[9fans] An unsuccessful attempt to install on Thinkpad T43

[9fans] An unsuccessful attempt to install on Thinkpad T43

[Hongzheng Wang]

Hi all,

Today, I try to install Plan9 on a Thinkpad T43 laptop.
Unforturnately, this attemp failed at last; there are some difficult,
at least for me, problems I cannot solve.  So I am composing this post
to seek help.

The cd image I used is Feb 16 built version, downloaded from Plan9's
official website.  It looks different from a previous version I used
to install Plan9 on an old PC.  For example, after booting machine
with the cd, there are three options (install, livecd, and debug
livecd) instead.

The first problem I encountered is that DMA could not be enabled
during installation, although I have explicitly enable it when I am
asked.  As a result, the copydisc task is executed so slow.
Furthermore, it claims that some files cannot be copied since they
don't exist.  I try reinstall the system, but it seems that the
installation procedure prefer to continuing previous installation.
That is, it didn't try to recopy all files from cd and the missing
warnings are still there.  At last, I ignored them.

For boot method, since I have both Linux and XP on my laptop already,
I choose grub as multiple boot manager.  That is, I select `plan9' as
boot method when I am asked and don't install boot instructions into
MBR.  And configure grub to use `chainloader +1' to boot Plan9.

After booting into Plan9, it always stops at `boot from:'. After some
investigation, I found the problem is that the installation procedure
didn't copy kernel image 9pcf at all without any prompts.  This
problem is solved by mannually copying /386/9pcf on cd to 9fat
partition.  But the system often reports certain files are missing.
So I decide to reinstall the whole system.

I manually delete the Plan9 partition and format fossil.  So a fresh
installation is eventually executed.  Surprisingly, there are no
missing files warning again.  But when I try to boot it, the computer
always reports:
PCI System Error on Bus/Device/Function 0000h
and crashes, while Linux and XP can still be booted through grub.  I
don't know why yet :(

Another key problem is about the ethernet card.  Thinkpad T43 uses
Broadcom tg3 card and it seems that this card is not supported by
Plan9 yet since Broadcom refuses to open its hardware
specification(?).  So it becomes so difficult to search for answers
and information because I have to switch between Plan9 and Linux.

That's all.  Thanks.

--
HZ

Re: [9fans] An unsuccessful attempt to install on Thinkpad T43

[Eric Van Hensbergen]

Since you are already running Linux, you may want to consider lguest -
it solves the Ethernet problem and does not incur perceivable
performance penalties in the T43.

    -eric

On Mon, 18 Feb 2008 6:55 am, Hongzheng Wang wrote:
> Hi all,
>
> Today, I try to install Plan9 on a Thinkpad T43 laptop.
> Unforturnately, this attemp failed at last; there are some difficult,
> at least for me, problems I cannot solve.  So I am composing this post
> to seek help.
>
> The cd image I used is Feb 16 built version, downloaded from Plan9's
> official website.  It looks different from a previous version I used
> to install Plan9 on an old PC.  For example, after booting machine
> with the cd, there are three options (install, livecd, and debug
> livecd) instead.
>
> The first problem I encountered is that DMA could not be enabled
> during installation, although I have explicitly enable it when I am
> asked.  As a result, the copydisc task is executed so slow.
> Furthermore, it claims that some files cannot be copied since they
> don't exist.  I try reinstall the system, but it seems that the
> installation procedure prefer to continuing previous installation.
> That is, it didn't try to recopy all files from cd and the missing
> warnings are still there.  At last, I ignored them.
>
> For boot method, since I have both Linux and XP on my laptop already,
> I choose grub as multiple boot manager.  That is, I select `plan9' as
> boot method when I am asked and don't install boot instructions into
> MBR.  And configure grub to use `chainloader +1' to boot Plan9.
>
> After booting into Plan9, it always stops at `boot from:'. After some
> investigation, I found the problem is that the installation procedure
> didn't copy kernel image 9pcf at all without any prompts.  This
> problem is solved by mannually copying /386/9pcf on cd to 9fat
> partition.  But the system often reports certain files are missing.
> So I decide to reinstall the whole system.
>
> I manually delete the Plan9 partition and format fossil.  So a fresh
> installation is eventually executed.  Surprisingly, there are no
> missing files warning again.  But when I try to boot it, the computer
> always reports:
> PCI System Error on Bus/Device/Function 0000h
> and crashes, while Linux and XP can still be booted through grub.  I
> don't know why yet :(
>
> Another key problem is about the ethernet card.  Thinkpad T43 uses
> Broadcom tg3 card and it seems that this card is not supported by
> Plan9 yet since Broadcom refuses to open its hardware
> specification(?).  So it becomes so difficult to search for answers
> and information because I have to switch between Plan9 and Linux.
>
> That's all.  Thanks.
>
> --
> HZ

Re: [9fans] An unsuccessful attempt to install on Thinkpad T43

[Hongzheng Wang]

Thank you for your reply.

