[9fans] Proposed Aid for the nearly blind

[9fans] Proposed Aid for the nearly blind

[west9]

As an aide to the nearly blind, I would like to design and build a Plan9 or Inferno based system that presents text one word at a time in the center of the screen in a font perhaps 25mm high. The progress of the text would be controlled by keyboard entries in the style of vi.

I am motivated to try this by having observed an elderly physician with macular degeneration use a commercial pc application that presented enlarged text as a crawler under mouse control. He was very challenged, and it seemed to me that the computer should be doing more work.

The scheme of presenting text one word at a time comes, I think, from research into computeraided speed reading at Bell Labs in the 1960's, at least that's where I remember seeing it. It was found that reading was fastest if the sequentially presented words were sized to occupy a fixed area in the center of the screen

If someone could sketch out the software development that would be required to test out this idea, I'd be much obliged.

-Tom

Re: [9fans] Proposed Aid for the nearly blind

[Donald Brownlee]

Saw part of a program (KCET?) last night about
Marriot Hotels' reservation center employing
many visually impaired people. They use
software that converts text to speech.
This method permits completely blind
people to work.

west9@worldnet.att.net wrote:
> As an aide to the nearly blind, I would like to design and build a Plan9 or Inferno based system that presents text one word at a time in the center of the screen in a font perhaps 25mm high. The progress of the text would be controlled by keyboard entries in the style of vi.
>
> I am motivated to try this by having observed an elderly physician with macular degeneration use a commercial pc application that presented enlarged text as a crawler under mouse control. He was very challenged, and it seemed to me that the computer should be doing more work.
>
> The scheme of presenting text one word at a time comes, I think, from research into computeraided speed reading at Bell Labs in the 1960's, at least that's where I remember seeing it. It was found that reading was fastest if the sequentially presented words were sized to occupy a fixed area in the center of the screen
>
> If someone could sketch out the software development that would be required to test out this idea, I'd be much obliged.
>
> -Tom
>

[9fans] Re: Proposed Aid for the nearly blind

[Jim Choate]

Hi,

I invite any and all to participate in the BHC SIG, even if they don't
want to 'join' H18 (whatever that might mean). We are finishing up an article
now that we hope to have published in the next 3-4 months. It is focused
on what we call 'Blind Robotics'.

I also just got off the phone with the folks at COMMON who are putting on
a conference in San Antonio (I'm in Austin) in several months. One of the
things we're hoping to do (and it looks like a 'Go' at this time) is a
talk on BHC and Open Sources to the folks at IBM. COMMON is an IBM user
group and they're going to talk about Linux and other Open Source
solutions.

I am willing to provide development resources to any project based around
Open Source, not just Linux or Plan 9, which is focused on this sort of
thing. What I would ask is that you join the hangar18-general and the
bhc-main lists so that you can help build the community.

On Wed, 28 Jan 2004, Donald Brownlee wrote:

> Saw part of a program (KCET?) last night about
> Marriot Hotels' reservation center employing
> many visually impaired people. They use
> software that converts text to speech.
> This method permits completely blind
> people to work.
>
> west9@worldnet.att.net wrote:
> > As an aide to the nearly blind, I would like to design and build a Plan9 or Inferno based system that presents text one word at a time in the center of the screen in a font perhaps 25mm high. The progress of the text would be controlled by keyboard entries in the style of vi.
> >
> > I am motivated to try this by having observed an elderly physician with macular degeneration use a commercial pc application that presented enlarged text as a crawler under mouse control. He was very challenged, and it seemed to me that the computer should be doing more work.
> >
> > The scheme of presenting text one word at a time comes, I think, from research into computeraided speed reading at Bell Labs in the 1960's, at least that's where I remember seeing it. It was found that reading was fastest if the sequentially presented words were sized to occupy a fixed area in the center of the screen
> >
> > If someone could sketch out the software development that would be required to test out this idea, I'd be much obliged.
> >
> > -Tom
> >
>
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Re: [9fans] Re: Proposed Aid for the nearly blind

[boyd, rounin]

> It is focused on what we call 'Blind Robotics'.

not blind drunk?  steers and queers ...

