Is `gnus-summary-news-other-window' broken?

Is `gnus-summary-news-other-window' broken?

[Jesper Harder]

The docstring says:

,----[ C-h f gnus-summary-news-other-window RET ]
|
| This function prepares a news even when using mail groups.  This is useful
| for posting messages to mail groups without actually sending them over the
| network.  The corresponding backend must have a 'request-post method.
`----

Does `i' work for anyone in mail groups?  For me it just puts the name
of the mail group in the 'Newsgroups' header, and then attempts to post
the message via NNTP ... not very useful.

Isn't the function redundant anyway, since `B i' (which actually works)
does more or less the same thing?

Re: Is `gnus-summary-news-other-window' broken?

[Kai Großjohann]

Jesper Harder <harder@myrealbox.com> writes:

> The docstring says:
>
> ,----[ C-h f gnus-summary-news-other-window RET ]
> |
> | This function prepares a news even when using mail groups.  This is useful
> | for posting messages to mail groups without actually sending them over the
> | network.  The corresponding backend must have a 'request-post method.
> `----
>
> Does `i' work for anyone in mail groups?  For me it just puts the name
> of the mail group in the 'Newsgroups' header, and then attempts to post
> the message via NNTP ... not very useful.

What's your value of gnus-post-method?  Maybe it helps to use C-u C-c
C-c to send it.

> Isn't the function redundant anyway, since `B i' (which actually works)
> does more or less the same thing?

`B i'?  Hm.  Not sure.  What does it do?
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Re: Is `gnus-summary-news-other-window' broken?

[Jesper Harder]

kai.grossjohann@gmx.net (Kai Großjohann) writes:

> Jesper Harder <harder@myrealbox.com> writes:
>
>> Does `i' work for anyone in mail groups?  For me it just puts the name
>> of the mail group in the 'Newsgroups' header, and then attempts to post
>> the message via NNTP ... not very useful.
>
> What's your value of gnus-post-method?

It's `current', I haven't changed the default.

> Maybe it helps to use C-u C-c C-c to send it.

Nope, it's still sent via NNTP.

>> Isn't the function redundant anyway, since `B i' (which actually works)
>> does more or less the same thing?
>
> `B i'?  Hm.  Not sure.  What does it do?

Sorry, I meant `B I' -- it inserts a new article in a mail group
directly.

Re: Is `gnus-summary-news-other-window' broken?

[Kai Großjohann]

Jesper Harder <harder@myrealbox.com> writes:

> kai.grossjohann@gmx.net (Kai Großjohann) writes:
>
>> Jesper Harder <harder@myrealbox.com> writes:
>>
>>> Does `i' work for anyone in mail groups?  For me it just puts the name
>>> of the mail group in the 'Newsgroups' header, and then attempts to post
>>> the message via NNTP ... not very useful.
>>
>> What's your value of gnus-post-method?
>
> It's `current', I haven't changed the default.
>
>> Maybe it helps to use C-u C-c C-c to send it.
>
> Nope, it's still sent via NNTP.

How about C-u 0 C-c C-c, then choosing the right backend?

My colleagues have reported symptoms like this.  Maybe you are
looking at the same problem.  Can you investigate why it happens?

My problem is that whenever I try to look hard at the problem, it
goes away.  I go to a colleague's desk and look what's happening with
his Gnus.  I try to poke around a bit.  I can't find anything.  Then
I go back to my own machine and make it use the same Emacs they are
using and the same Gnus they are using.  The problem happens again.
I install a new version of Oort.  The problem goes away.  I tell them
the problem is solved by upgrading the software.  Some moons later,
they tell me the problem is still there.

Argh.

>>> Isn't the function redundant anyway, since `B i' (which actually works)
>>> does more or less the same thing?
>>
>> `B i'?  Hm.  Not sure.  What does it do?
>
> Sorry, I meant `B I' -- it inserts a new article in a mail group
> directly.

Cool.  I didn't know that exists.  Gotta try it someday.
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Re: Is `gnus-summary-news-other-window' broken?