I am not familiar with lguest.  I browsed the documentation of lguest
but cannot grasp the core idea yet.  Is it something like vmware?

On Feb 18, 2008 11:43 PM, Eric Van Hensbergen <ericvh@gmail.com> wrote:
> Since you are already running Linux, you may want to consider lguest -
> it solves the Ethernet problem and does not incur perceivable
> performance penalties in the T43.
>
>     -eric
>
>
> On Mon, 18 Feb 2008 6:55 am, Hongzheng Wang wrote:
> > Hi all,
> >
> > Today, I try to install Plan9 on a Thinkpad T43 laptop.
> > Unforturnately, this attemp failed at last; there are some difficult,
> > at least for me, problems I cannot solve.  So I am composing this post
> > to seek help.
> >
> > The cd image I used is Feb 16 built version, downloaded from Plan9's
> > official website.  It looks different from a previous version I used
> > to install Plan9 on an old PC.  For example, after booting machine
> > with the cd, there are three options (install, livecd, and debug
> > livecd) instead.
> >
> > The first problem I encountered is that DMA could not be enabled
> > during installation, although I have explicitly enable it when I am
> > asked.  As a result, the copydisc task is executed so slow.
> > Furthermore, it claims that some files cannot be copied since they
> > don't exist.  I try reinstall the system, but it seems that the
> > installation procedure prefer to continuing previous installation.
> > That is, it didn't try to recopy all files from cd and the missing
> > warnings are still there.  At last, I ignored them.
> >
> > For boot method, since I have both Linux and XP on my laptop already,
> > I choose grub as multiple boot manager.  That is, I select `plan9' as
> > boot method when I am asked and don't install boot instructions into
> > MBR.  And configure grub to use `chainloader +1' to boot Plan9.
> >
> > After booting into Plan9, it always stops at `boot from:'. After some
> > investigation, I found the problem is that the installation procedure
> > didn't copy kernel image 9pcf at all without any prompts.  This
> > problem is solved by mannually copying /386/9pcf on cd to 9fat
> > partition.  But the system often reports certain files are missing.
> > So I decide to reinstall the whole system.
> >
> > I manually delete the Plan9 partition and format fossil.  So a fresh
> > installation is eventually executed.  Surprisingly, there are no
> > missing files warning again.  But when I try to boot it, the computer
> > always reports:
> > PCI System Error on Bus/Device/Function 0000h
> > and crashes, while Linux and XP can still be booted through grub.  I
> > don't know why yet :(
> >
> > Another key problem is about the ethernet card.  Thinkpad T43 uses
> > Broadcom tg3 card and it seems that this card is not supported by
> > Plan9 yet since Broadcom refuses to open its hardware
> > specification(?).  So it becomes so difficult to search for answers
> > and information because I have to switch between Plan9 and Linux.
> >
> > That's all.  Thanks.
> >
> > --
> > HZ
>



--
HZ

Re: [9fans] An unsuccessful attempt to install on Thinkpad T43

[Eric Van Hensbergen]

On Feb 19, 2008 12:01 AM, Hongzheng Wang <wanghz@gmail.com> wrote:
> Thank you for your reply.
>
> I am not familiar with lguest.  I browsed the documentation of lguest
> but cannot grasp the core idea yet.  Is it something like vmware?
>

Yes - but much more simple.  Ron Minnich has THNX (tiny horrible not
xen) which is essentially a USB flash-stick pacakged boot environment
for Plan 9 running on top of lguest under Linux with full graphics,
network, etc.  What you want to do is replicate that without the flash
disk and using your underlying Linux (assuming you have or can upgrade
to a kernel which has lguest).  There was a presentation and paper at
the last IWP9 discussing it.  Perhaps Ron can point us at the most
recent repository of all his stuff.

            -eric

[9fans] An unsuccessful attempt to install on Thinkpad T43

[Hongzheng Wang]

Really interesing :-)  I hope I can see Ron's reply as soon as
possible.  Thanks.


On Feb 19, 2008 10:04 PM, Eric Van Hensbergen <ericvh@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Yes - but much more simple.  Ron Minnich has THNX (tiny horrible not
> xen) which is essentially a USB flash-stick pacakged boot environment
> for Plan 9 running on top of lguest under Linux with full graphics,
> network, etc.  What you want to do is replicate that without the flash
> disk and using your underlying Linux (assuming you have or can upgrade
> to a kernel which has lguest).  There was a presentation and paper at
> the last IWP9 discussing it.  Perhaps Ron can point us at the most
> recent repository of all his stuff.
>
>             -eric
>



--
HZ



--
HZ

Re: [9fans] An unsuccessful attempt to install on Thinkpad T43

[Hongzheng Wang]

