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From: Doug McIlroy <doug@cs.dartmouth.edu>
To: tuhs@tuhs.org
Subject: Re: [TUHS] Memory management in Dennis Ritchie's C Compiler
Date: Wed, 26 Aug 2020 09:24:59 -0400	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <202008261324.07QDOxln046419@tahoe.cs.Dartmouth.EDU> (raw)

>     That's always true on the PDP-11 and Vax, no matter what the OS,
>     because the processor architecture (which has pre-increment and
>     post-decrement instructions, but not their counterparts) makes
>     anything but a downward-growing stack unmanageable.

I hadn't heard this urban legend before. A stack is certainly
manageable without auto-increment/decrement (AID) instructions. In
fact Dennis's compiler did not use AID instructions for that purpose.

AID instructions are nice for a LIFO stack, in which a stacked
item disappears as soon as it's used--as do intermediate
results in expression evaluation. But when the stack contains
local variables that are accessed multiple times, the accesses
are offset from the stack pointer. If AID instructions set the
pointer, then the offset of a particular local varies throughout
the code. The compiler can cope with that (I once wrote a
compiler that did so), but a debugger will have a devil of a
time doing a backtrace when the offset of the return address
in each stack frame depends on the location counter.

AID instructions are fine for sequentially accessing arrays, and
in principle Ken's ++ and -- operators can exploit them. Yet
idiomatic C typically wants post-increment and pre-decrement
instructions--the opposite of what DEC offered. Examples:

        char a[N], b[N];
        char *ap = a;
        char *bp = b;
        int i;
        for(i=0; i<N; i++)
                *ap++ = *bp++;

        int a[N], b[N];
        int i = N;
        while(--i >= 0)
                a[i] = b[i];

Doug

             reply	other threads:[~2020-08-26 13:25 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 46+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2020-08-26 13:24 Doug McIlroy [this message]
2020-08-26 15:41 ` John Cowan
  -- strict thread matches above, loose matches on Subject: below --
2020-08-27  8:37 Paul Ruizendaal
2020-08-26 15:59 Noel Chiappa
2020-08-26 16:09 ` Warner Losh
2020-08-26 19:13   ` Clem Cole
2020-08-26 16:14 ` Jim Geist
2020-08-26 17:31 ` John Cowan
2020-08-25  9:36 Steve Simon
2020-08-17 22:32 Norman Wilson
2020-08-17 22:55 ` Bakul Shah
2020-08-17 23:12 ` Chet Ramey
2020-08-18  6:33 ` arnold
2020-08-17 19:51 Noel Chiappa
2020-08-17 19:27 Noel Chiappa
2020-08-17 19:30 ` Larry McVoy
2020-08-17 19:44   ` Dan Halbert
2020-08-17 19:50   ` Paul Winalski
2020-08-17 22:05     ` Arthur Krewat
2020-08-18  0:52 ` Rob Gingell
2020-08-17  2:02 Noel Chiappa
2020-08-17 18:02 ` Paul Winalski
2020-08-17 18:13   ` Jim Geist
2020-08-17 18:48     ` Paul Winalski
2020-08-17 19:08       ` Jim Geist
2020-08-17 19:28         ` Paul Winalski
2020-08-17 19:35           ` Jim Geist
2020-08-17 19:41             ` Richard Salz
2020-08-17 23:40               ` Steffen Nurpmeso
2020-08-15 21:50 Dibyendu Majumdar
2020-08-16 15:20 ` arnold
2020-08-16 15:27   ` Jim Geist
2020-08-17 16:13 ` Dan Cross
2020-08-17 20:16   ` Dibyendu Majumdar
2020-08-17 20:34     ` Paul Winalski
2020-08-17 20:43       ` Dibyendu Majumdar
2020-08-17 21:05         ` Warner Losh
2020-08-17 22:47         ` Dave Horsfall
2020-08-17 23:06           ` Nemo Nusquam
2020-08-17 21:29     ` Dibyendu Majumdar
2020-08-24 15:58     ` Dan Cross
2020-08-24 17:08       ` John Cowan
2020-08-24 17:15         ` Clem Cole
2020-08-24 17:24           ` Clem Cole
2020-08-24 17:20         ` Dan Cross
2020-08-25 23:06           ` Arthur Krewat

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