[COFF] Today I learned something new about File Transfer Protocol.

[COFF] Today I learned something new about File Transfer Protocol.

[gtaylor]

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Today I learned that File Transfer Protocol supports transferring data 
between two remote systems without passing the data through a 
controlling host.

The end of § 2.3, The FTP Model, of RFC 959, File Transfer Protocol, 
states the following:

"""
In another situation a user might wish to transfer files between two 
hosts, neither of which is a local host. The user sets up control 
connections to the two servers and then arranges for a data connection 
between them.  In this manner, control information is passed to the 
user-PI but data is transferred between the server data transfer 
processes.  Following is a model of this server-server interaction.

                   Control    ------------    Control
                   ---------->| User-FTP |<-----------
                   |          | User-PI  |           |
                   |          |   "C"    |           |
                   V          ------------           V
           --------------                        --------------
           | Server-FTP |   Data Connection      | Server-FTP |
           |    "A"     |<---------------------->|    "B"     |
           -------------- Port (A)      Port (B) --------------
"""

I also learned that FTP uses (a subset of) the Telnet protocol for it's 
control connection.  Yet another reason to dislike it.  (I strongly 
prefer 8-bit clean connections and dislike things that need special 
handling.)



-- 
Grant. . . .
unix || die

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[COFF] Today I learned something new about File Transfer Protocol.

[perry]

On Sat, 7 Jul 2018 23:17:43 -0600 Grant Taylor via COFF
<coff at minnie.tuhs.org> wrote:
> Today I learned that File Transfer Protocol supports transferring
> data between two remote systems without passing the data through a 
> controlling host.

Not only does it permit that, but this mechanism was fascinatingly
abused a few times in the early 1990s as a means to enable security
policy violations. :)

> I also learned that FTP uses (a subset of) the Telnet protocol for
> it's control connection.  Yet another reason to dislike it.  (I
> strongly prefer 8-bit clean connections and dislike things that
> need special handling.)

In the old old days, FTP had all sorts of other functions, including
mail transfer. (SMTP obsoleted that by 1980 or so.)

Perry
-- 
Perry E. Metzger		perry at piermont.com

[COFF] Today I learned something new about File Transfer Protocol.

[gtaylor]

On 07/08/2018 02:28 PM, Perry E. Metzger wrote:
> In the old old days, FTP had all sorts of other functions, including 
> mail transfer. (SMTP obsoleted that by 1980 or so.)

Do you have any pointers handy (read: in cache) to where I can read more 
about FTP's involvement in early email?

If not, I'll do some searches and see what I can come up with.  If 
nothing else, I suspect that early RFCs 821 (?) will make references to 
what it's supplanting.



-- 
Grant. . . .
unix || die

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[COFF] Today I learned something new about File Transfer Protocol.

[imp]

On Sun, Jul 8, 2018, 9:29 PM Grant Taylor via COFF <coff at minnie.tuhs.org>
wrote:

> On 07/08/2018 02:28 PM, Perry E. Metzger wrote:
> > In the old old days, FTP had all sorts of other functions, including
> > mail transfer. (SMTP obsoleted that by 1980 or so.)
>
> Do you have any pointers handy (read: in cache) to where I can read more
> about FTP's involvement in early email?
>
> If not, I'll do some searches and see what I can come up with.  If
> nothing else, I suspect that early RFCs 821 (?) will make references to
> what it's supplanting.
>

They are clearly documented in the early FTP RFCs. 753 sticks in my head.
But the index will help you find the right ones...

Warner.

> --
> Grant. . . .
> unix || die
>
> _______________________________________________
> COFF mailing list
> COFF at minnie.tuhs.org
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[COFF] Today I learned something new about File Transfer Protocol.

[gtaylor]

On 07/08/2018 09:36 PM, Warner Losh wrote:
> They are clearly documented in the early FTP RFCs. 753 sticks in my 
> head. But the index will help you find the right ones...

I found things in 765.

I forgot how integrated FTP and SMTP used to be with the system.  What 
with the ability to send to the users terminal and / or their mail file.

I don't think we'd ever see such integration like that today.  Though to 
be fair, we typically don't see multiple people interactively logged 
into the same system.  Save for maybe mainframes or some mid-range 
systems (AS/400).



-- 
Grant. . . .
unix || die

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[COFF] Today I learned something new about File Transfer Protocol.

[perry]

On Sun, 8 Jul 2018 21:30:20 -0600 Grant Taylor via COFF
<coff at minnie.tuhs.org> wrote:
> On 07/08/2018 02:28 PM, Perry E. Metzger wrote:
> > In the old old days, FTP had all sorts of other functions,
> > including mail transfer. (SMTP obsoleted that by 1980 or so.)  
> 
> Do you have any pointers handy (read: in cache) to where I can read
> more about FTP's involvement in early email?
> 
> If not, I'll do some searches and see what I can come up with.  If 
> nothing else, I suspect that early RFCs 821 (?) will make
> references to what it's supplanting.

RFC 114 or 765 might cover it.

Perry
-- 
Perry E. Metzger		perry at piermont.com