Re: [NTG-context] Off topic: Does a 'free for commercial use' flared-sans font exist in the world?

[Hans Hagen via ntg-context <ntg-context@ntg.nl>]

On 6/17/2023 2:06 AM, linguafalsa--- via ntg-context wrote:
> On Fri, Jun 16, 2023 at 06:35:49PM +0200, Gerben Wierda via ntg-context wrote:
>> I know this is off topic, but I suspect this community is actually one of the best places to find an answer.
>>
> 
> It is the best community. And I tell you what.
> 
> What happened is that all TeX engines have neglected fonts from the beginning.

Really? When tex showed up digital font technology was pretty much in 
flux. And, with metafont being part of the tex ecosystem, one can argue 
that tex was quite innovative too.

Potscript and its fonts came aroudn at the same time and were rather 
closed technologies. But as soon possible backend drivers (also part of 
the tex ecosystem) kicked in.

Then we got virtual fonts which enhanced tex's capabilities.

>> I really like Optima, and what I really like about it is the 'flared style'.
>>
>> But I would like to move to a flared-sans font that gives me more licensing freedom. I haven't been able to find one after extensive searching. The only one who were reasonably priced (not free) were the URW Classico ones in Adobe Creative Cloud, but those can only be used in Adobe programs like InDesign (and not TeX).
>>
> 
> Licensing freedom is an oxymoron. There's no freedom in licensing.
> Only greed.
> 
> The only extension engine that at one point had a plan in mind,
> or most of the bases covered in this regard was Omega.

One needs morr than plans. Afaik omega was more about input processing 
and th efont part was mostly going beyond 8 bit fonts but i might have 
missed something (omega was never productin ready).

It is xetex that hooked into opentype although pdftex can actually deal 
with truetype fonts to some extend. Before there was something 
'opentype' we had two competing but similar technologies. And it took a 
while before it was even clear how to interpre the specification (also 
think about reverse engeneering fonts and heuristics and ... bugs or 
features ...). TeX was always pretty fast in picking up new stuff (maybe 
users less so).

> When it came to commercial fonts the plan of action ahead was by
> including PFC data on these very same commercial fonts that would
> benefit primarily its opentype versions in the long run.

What is PFC data?

> What do you have right now? Opentype fonts only. Sure. Quality can be
> even the same than its type1 counterpart, and at times not so much
> according so some folks that have bothered to go the extra length in
> making the most accurate comparison that's available between them two.

For most fonts it's just 'more shapes' which then also leads to more 
ligatures, kerns etc btu that is already nice. And when fonts lack 
something we can always tweak them (runtime).

> But looking at it from a bright side/perspective, I think we're no
> longer facing the same pre-historic constraints of including a font
> as before, as long as it's not for commercial purposes, You are well
> aware of these non and commercial uses even before  your extensive
> search anyway,

I'm not sure what is the difference between commercial fonts and free 
ones as they use the same technology; with some exceptions, fonts are 
not that expensive (take lucida from tug, making fonts takes time after 
all); and for publishers it's noise on their budgets.

> p.s many many years ago I read and followed some publications about
> the aformentioned extension and just went over them recently, to
> have an idea what did and did not work. In regards to typefaces,
> its goal was unmatched, or so I think.

It might be comforting to know that right from the start luatex made a 
lot possible wrt fonts (runtime manipulation) and was also one of the 
first to support variable fonts, color fonts etc (not that many care 
about that). And with luametatex we go even further.

>> I found some flared-sans fonts, but not one with at least regular, italic, bold, and bold-italic.
>>
>> Is there really not a single flared-sans font that is really free (so also for commercial use) to use out there?
I had to search the net to figure out that flare sans fonts are sans 
fonts with serifs

For those into fonts:

https://tug.org/TUGboat/tb44-1/tb136carter-romano.pdf

I a very nice overview of how it went with digital fonts (and what we 
probably lost in getting where we are now and might loose soon).

Hans

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