[TUHS] Original print of V7 manual? / My own version of troff

[TUHS] Original print of V7 manual? / My own version of troff

[tuhs]

No idea what COFF is, but in the early 1980s, two non-troff options on
the software side were -

1) TeX. From Donald Knuth, which means tau epsilon chi, pronounced tech
   not tex. The urban legend was upon seeing an inital copy of one of his
   books sometime in the 1970s, he yelled "blech!" and decided that if you
   wanted your documents to look right, you need to do be able to it
   yourself, and TeX rhymes with blech.

2) Scribe. From Brian Reid, of Carnegie-Mellon
   See http://www.columbia.edu/cu/computinghistory/scribe.pdf

-Brian

Clem Cole clemc at ccc.com wrtoe:
> Not really UNIX -- so I'm BCC TUHS and moving to COFF
>
> On Tue, Jan 9, 2024 at 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[TUHS] Re: Original print of V7 manual? / My own version of troff

[Diomidis Spinellis]

Knuth opens his TeXbook, explaining TeX's origin and pronunciation.

“English words like ‘technology’ stem from a Greek root beginning with 
the letters τεχ…; and this same Greek word means art as well as 
technology.  Hence the name TeX, which is an uppercase form of τεχ.”

He then indeed introduces blecchhh, but he doesn't connect it with the 
absence of quality.

“Insiders pronounce the χ of TeX as a Greek chi, not as an ‘x’ so that 
TeX rhymes with the word blecchhh.”

(I couldn't help noticing that in my 1989 edition of the book, ellipsis 
after τεχ appears to be set as three periods ‘...’ rather than a real 
ellipsis ‘…’.  The (modern) Greek words for art  and technology are 
τέχνη (techni) and τεχνολογία (technologia), respectively.

Diomidis

On 10-Jan-24 20:50, tuhs@cuzuco.com wrote:
 > No idea what COFF is, but in the early 1980s, two non-troff options on
 > the software side were -
 >
 > 1) TeX. From Donald Knuth, which means tau epsilon chi, pronounced tech
 >     not tex. The urban legend was upon seeing an inital copy of one 
of his
 >     books sometime in the 1970s, he yelled "blech!" and decided that 
if you
 >     wanted your documents to look right, you need to do be able to it
 >     yourself, and TeX rhymes with blech.

[TUHS] Re: Original print of V7 manual? / My own version of troff

[segaloco via TUHS]

Just to swing this back around to V7 docs, this auction has been on eBay for a little bit now: https://www.ebay.com/itm/134767543042

After the link is an auction for the HRW V7 manuals, as well as a second Volume 1, the second edition of the Nemeth administration book, and a Fall '84 software catalog from AT&T.  I might jump on this in a week or so if it is still up, although all I really want is the software catalog.  That to say, if someone else does pick this up, all I'd ask is I would like to purchase the catalog then from you or otherwise see to it that it gets scanned.  Otherwise if I do pick it up, expect a follow up posting offering up the V7 pair, I'd take the other Volume 1 (and Nemeth book) to that uni bookshelf I donated a V7 Volume 2 binder to.  If you get this and disappear the software catalog into a memory hole, your mother is a hamster and father smells of elderberries.

- Matt G.

P.S. For those who don't go looking often but might be interested, these are currently listed on eBay in various places:

- 1 Bell Laboratories UNIX Release 3.0 User's Manual.
- 3 Western Electric UNIX Release 5.0 User's Manuals.
- 1 Western Electric UNIX Release 5.0 Error Message Manual.
- Lots of picture-less auctions (you're selling books, pictures are the least you can do...) of allegedly parts of the HRW UNIX SVR2 5 Volume set.  These are small form with metallic alphabet blocks otherwise resembling the motif on the V7 manuals cover.  Distinct from the black and red binders distributed closer to actual machine purchases.
- The usual gaggle of SVR3 and SVR4 manuals, there's always a rotation of them up so not going to point out specifics.

The Release 5.0 Error Message Manual is particularly interesting in that the cover looks virtually identical to the usual Release 5.0/System V motif but the text says "UNIX Operating System" instead of just "UNIX System" like the Release 5.0 and System V copies I have.  Most literature just says "UNIX System" so I suspect the "Operating" text is on earlier runs of the covers.  Just speculation though, can't say for certain.

[TUHS] Re: Original print of V7 manual? / My own version of troff

[Mychaela Falconia]

Hi Matt,

> Just to swing this back around to V7 docs, this auction has been on eBay
> for a little bit now: https://www.ebay.com/itm/134767543042

I just snarfed it.  I am only interested in the V7 book pair; the other
3 books (extra vol1, the Nemeth book and the catalog you are most
interested in) will be going to you, my dear.  Please send me your
mailing/shipping address off-list.

> That to say, if someone else does pick this up, all I'd ask is I would like
> to purchase the catalog then from you or otherwise see to it that it gets
> scanned.

I have neither the setup nor the time to do any scanning, so I'll just
send you the physical book.

> If you get this and disappear the software catalog into a memory hole,
> your mother is a hamster and father smells of elderberries.

I hereby swear before my Goddesses that I shall not disappear that
catalog; if it arrives in my hands from the ebay seller, I shall do
everything in my power to get it to you, dear brother.

Mychaela N. Falconia, HPS

[TUHS] Re: Original print of V7 manual? / My own version of troff

[Sebastien F4GRX]

Hi,

Very interesting trivia, I didnt know, thanks!