Re: [9fans] Proposed Aid for the nearly blind

[Douglas A. Gwyn]

Donald Brownlee wrote:
> They use software that converts text to speech.

At Geotronics we had a blind programmer and tried out
many of the available aids, including text-to-speech.
It wasn't very useful when applied to C source text!
There is also a fingertip pin array that tracks a
scanner, allowing the operator to "feel" contrasty
shapes.  That was useful for examining plots but not
very good for text.
The best text aid we found was a VersaBraille
terminal, which had a ticker-tape-like scrolling
Braille display and chording Braille keyboard.  It
was very handy that the Unix terminal driver had
decent support for monocase devices (think Teletype
model 33), flagging uppercase output with \ prefix.

Re: [9fans] Proposed Aid for the nearly blind

[Martin C.Atkins]

On Thu, 29 Jan 2004 10:45:45 GMT "Douglas A. Gwyn" <DAGwyn@null.net> wrote:
> The best text aid we found was a VersaBraille
> terminal, which had a ticker-tape-like scrolling
> Braille display and chording Braille keyboard.  It
> was very handy that the Unix terminal driver had
> decent support for monocase devices (think Teletype
> model 33), flagging uppercase output with \ prefix.

I've also helped a student who used a VersaBraille.
It was very good, and I thought rather more successful
than speech synthesis, since it allows some degree
of 'random access' to the 'screen'.

It could also be used independently of the computer,
as a sort of dictation machine - great, except that
the tapes it used for storage were not that wonderful.

The main disadvantages were that the braille display
was very small, and it was horrendously expensive!

Martin
--
Martin C. Atkins			martin@parvat.com
Parvat Infotech Private Limited		http://www.parvat.com{/,/martin}

Re: [9fans] Proposed Aid for the nearly blind

[Douglas A. Gwyn]

Martin C.Atkins wrote:
> I've also helped a student who used a VersaBraille.
> It was very good, and I thought rather more successful
> than speech synthesis, since it allows some degree
> of 'random access' to the 'screen'.

Note that the trend to WYSIWYG editors and GUIs is
very disabling to the blind.  At least under Unix one
has "ed" (or "ex" or "sam -d" or whatever) and full
access to a sequential text-mode command interface.

Re: [9fans] Proposed Aid for the nearly blind

[Jim Choate]

On Thu, 29 Jan 2004, Douglas A. Gwyn wrote:

> Note that the trend to WYSIWYG editors and GUIs is
> very disabling to the blind.  At least under Unix one
> has "ed" (or "ex" or "sam -d" or whatever) and full
> access to a sequential text-mode command interface.

My personal view is that the focus on GUI's as the default interface for
OS'es has set back the technology at least 20 years. Had we not gotten
sidetrackes I'm convinced computers would be doing a lot more than they
are today. GUI's make real automation harder than it needs to be because
the focus is on GUI support and not process execution.

Just another example of the evils of the least common denominator approach.

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James Choate  512-451-7087  ravage@ssz.com  jchoate@open-forge.com

Re: [9fans] Proposed Aid for the nearly blind

[Michael H. Collins]

I have used emacspeak for years.

