[9fans] Help downloading Plan B using hget

[9fans] Help downloading Plan B using hget

[Nolan Hamilton]

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Hello, I am a newcomer to plan 9.  I current have Plan9 installed on my
computer, and am trying to get Plan B.
I use "hget http://lsub.org/ls/export/planb4e.tgz"
I just get a whole bunch of letters and numbers.
Is this OK, or is there a problem becouse it keeps on doing this for a very
long time.
Also, once I have finished that, how do I save it to $home.

-Nolan Hamilton

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Re: [9fans] Help downloading Plan B using hget

[michael block]

On Fri, Nov 14, 2008 at 13:50, Nolan Hamilton
<nolan.h.hamilton@gmail.com> wrote:
> Hello, I am a newcomer to plan 9.  I current have Plan9 installed on my
> computer, and am trying to get Plan B.
> I use "hget http://lsub.org/ls/export/planb4e.tgz"
> I just get a whole bunch of letters and numbers.
> Is this OK, or is there a problem becouse it keeps on doing this for a very
> long time.
> Also, once I have finished that, how do I save it to $home.
>
> -Nolan Hamilton

try "hget http://lsub.org/ls/export/planb4e.tgz > /usr/asdfjkl/planb4e.tgz"

-- m

Re: [9fans] Help downloading Plan B using hget

[Robert Raschke]

hget -o $home/planb4e.tgz http://lsub.org/ls/export/planb4e.tgz

The man pages with Plan 9 are really good. Well worth a read.

Robby

Re: [9fans] Help downloading Plan B using hget

[Pietro Gagliardi]

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hget is different from most other programs of its kind. It writes the
file you ask for on standard output, or the computer screen. If you
want to download a file, use one of the following:

	hget -o planb4e.tgz http://lsub.org/ls/export/planb4e.tgz
	hget http://lsub.org/ls/export/planb4e.tgz > planb4e.tgz

On Nov 14, 2008, at 2:50 PM, Nolan Hamilton wrote:

> Hello, I am a newcomer to plan 9.  I current have Plan9 installed on
> my computer, and am trying to get Plan B.
> I use "hget http://lsub.org/ls/export/planb4e.tgz"
> I just get a whole bunch of letters and numbers.
> Is this OK, or is there a problem becouse it keeps on doing this for
> a very long time.
> Also, once I have finished that, how do I save it to $home.
>
> -Nolan Hamilton


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Re: [9fans] Help downloading Plan B using hget

[Pietro Gagliardi]

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On Nov 14, 2008, at 2:50 PM, Nolan Hamilton wrote:

> I just get a whole bunch of letters and numbers.

tgz is a compression format that uses binary data. The conversion of
binary to Unicode is why you see the numbers.

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Re: [9fans] Help downloading Plan B using hget

[Russ Cox]

> hget is different from most other programs of its kind.

depends what you mean by "its kind".
hget is similar to almost all plan 9 programs
and (not surprisingly) different from many
modern unix programs in that, by default,
it writes to standard output.

russ

Re: [9fans] Help downloading Plan B using hget

[Pietro Gagliardi]

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On Nov 14, 2008, at 4:26 PM, Russ Cox wrote:

>> hget is different from most other programs of its kind.
>
> depends what you mean by "its kind".

command line download tool; I'm comparing it to programs like wget,
curl, etc.

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Re: [9fans] Help downloading Plan B using hget

[ron minnich]

On Fri, Nov 14, 2008 at 1:31 PM, Pietro Gagliardi <pietro10@mac.com> wrote:
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> On Nov 14, 2008, at 4:26 PM, Russ Cox wrote:
>
>>> hget is different from most other programs of its kind.
>>
>> depends what you mean by "its kind".
>
> command line download tool; I'm comparing it to programs like wget, curl,
> etc.
>

as Russ points out, those programs are a lot less like the original
Unix than hget. Long ago, many programs that produced output went to
stdout.

GNU tools nowadays remind me of the kind of 60s-ish programs Kernighan
used to make fun of in .... 1976 ... when he gave talks about Unix.
Plan 9 tools remind of the kind of programs Kernighan used to talk
nicely about in .... 1976 ... when he gave talks about Unix.

ah well.

Nurse! Bring my bib! And fetch my walker! I'm done here.

ron

Re: [9fans] Help downloading Plan B using hget

[Dave Eckhardt]

> hget is similar to almost all plan 9 programs
> and (not surprisingly) different from many
> modern unix programs in that, by default,
> it writes to standard output.

This may seem idiosyncratic, but it has a big benefit.