[Jesper Harder]

kai.grossjohann@gmx.net (Kai Großjohann) writes:

> Jesper Harder <harder@myrealbox.com> writes:
>
>> kai.grossjohann@gmx.net (Kai Großjohann) writes:
>>
>>> Jesper Harder <harder@myrealbox.com> writes:
>>>
>>>> Does `i' work for anyone in mail groups?  For me it just puts the name
>>>> of the mail group in the 'Newsgroups' header, and then attempts to post
>>>> the message via NNTP ... not very useful.
>
> How about C-u 0 C-c C-c, then choosing the right backend?

Yes, that works.

> My colleagues have reported symptoms like this.  Maybe you are
> looking at the same problem.  Can you investigate why it happens?

The problem could be `gnus-discouraged-post-methods'.  What is your
value?

Re: Is `gnus-summary-news-other-window' broken?

[Kai Großjohann]

Jesper Harder <harder@myrealbox.com> writes:

> The problem could be `gnus-discouraged-post-methods'.  What is your
> value?

Ah!  It includes nnml but not nnimap.  Hm.  My colleagues are using
nnml as the first entry in gnus-secondary-select-methods, maybe I did
that differently.

(I didn't frob that variable, and my colleagues didn't, either.  And
the group we tried to post to was an nnimap group.)
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Re: Is `gnus-summary-news-other-window' broken?

[Jesper Harder]

kai.grossjohann@gmx.net (Kai Großjohann) writes:

> Jesper Harder <harder@myrealbox.com> writes:
>
>> The problem could be `gnus-discouraged-post-methods'.  What is your
>> value?
>
> Ah!  It includes nnml but not nnimap.  Hm.  My colleagues are using
> nnml as the first entry in gnus-secondary-select-methods, maybe I did
> that differently.
>
> (I didn't frob that variable, and my colleagues didn't, either.

Are you sure?  Grepping the source shows that the value of
`gnus-discouraged-post-methods' is never changed by Gnus, and the
initial value is

        '(nndraft nnml nnimap nnmaildir nnmh nnfolder nndir)

Re: Is `gnus-summary-news-other-window' broken?

[Kai Großjohann]

Jesper Harder <harder@myrealbox.com> writes:

> kai.grossjohann@gmx.net (Kai Großjohann) writes:
>
>> (I didn't frob that variable, and my colleagues didn't, either.
>
> Are you sure?  Grepping the source shows that the value of
> `gnus-discouraged-post-methods' is never changed by Gnus, and the
> initial value is
>
>         '(nndraft nnml nnimap nnmaildir nnmh nnfolder nndir)

Thank you for hitting me on the head.  You nailed it.

(require 'gnus-msg)
(when (boundp 'gnus-discouraged-post-methods)
  (setq gnus-discouraged-post-methods
	(delete 'nnimap gnus-discouraged-post-methods)))

That's what I found in ~/.gnus.

D'Oh!
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Re: Is `gnus-summary-news-other-window' broken?

[Jesper Harder]

kai.grossjohann@gmx.net (Kai Großjohann) writes:

> Thank you for hitting me on the head.  You nailed it.
>
> (require 'gnus-msg)
> (when (boundp 'gnus-discouraged-post-methods)
>   (setq gnus-discouraged-post-methods
> 	(delete 'nnimap gnus-discouraged-post-methods)))
>
> That's what I found in ~/.gnus.

Right.  That probably means that `i' didn't work for _anyone_ with an
unmodified `gnus-discouraged-post-methods'.  

I changed it to make a buffer local copy of
gnus-discouraged-post-methods with the current method removed, so it
shouldn't be necessary to change it anymore.

Re: Is `gnus-summary-news-other-window' broken?

[Kai Großjohann]

Jesper Harder <harder@myrealbox.com> writes:

> kai.grossjohann@gmx.net (Kai Großjohann) writes:
>
>> Thank you for hitting me on the head.  You nailed it.
>>
>> (require 'gnus-msg)
>> (when (boundp 'gnus-discouraged-post-methods)
>>   (setq gnus-discouraged-post-methods
>> 	(delete 'nnimap gnus-discouraged-post-methods)))
>>
>> That's what I found in ~/.gnus.
>
> Right.  That probably means that `i' didn't work for _anyone_ with an
> unmodified `gnus-discouraged-post-methods'.  

(The thing that didn't work for my colleagues is posting to nnimap
groups.  We just use `a' from inside the group.)
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