http://emacspeak.sourceforge.net/

http://www.teledyn.com/help/linux/Emacspeak/

Jim Choate wrote:
> On Thu, 29 Jan 2004, Douglas A. Gwyn wrote:
>
>
>>Note that the trend to WYSIWYG editors and GUIs is
>>very disabling to the blind.  At least under Unix one
>>has "ed" (or "ex" or "sam -d" or whatever) and full
>>access to a sequential text-mode command interface.
>
>
> My personal view is that the focus on GUI's as the default interface for
> OS'es has set back the technology at least 20 years. Had we not gotten
> sidetrackes I'm convinced computers would be doing a lot more than they
> are today. GUI's make real automation harder than it needs to be because
> the focus is on GUI support and not process execution.
>
> Just another example of the evils of the least common denominator approach.
>
>  -- --
>
> Open Forge, LLC  24/365 Onsite Support for PCs, Networks, & Game Consoles
> 512-695-4126 (Austin, Tx.)  help@open-forge.com  irc.open-forge.com
>
> Hangar 18  Open Source Distributed Computing Using Plan 9 & Linux
> 512-451-7087  http://open-forge.org/hangar18  irc.open-forge.org
>
> James Choate  512-451-7087  ravage@ssz.com  jchoate@open-forge.com
>
>
>

--
Michael H. Collins  Admiral, Penguinista Navy
http://linuxlink.com

http://www.gracklenews.com/

Re: [9fans] Proposed Aid for the nearly blind

[Jim Choate]

On Thu, 29 Jan 2004, Michael H. Collins wrote:

> I have used emacspeak for years.
>
> http://emacspeak.sourceforge.net/
>
> http://www.teledyn.com/help/linux/Emacspeak/

Old Amigas have it over just about every other solution with respect to
speech since it's built into the OS (ie say "Hello Ravage"). I still use a
A2000 GVP 030 Video Toaster for 'reading' text files when I need/want voice
output. The actual voice mechanics are less than easy but the defaults are
usable. Couple this with ARexx and the various Rexx ports (not ports as in
other apps but a app control/data xfer interface) in the apps (again both
expected) and it makes it possible to blue apps together I've never seen
in another OS before or since.

To each their own.

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Open Forge, LLC  24/365 Onsite Support for PCs, Networks, & Game Consoles
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James Choate  512-451-7087  ravage@ssz.com  jchoate@open-forge.com

Re: [9fans] Proposed Aid for the nearly blind

[Michael H. Collins]

Right now i use speechd in linux. I creates a /dev/speech and anything
piped to it gets spoken.

Jim Choate wrote:
> On Thu, 29 Jan 2004, Michael H. Collins wrote:
>
>
>>I have used emacspeak for years.
>>
>>http://emacspeak.sourceforge.net/
>>
>>http://www.teledyn.com/help/linux/Emacspeak/
>
>
> Old Amigas have it over just about every other solution with respect to
> speech since it's built into the OS (ie say "Hello Ravage"). I still use a
> A2000 GVP 030 Video Toaster for 'reading' text files when I need/want voice
> output. The actual voice mechanics are less than easy but the defaults are
> usable. Couple this with ARexx and the various Rexx ports (not ports as in
> other apps but a app control/data xfer interface) in the apps (again both
> expected) and it makes it possible to blue apps together I've never seen
> in another OS before or since.
>
> To each their own.
>
>  -- --
>
> Open Forge, LLC  24/365 Onsite Support for PCs, Networks, & Game Consoles
> 512-695-4126 (Austin, Tx.)  help@open-forge.com  irc.open-forge.com
>
> Hangar 18  Open Source Distributed Computing Using Plan 9 & Linux
> 512-451-7087  http://open-forge.org/hangar18  irc.open-forge.org
>
> James Choate  512-451-7087  ravage@ssz.com  jchoate@open-forge.com
>
>
>

--
Michael H. Collins  Admiral, Penguinista Navy
http://linuxlink.com

http://www.gracklenews.com/

Re: [9fans] Proposed Aid for the nearly blind

[boyd, rounin]

> My personal view is that the focus on GUI's as the default interface for
> OS'es has set back the technology at least 20 years.

that is probably the most stupid thing i've ever heard.

20 years ago we had the blit and it was a fine thing.

hell, it goes back to PARC.

