[9fans] VMWare

[9fans] VMWare

[Skip Tavakkolian]

FYI, after successfully running Plan9 under VMWare 4.0.0.44 for a while,
I had no luck booting with 4.0.2.45 (the latest).   I didn't spend time
on it, before I reverted to an earlier version, but I noticed something about
invalid "SVGA: IOSpace" address in the vmware log (debug on).

Re: [9fans] vmware

[geerten kuiper]

wrt full screen mode: when I select it from the vmware menu nothing seems
to happen, but if I subsequently switch to the next screen (Ctrl-Alt-F8)
it's there just fine.

[9fans] vmware

[Russ Cox]

The VMware saga continues.

I think I've gotten the video driver fixed so that
it will work correctly under XFree86, in depths other
than 16-bit, and in sizes other than the full size of
the screen.

Full screen mode still appears not to work in Linux.
I'm not sure why, but that's not as much of a showstopper
to me.

There's a new mouse test floppy at
http://plan9.bell-labs.com/~rsc/mousetest.gz.

If the people who reported the previous one failing
could try this one and let me know if it works, I'd
greatly appreciate it.

Thanks.
Russ

Re: [9fans] VMware

[Danielo Parisien]

I use a Trial Version of Virtual PC for Windows,
they emulate a tulip ethernet card, a S3 Trio derivate,
a SoundBlaster 16 - so its enough for Plan 9.




--
Posted from pd952af59.dip.t-dialin.net [217.82.175.89]
via Mailgate.ORG Server - http://www.Mailgate.ORG

Re: [9fans] VMware

[Paul Taysom]

Virtual PC can be hosted on Windows.  They also have a version the works
on Macs.
Paul Taysom

>>> paurea@dei.inf.uc3m.es 12/18/01 08:14AM >>>
Danielo Parisien writes:
 > No I tried Connectix VirtualPC. I downloaded a bootdisk
 > from the distribution page and rio worked. I did only
 > add an entry like:

VirtualPC doesn't work with Linux or Windows as host does it?

--
                 Saludos,
                         Gorka

"Curiosity sKilled the cat"

Re: [9fans] VMware

[paurea]

Danielo Parisien writes:
 > No I tried Connectix VirtualPC. I downloaded a bootdisk
 > from the distribution page and rio worked. I did only
 > add an entry like:

VirtualPC doesn't work with Linux or Windows as host does it?

--
                 Saludos,
                         Gorka

"Curiosity sKilled the cat"

[9fans] VMware

[Danielo Parisien]

I tried several times to boot Plan 9 on Emulators.
Graphic did nether work on VMware and not on BOCHS.
No I tried Connectix VirtualPC. I downloaded a bootdisk
from the distribution page and rio worked. I did only
add an entry like:

ctlr
 0xC0000=""
 link=vga
 hwgc=s3hwgc
 ctlr=virge

to /lib/vgadb

Hopefully the network and sound will also work. Then I will
never have to cope with my unsupported S3 Virge/MX+ again.

[9fans] vmware

[vic]

More on vmware: I cannot get any plan 9 kernel to boot reliably under
vmware except for the one in 9disk.9fd from the distribution webpage.
This includes the kernel installed with the current distribution and
every kernel I build on my other plan 9 machine (sources are several
months old, no updates).

The boot hangs after these lines:
x free pages
y bytes
z swap

I've had no luck with suggestions made in previous 9fans reports of
similar behavior, including:

- disabling hardware specs (ether, vgasize, monitor, audio) in
  plan9.ini
- extra printing in /sys/src/9/pc/main.c before it calls the
  scheduler.  (north_'s recent solution to similar 486 hangs.)

Sometimes the boot is successful if I press keys while it is booting.
I have not mastered this monkey business.  Sometimes it makes vmware
crash.

I am slowly tracing the boot to the hang.  Processes with pids 1 and 2
are scheduled a couple times each (I think), and then nothing is
scheduled.  I think I have sysexec() rigged to print something on
entry, but I never see it -- is that not inconsistent with the
existence of pid 2?  (The sysexec printing appears when I boot these
kernels on actual computers, though I'm not sure when.)

Anyhoo, suggestions would be appreciated.

Thanks,
Vic

Re: [9fans] vmware

[vic]

The host is linux.

