in Plan9 - help Douglas A. Gwyn
2002-01-31  9:35                               ` Thomas Bushnell, BSG
2002-02-01  9:57                                 ` Douglas A. Gwyn
2002-02-01 16:41                                   ` Thomas Bushnell, BSG
2002-02-03 19:55                                   ` [9fans] Cross products - longish & boring, but now officially on topic! Andrew Simmons
2002-01-31  9:35                           ` [OT] Re: [9fans] Getting started in Plan9 - help Thomas Bushnell, BSG
2002-01-24 16:05         ` Boyd Roberts
2002-01-24 17:34           ` Thomas Bushnell, BSG
2002-01-25 10:00     ` Douglas A. Gwyn
2002-01-23 10:48 ` Boyd Roberts
2002-01-23 18:01 ` Thomas Bushnell, BSG
2001-12-02  9:39 [9fans] python Russ Cox
2001-12-02 12:08 ` Boyd Roberts
2001-12-03 22:24 ` Laura Creighton
     [not found] ` <rsc@plan9.bell-labs.com>
2000-08-19 23:28   ` [9fans] Monitors and VGADB Russ Cox
2000-08-19 23:46     ` Matt
2000-08-19 23:48     ` Matt
2000-08-20  0:14     ` Scott Schwartz
2000-09-29  5:01   ` [9fans] Adding history to Rio's windows Russ Cox
2000-09-29  5:26     ` Scott Schwartz
2000-09-29 20:52     ` Boyd Roberts
2000-12-22  6:37   ` [9fans] scripting sam Russ Cox
2000-12-23  2:51     ` Scott Schwartz
2000-12-28  9:33   ` [9fans] stopping sleep and aux/listen Russ Cox
2000-12-28 22:41     ` Scott Schwartz
2001-01-03  0:51   ` [9fans] ML, CVS, Python Russ Cox
2001-01-03  1:29     ` sergent
2001-01-04  9:51       ` Randolph Fritz
2001-01-04 17:01         ` Scott Schwartz
2001-01-03 19:36     ` Dan Cross
2001-01-08  4:12   ` [9fans] python and lua Russ Cox
2001-01-08  4:43     ` [9fans] re: paging Scott Schwartz
2001-01-09 21:24       ` paurea
2001-09-05 21:11   ` [9fans] weird print(2) problems Russ Cox
2001-09-05 21:24     ` Scott Schwartz
2001-11-11 20:35   ` [9fans] pptp.c install failed Russ Cox
2001-11-11 21:17     ` Scott Schwartz
2001-11-11 23:25       ` Dan Cross
2001-11-12 11:42       ` Boyd Roberts
2001-11-12 18:13     ` William S .
2001-11-21  1:07   ` [9fans] on TCP vs IL Russ Cox
2001-11-21  1:21     ` George Michaelson
2001-11-21 20:01     ` Dan Cross
2001-11-22  2:21       ` Scott Schwartz
2001-11-22 22:17       ` Steve Kilbane
2001-11-23 10:58         ` Boyd Roberts
2001-11-24  5:32   ` [9fans] Nagle algorithm Russ Cox
2001-11-24 20:04     ` Scott Schwartz
2001-12-02 16:05   ` [9fans] python Jonathan Sergent
2002-01-16  3:44   ` [9fans] semaphores Russ Cox
2002-01-16  3:54     ` Scott Schwartz
2002-01-16 11:14       ` Boyd Roberts
2002-01-16 15:47       ` Ronald G Minnich
2002-01-25 10:30     ` Ralph Corderoy
2002-02-08  1:48   ` [9fans] how small can you get Russ Cox
2002-02-08  1:52     ` Scott Schwartz
2002-02-08 15:17     ` Ronald G Minnich
2002-03-12  4:24   ` [9fans] mkfile for Solaris-sparc using gcc? Russ Cox
2002-03-12  4:26     ` Scott Schwartz
2002-03-18 13:25       ` Boyd Roberts
2002-03-18 15:10         ` AMSRL-CI-CN
2002-03-12  4:59     ` Ish Rattan