Funnily, this scribe document has a joke about hyp-

henation.


Sebastien


Le 10/01/2024 à 19:50, tuhs@cuzuco.com a écrit :
> No idea what COFF is, but in the early 1980s, two non-troff options on
> the software side were -
>
> 1) TeX. From Donald Knuth, which means tau epsilon chi, pronounced tech
>     not tex. The urban legend was upon seeing an inital copy of one of his
>     books sometime in the 1970s, he yelled "blech!" and decided that if you
>     wanted your documents to look right, you need to do be able to it
>     yourself, and TeX rhymes with blech.
>
> 2) Scribe. From Brian Reid, of Carnegie-Mellon
>     See http://www.columbia.edu/cu/computinghistory/scribe.pdf
>
> -Brian
>
> Clem Cole clemc at ccc.com wrtoe:
>> Not really UNIX -- so I'm BCC TUHS and moving to COFF
>>
>> On Tue, Jan 9, 2024 at 12:19b /PM segaloco via TUHS <tuhs at tuhs.org> wrote:
>>
>>> On the subject of troff origins, in a world where troff didn't exist, and
>>> one purchases a C/A/T, what was the general approach to actually using the
>>> thing?  Was there some sort of datasheet the vendor supplied that the end
>>> user would have to program a driver around, or was there any sort of
>>> example code or other materials provided to give folks a leg up on using
>>> their new, expensive instrument?  Did they have any "packaged bundles" for
>>> users of prominent systems such as 360/370 OSs or say one of the DEC OSs?
>>>
>> Basically, the phototypesetter part was turnkey with a built-in
>> minicomputer with a paper tape unit, later a micro and a floppy disk as a
>> cost reduction.   The preparation for the typesetter was often done
>> independently, but often the vendor offered some system to prepare the PPT
>> or Floppy.  Different typesetter vendors targeted different parts of the
>> market, from small local independent newspapers (such as the one my sister
>> and her husband owned and ran in North Andover MA for many years), to
>> systems that Globe or the Times might.  Similarly, books and magazines
>> might have different systems (IIRC the APS-5 was originally targeted for
>> large book publishers).  This was all referred to as the 'pre-press'
>> industry and there were lots of players in different parts.
>>
>> Large firms that produced documentation, such as DEC, AT&T *et al*., and
>> even some universities, might own their own gear, or they might send it out
>> to be set.
>>
>> The software varied greatly, depending on the target customer.   For
>> instance, by the early 80s,  the Boston Globe's input system was still
>> terrible - even though the computers had gotten better.  I had a couple of
>> friends working there, and they used to b*tch about it.  But big newspapers
>> (and I expect many other large publishers) were often heavy union shops on
>> the back end (layout and presses), so the editors just wanted to set strips
>> of "column wide" text as the layout was manual.  I've forgotten the name of
>> the vendor of the typesetter they used, but it was one of the larger firms
>> -- IIRC, it had a DG Nova in it.    My sister used CompuGraphic Gear, which
>> was based on 8085's.  She had two custom editing stations and the
>> typesetter itself (it sucked).  The whole system was under $35K in
>> late-1970s money - but targeted to small newspapers like hers. In the
>> mid-1908s, I got her a Masscomp at a reduced price and put 6 Wyse-75
>> terminals on it, so she could have her folks edit their stories with vi,
>> run spell, and some of the other UNIX tools.  I then reverse-engineered the
>> floppy enough to split out the format she wanted for her stories -- she
>> used a manual layout scheme.  She still has to use the custom stuff for
>> headlines and some other parts, but it was a load faster and more parallel
>> (for instance, we wrote an awk script to generate the School Lunch menus,
>> which they published each week).
>>

[TUHS] Re: Original print of V7 manual? / My own version of troff

[Dave Horsfall]

On Wed, 10 Jan 2024, tuhs@cuzuco.com wrote:

> No idea what COFF is, but in the early 1980s, two non-troff options on 
> the software side were -

COFF (Computer Old Farts Followers) is the sister list to this one; it was 
set up to take the off-topic posts from TUHS (I suggested the name to 
Warren).

Subscribe in the usual way...

-- Dave

[TUHS] Re: Original print of V7 manual? / My own version of troff

[Greg 'groggy' Lehey]

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On Friday, 12 January 2024 at  9:48:54 +1100, Dave Horsfall wrote:
> On Wed, 10 Jan 2024, tuhs@cuzuco.com wrote:
>
>> No idea what COFF is, but in the early 1980s, two non-troff options on
>> the software side were -
>
> COFF (Computer Old Farts Followers) is the sister list to this one; it was
> set up to take the off-topic posts from TUHS (I suggested the name to
> Warren).
>
> Subscribe in the usual way...

In fact, no.  I replied yesterday and first checked the details.
To subscribe, you need to ask Warren personally.

That's not the case for TUHS.  Warren, why the difference?

Greg
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[TUHS] Re: Subscribing to TUHS and COFF

[Warren Toomey via TUHS]

On Fri, Jan 12, 2024 at 10:47:24AM +1100, Greg 'groggy' Lehey wrote:
> To subscribe, you need to ask Warren personally.
> That's not the case for TUHS.  Warren, why the difference?

For both COFF and TUHS you have to e-mail me personally to get on the list.
I've disabled the on-line subscription mechanism.

Cheers, Warren