Re: [9fans] vmware

[Russ Cox]

The problem isn't anything in your vmware configuration.
Plan 9 just runs slowly under vmware, and I haven't tracked
down all the reasons, although I did find one of them (we
use RDMSR 0x10 instead of RDTSC to read the time stamp
counter, and under vmware the former is virtualized while
the latter can just go through to the processor).

Russ

Re: [9fans] vmware

[paurea]

vic writes:
 > 256MB.  The plan 9 vm is configured for 96MB.  The machine has a
 > 700MHz PIII.  Windows and Linux hum along nicely in vmware.
 >

That seems enough for me. Which is the host operating system?.
Verify you don't have any interrupt problems. Disconnect al (virtual) devices
like parallel ports and such and see if anything goes better.
--
                 Saludos,
                         Gorka

"Curiosity sKilled the cat"

Re: [9fans] vmware

[nigel]

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I expect rsc might expand on this, but there are some Pentium functions
which are not efficiently emulated by Vmware, which Plan 9 happens to
use a lot. This will make some contribution to the slowdown.


[-- Attachment #2: Type: message/rfc822, Size: 1749 bytes --]

From: vic <zandy@cs.wisc.edu>
To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu
Subject: Re: [9fans] vmware
Date: Mon, 3 Dec 2001 10:08:26 GMT
Message-ID: <m38zcn3aex.fsf@localhost.localdomain>

256MB.  The plan 9 vm is configured for 96MB.  The machine has a
700MHz PIII.  Windows and Linux hum along nicely in vmware.

paurea@dei.inf.uc3m.es writes:
> How much memory do you have?. I have found running other os's under
> vmware that there is a high memory threshold under which the system
> is too slow to be usable.

Re: [9fans] vmware

[vic]

256MB.  The plan 9 vm is configured for 96MB.  The machine has a
700MHz PIII.  Windows and Linux hum along nicely in vmware.

paurea@dei.inf.uc3m.es writes:
> How much memory do you have?. I have found running other os's under
> vmware that there is a high memory threshold under which the system
> is too slow to be usable.

Re: [9fans] vmware

[paurea]

vic writes:
 > I've been playing with (rioless) Plan 9 under vmware.  It executes
 > very slowly.  For example, the unpack script echoes about one line per
 > second.  I'm using vmware workstation 3.0, the current Plan 9
 > distribution, and virtual IDE disks.
 >
 > Anyone know what's going on?

How much memory do you have?. I have found running other os's under
vmware that there is a high memory threshold under which the system is too slow
to be usable.
--
                 Saludos,
                         Gorka

"Curiosity sKilled the cat"

[9fans] vmware

[vic]

I've been playing with (rioless) Plan 9 under vmware.  It executes
very slowly.  For example, the unpack script echoes about one line per
second.  I'm using vmware workstation 3.0, the current Plan 9
distribution, and virtual IDE disks.

Anyone know what's going on?

Re: [9fans] vmware

[Russ Cox]

There's a port in progress but it doesn't work yet.
When it does, we'll get it posted to 9fans.

Russ

[9fans] vmware

[paurea]

I would like to install plan 9 over vmware. I know there is a port somewhere.
Where can I download it?.
--
                 Saludos,
                         Gorka

"Curiosity sKilled the cat"

Re: [9fans] VMware

[Marco Shaw]

I've tried and failed on a PII with Plan9 3rd Edition, and VMWare 2.0.2.
Can't remember the error.

The Bochs emulator fails as well.

Marco

"Wayne Walker" <wwalker@buzzard.kdi.com> wrote in message
news:20001107202003.A8783@buzzard.kdi.com...
> Has anyone had any new luck getting R3 running under VMware?  I've seen
> comments about the :
>
> VMware Workstation PANIC:
>
> NOT_IMPLEMENTED F(562):1654
>
> I have only seen that on VMware running on K6 processors.  I had
> different problems when running on a Pentium III, a loaner notebook I
> had :) that is now gone :(  In fact, I remember getting much further,
> but don't remember the problem there.  Has anyone tried
> Plan9/VMware/Intel cpu?  I could live without Ethernet (PPP over the
> virtual serial is OK with me...)
>
> --
> Wayne Walker
>
> Unix SysAdmin/Perl Hacker/System Architect

Re: [9fans] VMware

[Digby Tarvin]

> Has anyone had any new luck getting R3 running under VMware?  I've seen
> comments about the :
> 
> VMware Workstation PANIC:
> 
> NOT_IMPLEMENTED F(562):1654
> 
> I have only seen that on VMware running on K6 processors.  I had
> different problems when running on a Pentium III, a loaner notebook I
> had :) that is now gone :(  In fact, I remember getting much further,
> but don't remember the problem there.  Has anyone tried
> Plan9/VMware/Intel cpu?  I could live without Ethernet (PPP over the
> virtual serial is OK with me...)