2002-08-13  5:42   ` [9fans] Ephase question Russ Cox
2002-08-13  5:53     ` Scott Schwartz
2002-08-13  6:05     ` Ronald G Minnich
2002-08-13  6:22       ` Alexander Viro
2002-08-13  6:13     ` Alexander Viro
2002-10-08 15:58   ` [9fans] lp doesn't work after upgrade from downloaded cd image Russ Cox
2002-10-08 16:05     ` [9fans] bleeding edge sources John Saylor
2002-10-08 16:08     ` [9fans] lp doesn't work after upgrade from downloaded cd image Scott Schwartz
2002-10-22  5:21   ` [9fans] tex erratum Russ Cox
2002-10-22  5:25     ` Scott Schwartz
2002-11-14 17:33   ` [9fans] Serving 9p in python - anyone started that? Russ Cox
2002-11-14 18:28     ` Scott Schwartz
2002-11-14 18:46       ` matt
2002-11-14 19:19         ` Dan Cross
2002-11-14 19:00       ` William Josephson
     [not found] <cross@math.psu.edu>
2001-09-04 19:02 ` [9fans] weird print(2) problems Dan Cross
2001-09-04 19:08   ` Scott Schwartz
2001-09-05 14:22     ` Dan Cross
2001-09-05 19:01       ` Boyd Roberts
2002-08-25 19:28 ` [9fans] Quality of Plan 9's Cyrillic fonts? Dan Cross
2002-08-25 20:02   ` Scott Schwartz
2002-08-25 20:29   ` George Bronnikov
2002-08-26  5:23   ` Andrey S. Kukhar
2002-08-30 17:18     ` Dan Cross
2002-11-05 19:02 ` [9fans] Tunneling 9p over rfc822 encoded email/SMTP? Dan Cross
2002-11-06  0:02   ` Steve Kilbane
2002-11-06 10:29     ` Boyd Roberts
2001-08-22 14:22 [9fans] standalone cpu/auth server?? Russ Cox
2001-08-22 15:52 ` Ish Rattan
2001-08-22 17:19   ` Dan Cross
2001-08-22 18:58     ` Scott Schwartz
     [not found] <randolph@panix.com>
2001-01-02 17:39 ` [9fans] A Plan 9 Python Interest Group? Randolph Fritz
2001-01-02 21:10   ` Jonathan Sergent
2001-01-02 22:40     ` matt heath
2001-01-03  9:43     ` Randolph Fritz
2001-01-04  4:09       ` arisawa
2001-01-05  3:39   ` [9fans] python and lua Quinn Dunkan
2001-01-05  2:50     ` arisawa
2001-01-06 15:41   ` [9fans] A question of temperature Jim Choate
2001-01-06 16:07     ` Boyd Roberts
2001-01-06 16:53       ` [9fans] " Jim Choate
2001-01-06 16:45         ` Boyd Roberts
2001-01-09  9:38     ` [9fans] " Douglas A. Gwyn
     [not found]   ` <Pine.LNX.3.96.1010106092045.25692V-100000@einstein.ssz.com >
2001-01-06 19:07     ` Fariborz 'Skip' Tavakkolian
2001-01-06 19:29       ` [9fans] " Jim Choate
2001-01-08 19:42         ` Dan Cross
2001-01-08 23:16           ` Jim Choate
2001-01-09  0:15             ` Dan Cross
2001-01-09  0:52               ` Jim Choate
2001-01-09  9:21             ` matt heath
2001-01-09  9:48               ` Boyd Roberts
2001-01-09 18:42                 ` Dan Cross
2001-01-09 21:42                 ` Boyd Roberts
2001-01-09  9:39           ` Andy Newman
2000-12-15 10:13 [9fans] not just 3-button mice Douglas A. Gwyn
2000-12-15 13:06 ` Christopher Nielsen
     [not found] ` <DAGwyn@null.net>
2000-12-15 17:03   ` Tom Duff
2000-12-16 13:22     ` Boyd Roberts

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