* What's a complete "just works" distro?
@ 2015-03-22 0:17 Logen Kain
2015-03-22 7:58 ` Juan RP
` (3 more replies)
0 siblings, 4 replies; 8+ messages in thread
From: Logen Kain @ 2015-03-22 0:17 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: voidlinux
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tl;dr:
Me rambling and mostly figuring it out on my own, read at your own risk.
I often say VoidLinux has one big con:
All other distros feel slow once you use Void.
It actually is a con for me at this point, because I'm looking for a "just
works" distro. The last time I tried to use Ubuntu, it was at least 100
times slower than Void (and also rarely "just works").
Apt is slower during a normal update, than it takes fglrx to do it's
thing. In addition to all those problems, Ubuntu has a way of frustrating
me as much as a set of headphones that have that broken wire that almost
works if you twist it just right.
Are there any distros out there that have at least a fraction the speed
Void does? I'd like to have a distro on hand that has tons of packages so
it's easier to test new programs I find out about that are not available on
void.
The only distro I can think of that might match this requirement is Sabayon.
The only other distro that comes close, aside from Sabayon, is Arch LInux.
I'm actually looking into audio/video production, so any distros that are
good for that, as well as being fast, is what I'm looking for.
xbps and runit spoil me. I expect too much from my operating systems now.
Honestly, I'll probably just spin up Arch in a VM to test packages. If I
like the program, then I'll try to package it for Void. Void is missing a
lot of packages for the artist community.
Unrelated question: How the hell does Void seemingly never break? I've
seen a couple issues over the time I've been with Void, but it all seems to
get fixed without my intervention. On Arch Linux, if I forget to update
for a week, my system would crash if I tried to update.
Perhaps Gentoo would work out, just build a machine specifically for audio
production and just never update it.
Anyway, I've pretty much answered myself here, but I'm going to post
anyway. Perhaps there is something I'm not seeing.
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* Re: What's a complete "just works" distro?
2015-03-22 0:17 What's a complete "just works" distro? Logen Kain
@ 2015-03-22 7:58 ` Juan RP
2015-03-22 14:07 ` Christian Neukirchen
` (2 subsequent siblings)
3 siblings, 0 replies; 8+ messages in thread
From: Juan RP @ 2015-03-22 7:58 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: voidlinux
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Glad to read your comments.
But xbps is still not perfect, and could be made even better... I'm slowly
progressing :-)
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* Re: What's a complete "just works" distro?
2015-03-22 0:17 What's a complete "just works" distro? Logen Kain
2015-03-22 7:58 ` Juan RP
@ 2015-03-22 14:07 ` Christian Neukirchen
2015-03-23 3:30 ` Logen Kain
2015-03-22 17:29 ` Stefan Mühlinghaus
2015-03-22 21:46 ` JD Robinson
3 siblings, 1 reply; 8+ messages in thread
From: Christian Neukirchen @ 2015-03-22 14:07 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Logen Kain; +Cc: void...
Logen Kain <walach.o...@gmail.com> writes:
> Are there any distros out there that have at least a fraction the speed
> Void does?
TBH, I never understood this argument. All Linux distros compile
roughly the same sources... why would one be faster than another?
(Sure, their package manager could be more efficient, etc.
But in terms of actual performance... I don't get it.)
--
Christian Neukirchen <chneuk...@gmail.com> http://chneukirchen.org
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 8+ messages in thread
* Re: What's a complete "just works" distro?
2015-03-22 0:17 What's a complete "just works" distro? Logen Kain
2015-03-22 7:58 ` Juan RP
2015-03-22 14:07 ` Christian Neukirchen
@ 2015-03-22 17:29 ` Stefan Mühlinghaus
2015-03-23 3:38 ` Logen Kain
2015-03-22 21:46 ` JD Robinson
3 siblings, 1 reply; 8+ messages in thread
From: Stefan Mühlinghaus @ 2015-03-22 17:29 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: voidlinux
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I agree, void is not any faster or slower than other distributions it you
look at raw performance. On the other hand, running a streamlined void with
a lightweight window manager will of course feel much more responsive than
an Ubuntu with Unity and 100 daemon processes that do who-knows-what in the
background all the time, especially on older hardware.
If with "just works" you mean a distribution that is easy to install/update
and provides or at least supports everything you may ever need you will
have to go with Ubuntu since that is pretty much the only disribution that
has achieved some mainstream traction. There are several softwares out
there that are (officially) only supported for Ubuntu. If Ubuntu itself is
too bloated for your tastes try Xubuntu <http://xubuntu.org/> or Lubuntu
<http://lubuntu.net/>. You can even do an Ubuntu minimal
<https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Installation/MinimalCD> installation and
customize everything just as you would in void. Thats what I'm using on my
laptop and the performance is just fine. That of course might impede its
ability to "just work" though :)
Using apt for package mamagement is not as fast as xbps but also has a lot
more packages to deal with. void currently has about 7000 (very rough
count, factoring in meta-packages and 32bit versions probably substantially
less) while Ubuntu is approaching 40000. By the way, Debian
<https://www.debian.org/> has even more packages (approaching 50000) but
somewhat lacks the mainstream traction. It might be an option for you
nevertheless.
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* What's a complete "just works" distro?
2015-03-22 0:17 What's a complete "just works" distro? Logen Kain
` (2 preceding siblings ...)