I havn't tried it yet, but was interested in doing so. The biggest show
stopper as far as I can see (as I think I have mentioned before)
is that in VMware only emulates a VGA hardware with 640x480 and 16
colours - which Plan9 won't be too happy with.

Support for higher resolution is achieved by installing custom
drivers which talk to VMware, rather than emulating any real
hardware. These drivers are only supplied for 'supported'
operating systems. And VMware considers the interface proprietary
and when I asked they indicated that they can not divulge it.

This is not a situation I am happy with, so have not yet felt
inspired to pay for a VMware license. It is a pity, because it
otherwise sounds very appealing.

Perhaps a solution, which might also be useful in many other situations,
would be a Plan 9 'virtual' graphics driver which, instead of supporting
directly connected graphics hardware, spits X protocol packets over
a network to allow a remote display to be used. 

VNC may be another option - I am not sure if it requires real local
hardware to mirror, though.

An X based 'pseudo-device' would provide the same 'system in a window'
capability you get for supported VMware guest operating systems,
with the added bonus of being able to do the same for systems runnning
on physicaly separate hardware. Plus it could provide a fall-back
solution for all those systems with unsupported (by Plan 9)
graphics hardware - if you have an X-term or X equipped Unix workstation
on your network, then you have a display that Plan 9 can use.

I have a bit of experience programming at the Xlib (and below) level,
but none at all in writing Plan 9 display drivers, so I don't know
how practical this would be. I would guess that, as a worst case,
one could just treat the X window as just a large bitmap, and
ignore all the windowing, fonts etc functionality of the X protocol.

Of course there is still the problem of getting VMware's emulated AMD
ethernet device to work with the Plan 9 driver. Last I heard, that
was still problematic due to some emulation flaw that doesn't effect
the supported guest OS's.

Regards,
DigbyT
-- 
Digby R. S. Tarvin                                              digbyt@acm.org
http://www.cthulhu.dircon.co.uk

[9fans] VMware

[Wayne Walker]

Has anyone had any new luck getting R3 running under VMware?  I've seen
comments about the :

VMware Workstation PANIC:

NOT_IMPLEMENTED F(562):1654

I have only seen that on VMware running on K6 processors.  I had
different problems when running on a Pentium III, a loaner notebook I
had :) that is now gone :(  In fact, I remember getting much further,
but don't remember the problem there.  Has anyone tried
Plan9/VMware/Intel cpu?  I could live without Ethernet (PPP over the
virtual serial is OK with me...)

-- 
Wayne Walker

Unix SysAdmin/Perl Hacker/System Architect

[9fans] VMWare

[forsyth]

i can put it on my plan 9 software page if you like.

[9fans] VMWare

[YAMANASHI]

> Yes, I'll e-mail you the source.

Ah, could you send me a copy, please ?
-- 
uncover@beat.cc.titech.ac.jp

[9fans] VMWare

[miller]

Lucio De Re <lucio@proxima.alt.za> said:

> Can I have a copy of vncviewer for Plan 9, then?

Yes, I'll e-mail you the source.

-- Richard

[9fans] VMWare

[Lucio]

On Thu, Apr 06, 2000 at 08:40:02PM +0100, miller@hamnavoe.demon.co.uk wrote:
> 
> Which resources are you concerned about?  Plan 9 VNC viewer runs in about
> 84K of memory, and the Xvnc server is considerably smaller than an X server
> with a real screen.
> 
OK, stop teasing me :-)  I'll be away for a few weeks, but on my return
I'd love to try it out.  Xvnc server is something I have only very 
superficially looked at.

Can I have a copy of vncviewer for Plan 9, then?

++L

[9fans] VMWare

[Lucio]

On Thu, Apr 06, 2000 at 08:40:02PM +0100, miller@hamnavoe.demon.co.uk wrote:
> 
> Which resources are you concerned about?  Plan 9 VNC viewer runs in about
> 84K of memory, and the Xvnc server is considerably smaller than an X server
> with a real screen.
> 
OK, stop teasing me :-)  I'll be away for a few weeks, but on my return
I'd love to try it out.  Xvnc server is something I have only very 
superficially looked at.