On various machines I have wget, curl, fetch, etc., and
each one has a different policy for where it puts its
output--some of them "helpfully" choose a semi-predictable
filename instead of overwriting an existing file, which is
almost always anti-helpful, because I'm generally *trying*
to overwrite the (obsolete) existing file with the new bits.
Each one helpfully provides a "no, really, name the file
this: ____" flag which will allow me to manually tell it to
put the bits where it supposedly automatically puts them,
BUT EACH ONE USES A DIFFERENT LETTER FOR THIS FUNCTION.  Is
it wget where it's -o and curl where it's -O, or the other
way around?  Whee!

In sharp contrast, the "option letter" for sending stdout to
somewhere is always the same: '>'.  By having this one feature
in the shell and *not* having it in every other program, life
is improved despite there being fewer lines of code.  How odd.

Dave Eckhardt

Re: [9fans] Help downloading Plan B using hget

[Pietro Gagliardi]

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On Nov 14, 2008, at 6:21 PM, Dave Eckhardt wrote:

> commentary

This is because those programs use stdout for status indication, much
like hget -v. Think of wget, which is forced to use a terminal in
order to make a progress bar.

The idea is simple, and I'd like to go into more detail: the modern
UNIX programmers want to make it easier for a more general public to
use it, even at the risk of losing what UNIX was originally intended
to. Ergo, we are more like UNIX than GNU or BSD is.

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Re: [9fans] Help downloading Plan B using hget

[Uriel]

I wonder why was stderr invented...

uriel

On Sat, Nov 15, 2008 at 12:30 AM, Pietro Gagliardi <pietro10@mac.com> wrote:
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> On Nov 14, 2008, at 6:21 PM, Dave Eckhardt wrote:
>
>> commentary
>
> This is because those programs use stdout for status indication, much like
> hget -v. Think of wget, which is forced to use a terminal in order to make a
> progress bar.
>
> The idea is simple, and I'd like to go into more detail: the modern UNIX
> programmers want to make it easier for a more general public to use it, even
> at the risk of losing what UNIX was originally intended to. Ergo, we are
> more like UNIX than GNU or BSD is.
>
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>

Re: [9fans] Help downloading Plan B using hget

[Pietro Gagliardi]

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On Nov 14, 2008, at 6:46 PM, Uriel wrote:

> I wonder why was stderr invented...
>
> uriel

Oh yes, that's also something I can explain. Some programmers use the
definitions literally: "stderr is not used for a progress bar, make
stdprog."

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Re: [9fans] Help downloading Plan B using hget

[Gorka Guardiola]

On Sat, Nov 15, 2008 at 12:21 AM, Dave Eckhardt <davide+p9@cs.cmu.edu> wrote:
>> hget is similar to almost all plan 9 programs
>> and (not surprisingly) different from many
>> modern unix programs in that, by default,
>> it writes to standard output.
>
> This may seem idiosyncratic, but it has a big benefit.
>
> On various machines I have wget, curl, fetch, etc., and

Not completely true. Curl works as expected, I use it regularly.

curl http://lsub.org > b.html
  % Total    % Received % Xferd  Average Speed   Time    Time     Time  Current
                                 Dload  Upload   Total   Spent    Left  Speed
100  6623  100  6623    0     0  20232      0 --:--:-- --:--:-- --:--:-- 41393
mymachine:/tmp paurea$ cat b.html
<html>
<head>
etc...
--
- curiosity sKilled the cat

Re: [9fans] Help downloading Plan B using hget

[Uriel]

Maybe those programmers should learn a bit more about the system they
are working with before making such presumptions... but then, since
the days of Berkeley kids mixing LSD with cat's flags, seems that all
regard for the unix style has been forgotten in the race to add more
'features' and implement more standards.

uriel

On Sat, Nov 15, 2008 at 12:51 AM, Pietro Gagliardi <pietro10@mac.com> wrote:
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>
> On Nov 14, 2008, at 6:46 PM, Uriel wrote:
>
>> I wonder why was stderr invented...
>>
>> uriel
>
> Oh yes, that's also something I can explain. Some programmers use the
> definitions literally: "stderr is not used for a progress bar, make
> stdprog."
>
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[9fans] Thank you (was Re: Help downloading Plan B using hget)

[Pietro Gagliardi]

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In a short few hours I have learned to appreciate Plan 9 more.

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Re: [9fans] Help downloading Plan B using hget

[Nolan Hamilton]

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Thanks I can use hget now, everything works fine.-Nolan Hamilton

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