2015-03-22 17:29 ` Stefan Mühlinghaus
@ 2015-03-22 21:46 ` JD Robinson
3 siblings, 0 replies; 8+ messages in thread
From: JD Robinson @ 2015-03-22 21:46 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: voidlinux
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if Ardour can be ported with it's custom dependencies not effecting the integrity of the ones they replace, I would love to test that.
I've been trying to get jack to cooperate on many distributions, and failed miserably.
...also have had similar issues with hardware sensors on asus boards.
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 8+ messages in thread
* Re: What's a complete "just works" distro?
2015-03-22 14:07 ` Christian Neukirchen
@ 2015-03-23 3:30 ` Logen Kain
2015-04-07 20:38 ` bougyman
0 siblings, 1 reply; 8+ messages in thread
From: Logen Kain @ 2015-03-23 3:30 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: voidlinux; +Cc: walach.o...
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>>TBH, I never understood this argument. All Linux distros compile
>>roughly the same sources... why would one be faster than another?
I think runit has a lot to do with it. Even compared to Arch which I've
also streamlined... Had I never saw Void before I would think that the
computer must have an SSD in it.
It's some times quicker for me to "git clone" and compile packages on void
than it is to download something from apt. Seriously, Ubuntu competes with
windows now for slow updating.
Before using Void, I have never seen firefox open this fast, again I used
to be a fan of Arch Linux and openbox combo.
On an R61 Laptop I used to use, windows 7 (came with it refurb) ran pretty
ok. I didn't use it more than a day before I started installing Linux
distros.
All Ubuntu derived distros were horribly slow to install, boot, and open
aplications.
Arch was pretty fast, but nothing compared to void. Sabayon felt a little
quicker than arch.
I typically used MATE at the time, or KDE.
Thinking of KDE. When I install and start up KDE for the first time, it
has always been stupid slow. Decent boot up times after the first boot.
With Void, it was way faster than I've ever seen it boot. Even for a first
boot.
I don't know what kind of black magic Void weilds, but if it wasn't for
Void, I'd agree with the idea that all distros are pretty much the same.
Perhaps I wouldn't notice much of a difference if I used SSD.
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* Re: What's a complete "just works" distro?
2015-03-22 17:29 ` Stefan Mühlinghaus
@ 2015-03-23 3:38 ` Logen Kain
0 siblings, 0 replies; 8+ messages in thread
From: Logen Kain @ 2015-03-23 3:38 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: voidlinux
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>> By the way, Debian <https://www.debian.org/> has even more packages
(approaching 50000) but somewhat lacks the mainstream traction. It might be
an option for you nevertheless.
Debian might be ok. My issue is that I have nothing but contempt for apt.
Sabayon,arch,debian are pretty much my choices. I hate to say it, but for
a backup distro, debian would probably be the best bet.
I used to use a debian sid bassed distro... Now I need to remember what
that was... Suppose I could just use sid.
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* Re: What's a complete "just works" distro?
2015-03-23 3:30 ` Logen Kain
@ 2015-04-07 20:38 ` bougyman
0 siblings, 0 replies; 8+ messages in thread
From: bougyman @ 2015-04-07 20:38 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: voidlinux; +Cc: walach.o...
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I have some benchmarks on this from a few years ago and runit was
definitely speedier than systemd boots (on archlinux) then. From the DW
reviewers comments it seems this is still the case, at least
in the case of runit-void's speed. This mostly affects boot time, but the
low overhead of a static runit vs the many binaries of system plus its own
heft could make a difference on strained-for-resources machines, I suppose,
but
likely not on some A/V production rig.
bougyman
On Sunday, March 22, 2015 at 10:30:26 PM UTC-5, Logen Kain wrote:
>
> >>TBH, I never understood this argument. All Linux distros compile
> >>roughly the same sources... why would one be faster than another?
>
> I think runit has a lot to do with it. Even compared to Arch which I've
> also streamlined... Had I never saw Void before I would think that the
> computer must have an SSD in it.
>
> It's some times quicker for me to "git clone" and compile packages on void
> than it is to download something from apt. Seriously, Ubuntu competes with
> windows now for slow updating.
>
> Before using Void, I have never seen firefox open this fast, again I used
> to be a fan of Arch Linux and openbox combo.
>
> On an R61 Laptop I used to use, windows 7 (came with it refurb) ran pretty
> ok. I didn't use it more than a day before I started installing Linux
> distros.
> All Ubuntu derived distros were horribly slow to install, boot, and open
> aplications.
> Arch was pretty fast, but nothing compared to void. Sabayon felt a little
> quicker than arch.
>
> I typically used MATE at the time, or KDE.
>
> Thinking of KDE. When I install and start up KDE for the first time, it
> has always been stupid slow. Decent boot up times after the first boot.
>
> With Void, it was way faster than I've ever seen it boot. Even for a
> first boot.
>
> I don't know what kind of black magic Void weilds, but if it wasn't for
> Void, I'd agree with the idea that all distros are pretty much the same.
>
>
> Perhaps I wouldn't notice much of a difference if I used SSD.
>
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2015-03-22 0:17 What's a complete "just works" distro? Logen Kain
2015-03-22 7:58 ` Juan RP
2015-03-22 14:07 ` Christian Neukirchen
2015-03-23 3:30 ` Logen Kain
2015-04-07 20:38 ` bougyman
2015-03-22 17:29 ` Stefan Mühlinghaus
2015-03-23 3:38 ` Logen Kain
2015-03-22 21:46 ` JD Robinson
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