Can I have a copy of vncviewer for Plan 9, then?

++L

[9fans] VMWare

[miller]

lucio@proxima.alt.za (Lucio De Re) said:

> VNC is not quite the answer, either, as it and X add up to a formidable
> resource famine :-)

Which resources are you concerned about?  Plan 9 VNC viewer runs in about
84K of memory, and the Xvnc server is considerably smaller than an X server
with a real screen.

-- Richard Miller

[9fans] VMWare

[Lucio]

On Wed, Apr 05, 2000 at 09:30:28PM -0400, dhog@plan9.bell-labs.com wrote:
> 
> You might want to consider a hardware solution: there are a variety
> of switcher boxes available for connecting a VGA monitor, mouse and
> keyboard to multiple computers, such that you can switch between them.
> 
Distance and cable tangle are the "con"s in this scenario.

> The cheaper ones contain no active electronics; I've used one of these,
> and it degraded the video signal somewhat, causing annoying artifacts
> on the screen.  I've since switched to the Raritan SwitchMan, and I'm
> quite happy with it.  Cost may be a concern, but remember, it's cheaper
> than getting more monitors (and less space-consuming).
> 
I totally agree.  I have a (literally) switch box, but it's a nightmare.
VNC is not quite the answer, either, as it and X add up to a formidable
resource famine :-)  I also can't bring myself to look at the Plan 9
Xserver (I do have only ix86 boxes to deal with), because my skills and
time availability make this impractical.

I do have a few monitors (and lots of identical keyboard, because I'm
sure their lifespan is limited).  While on topic, it is seldom that
mechanical switch boxes use break-before-make switching, and that has
caused the odd monitor to blow, in my experience.

++L

[9fans] VMWare

[Lucio]

On Wed, Apr 05, 2000 at 09:30:28PM -0400, dhog@plan9.bell-labs.com wrote:
> 
> You might want to consider a hardware solution: there are a variety
> of switcher boxes available for connecting a VGA monitor, mouse and
> keyboard to multiple computers, such that you can switch between them.
> 
Distance and cable tangle are the "con"s in this scenario.

> The cheaper ones contain no active electronics; I've used one of these,
> and it degraded the video signal somewhat, causing annoying artifacts
> on the screen.  I've since switched to the Raritan SwitchMan, and I'm
> quite happy with it.  Cost may be a concern, but remember, it's cheaper
> than getting more monitors (and less space-consuming).
> 
I totally agree.  I have a (literally) switch box, but it's a nightmare.
VNC is not quite the answer, either, as it and X add up to a formidable
resource famine :-)  I also can't bring myself to look at the Plan 9
Xserver (I do have only ix86 boxes to deal with), because my skills and
time availability make this impractical.

I do have a few monitors (and lots of identical keyboard, because I'm
sure their lifespan is limited).  While on topic, it is seldom that
mechanical switch boxes use break-before-make switching, and that has
caused the odd monitor to blow, in my experience.

++L

[9fans] VMWare

[dhog]

lucio@proxima.alt.za (Lucio De Re) writes:
> VMWare is great if you're short of servers, you can run everything on
> one box, but then the performance suffers.  I have lots of redundant
> (read old) equipment, but can only cope with one keyboard and screen
> at the time (the mouse already makes it more difficult :-).

You might want to consider a hardware solution: there are a variety
of switcher boxes available for connecting a VGA monitor, mouse and
keyboard to multiple computers, such that you can switch between them.

The cheaper ones contain no active electronics; I've used one of these,
and it degraded the video signal somewhat, causing annoying artifacts
on the screen.  I've since switched to the Raritan SwitchMan, and I'm
quite happy with it.  Cost may be a concern, but remember, it's cheaper
than getting more monitors (and less space-consuming).

Disclaimer: I speak only for myself.

[9fans] VMWare

[Lucio]

On Tue, Apr 04, 2000 at 07:10:55AM -0700, James A. Robinson wrote:
> 
> I don't remember a VNC port, but I did see this post from David Bulkow
> about getting VNC to work with Plan 9.  I don't know if he got the
> network working.
> 
I'm trying to reduce my environment to a single workstation with access
to an unreasonable number of distinct platforms (NetBSD, Linux, Win'95,
Win2K and Plan 9).  I thought VNC would provide the neatest (if not
the snazziest) solution.

