[9fans] using mouse (was: ... using sam)

[9fans] using mouse (was: ... using sam)

[geoff]

If you're using a `battleship' pc keyboard or a laptop built-in mouse
(or worse, trackball or `glide pad', the instant cause of
carpal-tunnel syndrome), I can see why you're unhappy.  In my
department, we've been trying various small keyboards and mice, with
and without wires.  We plug real mice into laptops.

keyboard(6) does say
          Caps Lock acts as an additional control key.
but some people miss that; it means that the control key is in the
same place on all keyboards: to the left of the `a' key.

We used to buy the Lexmark `model m4' wired keyboards, which are small
and don't have much unused surface area.  ~ ` is above ESC.  Their main
drawbacks are that they are somewhat loud and have been discontinued
by Lexmark, though you could ask unicomp@lex.infi.net if they have any
left (we bought 20 of their last 50).

We looked for successors to the Lexmark and tried the Behavioural
Technologies BTC-5100 wired keyboard.  It is smaller still but key
placement is just too unorthodox for most of the people who tried it.
I don't have one in front of me, so I can't describe the layout, but I
do recall swearing at it when I used it.  Trying to find the F1, F2 or
DEL key at boot time within a few seconds to get you into the bios
setup screen can be a real challenge.

We recently ordered wired and wireless keyboards from Sejin Electron
(www.sejin.com).  Apparently the standard footprint of wireless
keyboards is quite small; I don't understand why keyboard makers think
that people would want a keyboard the size of a piano's just because
it has a wire running all the way to your PS2 keyboard port.  Sejin's
wired and wireless keyboards all seem to be pretty small; we ordered
the spr-8630 wired keyboard at $42.00 and the spr-8695w wireless
keyboard at $90.00.  These two keyboards are similar, with or without
wire; the wireless ones are black and the wired are white.  (Sejin
does make battleship wired keyboards; beware.)  Drawbacks include
too-small ESC, tab and control or caps-lock keys; and unusual
placement of | \ ` ~ keys (it's a shame that ANSI didn't standardise
ASCII keyboard layout before PCs existed).  I only swear at it when I
reach for ` and hit ESC instead, thus taking me out of hold mode.

We are currently trying the PFU Happy Hacking wired keyboards (see
www.pfuca.com).  They are expensive, but their virtues include: no
caps lock key; extreme small size: only 5 rows of keys with no keys
right of Return, for a total of 60 keys; and cables to connect to PS2,
Mac or Sun keyboard ports.  | \ ~ ` are in the upper right corner, so
I tend to hit ESC by mistake on this one too.  There is an `Fn' shift
key that overloads various keys.  Fn and a digit generates the key
code for that function key (e.g.  `Fn 3' acts like an F3 key).  `Fn /'
generates the down-arrow key code, and that's a minor nuisance when
you want to scroll.  DEL and BS (backspace) are on the same key by
default; not having unshifted Delete and Backspace keys is the biggest
nuisance we've found yet.  Initially, the Delete key normally
generates DEL and with the Fn shift key generates a BS.  `Fn `' also
generates DEL.  There is one switch, it selects one of four modes; two
of them make the Delete key always generate a BS, and that may be
preferable.  We like the rest of the keyboard enough that we've been
coping by typing control-H for BS (an old habit some of us developed
because the Backspace key has moved all over the keyboard over the
years).


Logitech used to make the best 3-button mice, wired and wireless, that
I have used since DePraz (the red 5620 mice).  Their original wireless
mice didn't suffer from `cord drag' but seemed a little less precise
than their wired mice, which is particularly noticeable in acme.
Since Scott Adams rewrote their mission statement, they seem to have
gone bonkers (or are now designing mice for non-humans).  They now
make mice with narrow vestigial middle buttons, mice with wheels
embedded in the buttons, mice with four buttons, mice with buttons on
the *side*, mice with the buttons in the wrong order (2 1 3 instead of
1 2 3, or middle left right instead of left middle right), and mice
that combine these wretched misfeatures.  The number of the buttons
shall be three: no more, no less.  Judging from their web site, they
also now churn their product line like the rest of the PC hardware
vendors.  When I last looked a few weeks ago (and this may be
completely different now), they had no usable wireless mice.  Their
new wireless mice combine wrong order, side button and sometimes wheel
within vestigial middle button.  They do usually have one usable wired
mouse in their line up, but it keeps changing model name and number
and colour.  The Mouseman for Notebook is fine but it needs a PS2
extender cable.  The `First Mouse' looks like their original mice, but
under another name.  Beware of the so-called `Mountain Bike Mouse'
which has a fourth button on the side that gets in the way and acts
like a middle button; I think it has a wheel embedded in the fourth
button too.  It's easy to spot due to the wide purple stripes and nubs
on the side (hence the nickname).

