[Q] multiple nnimap server entries in 5.8.4

[Q] multiple nnimap server entries in 5.8.4

[Steinar Bang]

I have started using nnimap with 5.8.4 (or actually some CVS checkout
not _too_ long ago) on Xemacs 20.4, against UoW imapd (unknown
version, but it was compiled and built from the newest sources in
august 1997).

So far I have two folders.  I get prompted for imap username and
password, and asked if I would like to store it for this session, 4
times on start up, and there are 4 entries for an nnimap server in the 
Server buffer, 3 of which are open and one of which are closed:

     {nnfolder:archive} (closed)
     {nnimap:imap.metis.no} (closed)
     {nndraft:} (opened)
     {nnimap:imap.metis.no+nnimap+imap.metis.no:imap/metis.3x} (opened)
     {nnfolder:} (opened)
     {nnimap:imap.metis.no+nnimap+imap.metis.no:imap/metis.sysadm} (opened)
     {nnimap:imap.metis.no} (opened)
     {nnml:} (opened)
     {nntp:news.eunet.no} (opened)

Is this normal behaviour?  Is this a known bug that can be fixed with
a CVS update?

Thanx!

Re: [Q] multiple nnimap server entries in 5.8.4

[Steinar Bang]

>>>>> Steinar Bang <sb@metis.no>:

> So far I have two folders.  I get prompted for imap username and
> password, and asked if I would like to store it for this session, 4
> times on start up, and there are 4 entries for an nnimap server in the 
> Server buffer, 3 of which are open and one of which are closed:

>      {nnfolder:archive} (closed)
>      {nnimap:imap.metis.no} (closed)

This server is editable, and the content is:
	(nnimap "tyr.metis.no"
		(nnimap-list-pattern
		 ("INBOX"
		  ("imap/" . "*"))))
(this is the one I created in the server buffer and then edited)

>      {nndraft:} (opened)
>      {nnimap:imap.metis.no+nnimap+imap.metis.no:imap/metis.3x} (opened)
>      {nnfolder:} (opened)
>      {nnimap:imap.metis.no+nnimap+imap.metis.no:imap/metis.sysadm} (opened)
>      {nnimap:imap.metis.no} (opened)

This one isn't editable.  Is this a clue to something?

>      {nnml:} (opened)
>      {nntp:news.eunet.no} (opened)

My setup cooks down to these two lines in ~/.gnus:
	(setq gnus-secondary-select-methods
	      '((nnml "") (nnimap "tyr.metis.no")))
	(setq gnus-permanently-visible-groups "^\\(nnml:\\|nnimap\\).*")

Re: [Q] multiple nnimap server entries in 5.8.4

[Simon Josefsson]

Steinar Bang <sb@metis.no> writes:

> So far I have two folders.  I get prompted for imap username and
> password, and asked if I would like to store it for this session, 4
> times on start up, and there are 4 entries for an nnimap server in the 
> Server buffer, 3 of which are open and one of which are closed:
> 
>      {nnimap:imap.metis.no} (closed)
>      {nnimap:imap.metis.no+nnimap+imap.metis.no:imap/metis.3x} (opened)
>      {nnimap:imap.metis.no+nnimap+imap.metis.no:imap/metis.sysadm} (opened)
>      {nnimap:imap.metis.no} (opened)

What's the select method for your "imap/metis.3x" group? (`G e')

My guess it differ from the one specified in
`gnus-secondary-select-method', and if it does, Gnus create a
temporary server for that group only.

I'm not sure about the first server though. Are you able to reproduce
this situation with some step-by-step instructions from a fresh (ie no
references to nnimap in .gnus or .newsrc*) configuration?  Problems
like this seem to pop up for several new nnimap users but I can't tell
what's causing it.

> Is this normal behaviour?

No.

>  Is this a known bug that can be fixed with a CVS update?

There hasn't been any changes in this area since the 5.8.3 release.

Re: [Q] multiple nnimap server entries in 5.8.4

[Steinar Bang]

>>>>> Simon Josefsson <jas@pdc.kth.se>:

> Steinar Bang <sb@metis.no> writes:
>> So far I have two folders.  I get prompted for imap username and
>> password, and asked if I would like to store it for this session, 4
>> times on start up, and there are 4 entries for an nnimap server in the 
>> Server buffer, 3 of which are open and one of which are closed:
>> 
>> {nnimap:imap.metis.no} (closed)
>> {nnimap:imap.metis.no+nnimap+imap.metis.no:imap/metis.3x} (opened)
>> {nnimap:imap.metis.no+nnimap+imap.metis.no:imap/metis.sysadm} (opened)
>> {nnimap:imap.metis.no} (opened)

> What's the select method for your "imap/metis.3x" group? (`G e')

Ah-ha! It is
	(nnimap "tyr.metis.no"
		(nnimap-list-pattern
		 ("INBOX"
		  ("imap/" . "*"))))
which is the one I edited when I created a new server in the server
buffer. 

But gnus-secondary-select-methods, is set in this manner:
	(setq gnus-secondary-select-methods
	      '((nnml "") (nnimap "tyr.metis.no")))

If I change the second entry there, it should fix things, I hope.

Re: [Q] multiple nnimap server entries in 5.8.4

[Kai Großjohann]

Steinar Bang <sb@metis.no> writes:

> But gnus-secondary-select-methods, is set in this manner:
> 	(setq gnus-secondary-select-methods
> 	      '((nnml "") (nnimap "tyr.metis.no")))
> 
> If I change the second entry there, it should fix things, I hope.

I'm not sure if nnimap can use the name as the server host -- I always
thought one had to specify the host name in an extra nnimap-address
parameter.

Also, I think the result of `G e' should be "nnimap:foo" (with the
quotes but without any parens!) rather than (nnimap "foo"
(nnimap-address "blarfl")) (with parens and all).