Re: [9fans] Proposed Aid for the nearly blind

[Jim Choate]

On Thu, 29 Jan 2004, Douglas A. Gwyn wrote:

> Donald Brownlee wrote:
> > They use software that converts text to speech.
>
> At Geotronics we had a blind programmer and tried out

Was that the Geotronics in Austin (ie magneto-tellurics)?

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Re: [9fans] Proposed Aid for the nearly blind

[Douglas A. Gwyn]

Jim Choate wrote:
> Was that the Geotronics in Austin (ie magneto-tellurics)?

Yes, later Advanced Energy Assocs. or something of the sort.

Re: [9fans] Proposed Aid for the nearly blind

[Jim Choate]

On Thu, 29 Jan 2004, Douglas A. Gwyn wrote:

> Jim Choate wrote:
> > Was that the Geotronics in Austin (ie magneto-tellurics)?
>
> Yes, later Advanced Energy Assocs. or something of the sort.

Hmmm, we may have met. I worked as a field tech for one year in like '82
or maybe into '83. They used the Austron 1210 series of equipment I worked
on for a couple of years prior to that.

Life is strange.

TTYL.

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Re: [9fans] Proposed Aid for the nearly blind

[Douglas A. Gwyn]

Jim Choate wrote:
> On Thu, 29 Jan 2004, Douglas A. Gwyn wrote:
>>Jim Choate wrote:
>>>Was that the Geotronics in Austin (ie magneto-tellurics)?
>>Yes, later Advanced Energy Assocs. or something of the sort.

Advanced Energy Systems, now that I have thought more..

> Hmmm, we may have met. I worked as a field tech for one year in like '82
> or maybe into '83. They used the Austron 1210 series of equipment I worked
> on for a couple of years prior to that.

I worked there from around 1980 to 1983, mainly leading the
software part of the PROMT system development.  The PDP-11/34
Unix system was largely my doing, and the VAX-11/780 was
brought in just after I left.  I did drop in on a later
trip to Austin to discuss a problem with the impedance error
estimates, my fault really since as an expedient I'd divided
the error evenly between real and imaginary parts without
giving it enough thought.

I still think that LSI-11/23 real-time data acquisition and
processing system, with a modified 6th Edition Unix kernel,
was really slick.  John Quarterman (later of The Matrix fame,
the book not the movie) was instrumental in devising the
buffer scheme that really made it work; I did the scheduler.

> Life is strange.

And sometimes interesting.

Re: [9fans] Proposed Aid for the nearly blind

[Jack Johnson]

I've always thought it would be rewarding to write software for the
blind.

Part of it is the challenge.  Talk about a shift in thinking for user
interface (what the hell do you do with a mouse?).  The other is
pondering what would actually be useful, and how I might (or might not)
adapt if it were ever to happen to me.

Knock on wood.

-Jack

On Jan 29, 2004, at 2:45 AM, Douglas A. Gwyn wrote:

> Donald Brownlee wrote:
>> They use software that converts text to speech.
>
> At Geotronics we had a blind programmer and tried out
> many of the available aids, including text-to-speech.
> It wasn't very useful when applied to C source text!
> There is also a fingertip pin array that tracks a
> scanner, allowing the operator to "feel" contrasty
> shapes.  That was useful for examining plots but not
> very good for text.
> The best text aid we found was a VersaBraille
> terminal, which had a ticker-tape-like scrolling
> Braille display and chording Braille keyboard.  It
> was very handy that the Unix terminal driver had
> decent support for monocase devices (think Teletype
> model 33), flagging uppercase output with \ prefix.

Re: [9fans] Proposed Aid for the nearly blind

[boyd, rounin]

> As an aide to the nearly blind, I would like to design and build a Plan9
or Inferno based system that presents text one word at a time in the center
of the screen in a font perhaps 25mm high. The progress of the text would be
controlled by keyboard entries in the style of vi.

25mm == ~72 point. i'd check out T9 input, which i _think_ uses bi-gram
frequencies.