If Logitech don't shape up, we may have to find another mouse vendor,
though there aren't many contenders.  It might be wise to stock up on
decent mice if you can still find them.

[9fans] using mouse (was: ... using sam)

[Chris]

| We looked for successors to the Lexmark and tried the Behavioural
| Technologies BTC-5100 wired keyboard.

 I am fond of the BTC-5100C, although I don't know how different it
is from the BTC-5100. One of its sterling virtues is that it's small,
which means the mouse can be closer to my hands in their normal typing
position. It also has what I consider a good feel. I haven't had any
problems finding DEL/F1/F2 in a hurry, but then I use it all the time;
people who switch from keyboard to keyboard might have more problems.

 The BTC-5100C has a few extra keys over a typewriter (the cursor keys,
a small top row of ESC/function keys/Numlock/etc), and some useful keys
(PgUp, PgDown) have to be gotten at with a special shift key. But it
gives you almost everything a full-sized PClone keyboard would have,
which is sometimes useful.

 Downside: it is a PClone keyboard, so the ESC is above ~/` and CapsLock
is where the Control key should be.

| If Logitech don't shape up, we may have to find another mouse vendor,
| though there aren't many contenders.

 Logitech appears to make mice for a number of workstation and PClone
vendors (SGI and Digital, for example), so it may still be possible
to get sane Logitech mice by buying replacement workstation mice from
applicable vendors. This may be unfortunately expensive.

	- cks

[9fans] using mouse (was: ... using sam)

[Digby]

>
>> beginning to edit with the mouse is a bit like learning to drive:
>> at first it might seem strange and perhaps even dangerous
>> to have to move your hand away from the wheel to shift gears --
>> that's a common complaint (especially with manual transmission) --
>
>One factor that _might_ make a difference is your keyboard.
>
>http://www.pfuca.com/products/hhkb/hhkbindex.html advertises
>a keyboard that's _much_ smaller than most, which means
>moving your hand less to get to the mouse.
>
Might be worth a look - I hate these klunky PC style keyboards.
I almost never use any of the keys to the right of the carriage
return, so the rest are a waste of space, as are the function
keys. 

But any space that is freed would no doubt get filled, so my
mouse would still end up on top of the monitor most of the time :-/

>I haven't tried the keyboard myself (I think about US$200,
>which is a _lot_ for a keyboard), but it might make life
>easier for heavy mouse users.
>
It may be more than most keyboards, but in view of how
important a good keyboard is to a comfortable working
environment, I don't think US$200 would be a good
investment it it really was good. At my University
the terminals were made in house, and nearly as much
was spent on the keybaords as on the screen.
If I could by something of similar quality, I would.

But I would want good quality keys, with all the important
ones in sensible places, not just compact size.

>Has anyone tried it?
>
Regards,
DigbyT
-- 
Digby R. S. Tarvin                                              digbyt@acm.org
http://www.cthulhu.dircon.co.uk

[9fans] using mouse (was: ... using sam)

[Gary]

> beginning to edit with the mouse is a bit like learning to drive:
> at first it might seem strange and perhaps even dangerous
> to have to move your hand away from the wheel to shift gears --
> that's a common complaint (especially with manual transmission) --

One factor that _might_ make a difference is your keyboard.

http://www.pfuca.com/products/hhkb/hhkbindex.html advertises
a keyboard that's _much_ smaller than most, which means
moving your hand less to get to the mouse.

I haven't tried the keyboard myself (I think about US$200,
which is a _lot_ for a keyboard), but it might make life
easier for heavy mouse users.

Has anyone tried it?

Also on the topic of hardware for more pleasant mousing,
http://www.mmm.com/market/omc/om_html/cws_html/mousing.html
has some doco on a nifty mouse mat from 3M that
significantly cuts down on mouse slippage.