Recent versions of nnimap should do this automatically -- if you find
a way to subscribe a group where this doesn't work, tell Simon about
it.  But maybe the "nnimap:foo" syntax is only used for secondary
servers rather than for foreign servers?  Hm.  Simon?

kai
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Re: [Q] multiple nnimap server entries in 5.8.4

[Simon Josefsson]

Kai.Grossjohann@CS.Uni-Dortmund.DE (Kai Großjohann) writes:

> Steinar Bang <sb@metis.no> writes:
> 
> > But gnus-secondary-select-methods, is set in this manner:
> > 	(setq gnus-secondary-select-methods
> > 	      '((nnml "") (nnimap "tyr.metis.no")))
> > 
> > If I change the second entry there, it should fix things, I hope.
> 
> I'm not sure if nnimap can use the name as the server host -- I always
> thought one had to specify the host name in an extra nnimap-address
> parameter.

No, `(nnimap "mymailserver")' is quite OK.  (But it does result in
long group names, so people might prefer `(nnimap "" (nnimap-address
"mymailserver"))' anyway.)

> Also, I think the result of `G e' should be "nnimap:foo" (with the
> quotes but without any parens!) rather than (nnimap "foo"
> (nnimap-address "blarfl")) (with parens and all).

Either should work (the first is preferable though), the only thing to
be aware of if it's `(nnimap "foo")' and your server really is
`(nnimap "foo" (lotsaparams)'. Gnus would then create a temporary
server which lead to performance problems.

> Recent versions of nnimap should do this automatically -- if you find
> a way to subscribe a group where this doesn't work, tell Simon about
> it.  But maybe the "nnimap:foo" syntax is only used for secondary
> servers rather than for foreign servers?  Hm.  Simon?

Right. If the group is on the primary server it just says "native".

Re: [Q] multiple nnimap server entries in 5.8.4

[Kai Großjohann]

Simon Josefsson <jas@pdc.kth.se> writes:

> Either should work (the first is preferable though), the only thing to
> be aware of if it's `(nnimap "foo")' and your server really is
> `(nnimap "foo" (lotsaparams)'. Gnus would then create a temporary
> server which lead to performance problems.

Also, what happens if one ever changes server params?  The string
version sounds much better there.

kai
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Re: [Q] multiple nnimap server entries in 5.8.4

[Steinar Bang]

>>>>> Simon Josefsson <jas@pdc.kth.se>:

> Kai.Grossjohann@CS.Uni-Dortmund.DE (Kai Großjohann) writes:

>> Recent versions of nnimap should do this automatically -- if you
>> find a way to subscribe a group where this doesn't work, tell Simon
>> about it.  But maybe the "nnimap:foo" syntax is only used for
>> secondary servers rather than for foreign servers?  Hm.  Simon?

> Right. If the group is on the primary server it just says "native".

What's the primary server here?  The NNTP server?  Or is there such a
beast as a primary IMAP server?

What's the "virtual server" the documentation for nnimap-address talks 
about?

Re: [Q] multiple nnimap server entries in 5.8.4

[Steinar Bang]

>>>>> Simon Josefsson <jas@pdc.kth.se>:

> Kai.Grossjohann@CS.Uni-Dortmund.DE (Kai Großjohann) writes:
>> Steinar Bang <sb@metis.no> writes:
>> 
>> > But gnus-secondary-select-methods, is set in this manner:
>> > 	(setq gnus-secondary-select-methods
>> > 	      '((nnml "") (nnimap "tyr.metis.no")))
>> > 
>> > If I change the second entry there, it should fix things, I hope.
>> 
>> I'm not sure if nnimap can use the name as the server host -- I always
>> thought one had to specify the host name in an extra nnimap-address
>> parameter.

> No, `(nnimap "mymailserver")' is quite OK.  (But it does result in
> long group names, so people might prefer `(nnimap "" (nnimap-address
> "mymailserver"))' anyway.)

When I do this:
	(setq gnus-secondary-select-methods
	      '((nnml "")
		(nnimap ""
			(nnimap-address "tyr.metis.no")
			(nnimap-list-pattern
			 ("INBOX"
			  ("imap/" . "*"))))))
I get a server buffer that looks like this:
     {nnfolder:archive} (closed)
     {nndraft:} (opened)
     {nnfolder:} (opened)
     {nnimap:tyr.metis.no} (opened)
     {nnimap:} (denied)
     {nnml:} (opened)
     {nntp:news.eunet.no} (opened)

But when I try to open the "{nnimap:}" server, I get the message
	Unable to contact server : nil

Is there something wrong in the syntax of the setting of
gnus-secondary-select-methods above?

Is there a way to rename an nnimap group with a long name like this:
	nnimap+tyr.metis.no:imap/metis.sysadm
to something shorter, other than opening the new server, subscribing
to the new nnimap group (I have to do it this way, because I'm not
allowed to give nnimap groups with slashes in their names manually)?

Re: [Q] multiple nnimap server entries in 5.8.4

[Kai Großjohann]

Steinar Bang <sb@metis.no> writes:

> What's the primary server here?  The NNTP server?  Or is there such a
> beast as a primary IMAP server?

The value of gnus-select-method names the `primary' or `native'
server.  The servers enumerated in gnus-secondary-select-methods are
`secondary', whereas all other servers are `foreign'.  (Well, there
are servers that Gnus automatically creates, such as the nndraft
server -- these are not foreign.)

Any backend can be used for any server.  Your primary server could be
nntp, nnml, nnimap, nnfolder, even nndoc I guess.  Same for the
others.

I don't know what is the difference between secondary and foreign
servers, except that the secondary ones are in
gnus-secondary-select-methods.  Maybe it would be possible to do
without them?

kai
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