Another option may be to port Cytrix to Plan 9 and the Unix platforms,
but that's hardly practical.

VMWare is great if you're short of servers, you can run everything on
one box, but then the performance suffers.  I have lots of redundant
(read old) equipment, but can only cope with one keyboard and screen
at the time (the mouse already makes it more difficult :-).

++L

[9fans] VMWare

[James]

I don't remember a VNC port, but I did see this post from David Bulkow
about getting VNC to work with Plan 9.  I don't know if he got the
network working.

------- Forwarded Message

Date:    Thu, 23 Dec 1999 18:54:42 -0500
From:    David Bulkow <dbul@earthlink.net>
To:      9fans <9fans@cse.psu.edu>
Subject: [9fans] plan9 on vmware

I have finally managed to boot Plan9 in a VMware configuration.
The problem I ran into was the IDE driver attempting to set "read ahead
mode".  After the command to set the feature, the IDE device status
register indicates an error - the error register indicates Abort.
Once the abort error is posted, the driver can no longer access the
device and the boot fails.

I did not attempt to fix the problem correctly, but instead took
a short cut and commented out the call which sets read ahead mode.
Performance appears acceptable.

In boot/pc/hard.c comment out the call to hardsetbuf().  In 9/pc/devata.c
comment out the call to atafeature().

My next goal is to get ethernet working so I can have the VMware machines
participate in the rest of the Plan9 environment.

dbul@earthlink.net


------- End of Forwarded Message

[9fans] VMWare

[Lucio]

On Tue, Apr 04, 2000 at 07:10:55AM -0700, James A. Robinson wrote:
> 
> I don't remember a VNC port, but I did see this post from David Bulkow
> about getting VNC to work with Plan 9.  I don't know if he got the
> network working.
> 
I'm trying to reduce my environment to a single workstation with access
to an unreasonable number of distinct platforms (NetBSD, Linux, Win'95,
Win2K and Plan 9).  I thought VNC would provide the neatest (if not
the snazziest) solution.

Another option may be to port Cytrix to Plan 9 and the Unix platforms,
but that's hardly practical.

VMWare is great if you're short of servers, you can run everything on
one box, but then the performance suffers.  I have lots of redundant
(read old) equipment, but can only cope with one keyboard and screen
at the time (the mouse already makes it more difficult :-).

++L

[9fans] VMWare

[James]

I don't remember a VNC port, but I did see this post from David Bulkow
about getting VNC to work with Plan 9.  I don't know if he got the
network working.

------- Forwarded Message

Date:    Thu, 23 Dec 1999 18:54:42 -0500
From:    David Bulkow <dbul@earthlink.net>
To:      9fans <9fans@cse.psu.edu>
Subject: [9fans] plan9 on vmware

I have finally managed to boot Plan9 in a VMware configuration.
The problem I ran into was the IDE driver attempting to set "read ahead
mode".  After the command to set the feature, the IDE device status
register indicates an error - the error register indicates Abort.
Once the abort error is posted, the driver can no longer access the
device and the boot fails.

I did not attempt to fix the problem correctly, but instead took
a short cut and commented out the call which sets read ahead mode.
Performance appears acceptable.

In boot/pc/hard.c comment out the call to hardsetbuf().  In 9/pc/devata.c
comment out the call to atafeature().

My next goal is to get ethernet working so I can have the VMware machines
participate in the rest of the Plan9 environment.

dbul@earthlink.net


------- End of Forwarded Message

[9fans] VMWare

[Wallet]

> Where can I get VMware in Germany ?
>
> What does it cost ?

http://www.vmware.com/

It costs from USD75 - USD199 depending on commercial/private/educational
stuff.  The price goes up to 100-299 after July 14.

Brad

[9fans] VMWare

[Wigbert]

Where can I get VMware in Germany ?

What does it cost ?

wigbert

[9fans] VMWare

[Wallet]

Hey,

I know we had a discussion of Plan 9 and VMWare, but I forget what the
conclusion was.  I was attempting to install Plan 9 using the disk
distribution, and I didn't make it very far.  The system appears to have
gone to the floppy to boot, but then I get the following:

Booting...
Protected-mode bootstrap
hd0:  LDA 1023435 sectors, 523998720 bytes
Boot devices:
boot from:

The system stops there, and nothing else will happen.  I managed to boot a
system without VMWare from the floppy.  Is there a workaround, or does Plan
9 just not work under VMWare?

Brad