Hello,

At last, I installed qemu on my laptop, and built plain9 in this
virtual environment.  It seems that the performance is yet acceptable.
 I think, although it is not a perfect solution (I'd like to run plan9
on my laptop natively), it might be an easy and happy one :-)

On Mon, Feb 18, 2008 at 11:43 PM, Eric Van Hensbergen <ericvh@gmail.com> wrote:
> Since you are already running Linux, you may want to consider lguest -
>  it solves the Ethernet problem and does not incur perceivable
>  performance penalties in the T43.
>
>     -eric

--
HZ

Re: [9fans] An unsuccessful attempt to install on Thinkpad T43

[Alexander Sychev]

Hello!
On Mon, 18 Feb 2008 15:55:14 +0300, Hongzheng Wang <wanghz@gmail.com>
wrote:

> For boot method, since I have both Linux and XP on my laptop already,
> I choose grub as multiple boot manager.  That is, I select `plan9' as
> boot method when I am asked and don't install boot instructions into
> MBR.  And configure grub to use `chainloader +1' to boot Plan9.
>

AFAIK, Plan9 needs a first free partition for installation. I use Plan9 on
ThinkPad T40 installed in the first partition and boot it with LILO via
'chain' rule.


--
Best regards,
   santucco

Re: [9fans] An unsuccessful attempt to install on Thinkpad T43

[Hongzheng Wang]

Hi,

But even for the same install cd and partition scheme, the
installation is success for the first time ( execpt that some files
are missing when system is in use) and could not be booted at all for
the second time.  This is really strange :(


On Feb 19, 2008 4:52 PM, Alexander Sychev <santucco@gmail.com> wrote:
> Hello!
> On Mon, 18 Feb 2008 15:55:14 +0300, Hongzheng Wang <wanghz@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
> > For boot method, since I have both Linux and XP on my laptop already,
> > I choose grub as multiple boot manager.  That is, I select `plan9' as
> > boot method when I am asked and don't install boot instructions into
> > MBR.  And configure grub to use `chainloader +1' to boot Plan9.
> >
>
> AFAIK, Plan9 needs a first free partition for installation. I use Plan9 on
> ThinkPad T40 installed in the first partition and boot it with LILO via
> 'chain' rule.
>
>
> --
> Best regards,
>    santucco
>



--
HZ

Re: [9fans] An unsuccessful attempt to install on Thinkpad T43

[john]

> Hi,
>
> But even for the same install cd and partition scheme, the
> installation is success for the first time ( execpt that some files
> are missing when system is in use) and could not be booted at all for
> the second time.  This is really strange :(
>
>
> On Feb 19, 2008 4:52 PM, Alexander Sychev <santucco@gmail.com> wrote:
>> Hello!
>> On Mon, 18 Feb 2008 15:55:14 +0300, Hongzheng Wang <wanghz@gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>> > For boot method, since I have both Linux and XP on my laptop already,
>> > I choose grub as multiple boot manager.  That is, I select `plan9' as
>> > boot method when I am asked and don't install boot instructions into
>> > MBR.  And configure grub to use `chainloader +1' to boot Plan9.
>> >
>>
>> AFAIK, Plan9 needs a first free partition for installation. I use Plan9 on
>> ThinkPad T40 installed in the first partition and boot it with LILO via
>> 'chain' rule.
>>

First off, Plan 9 does not need to be on the first free partition. I
have it installed on the second partition on my laptop and it boots
fine.
As for the rest of your problems... I suggest getting the latest CD,
to start with. Then, under Linux, do this (if your Plan 9 partition
is /dev/hda1): "dd if=/dev/zero of=/dev/hda1 bs=1024" to be on the
safe side. I've noticed that if you don't zero the disk, even if you
reinstall and have the installer format fossil etc., you'll end up
with all the old files still on your disk--highly annoying. After
you've zeroed the partition, you can try installing again.

Or, of course, you can try the lguest thing, but I for one like
running native.

Good luck!

John

Re: [9fans] An unsuccessful attempt to install on Thinkpad T43

[Hongzheng Wang]

Hi John,

Many thanks.  Your tip, zeroing the partition mannually first, may
answer the strange thing I encountered during installation.  And, I
also prefer to native running Plan9.  But an installation without
workable ethernet is quite unacceptable.  So I might try the method
Eric recommended first.  Alternatively, I will try to config the
previously installed Plan9 to be a  CPU server.

On Wed, Feb 20, 2008 at 1:10 AM,  <john@csplan9.rit.edu> wrote:
>
>  First off, Plan 9 does not need to be on the first free partition. I
>  have it installed on the second partition on my laptop and it boots
>  fine.
>  As for the rest of your problems... I suggest getting the latest CD,
>  to start with. Then, under Linux, do this (if your Plan 9 partition
>  is /dev/hda1): "dd if=/dev/zero of=/dev/hda1 bs=1024" to be on the
>  safe side. I've noticed that if you don't zero the disk, even if you
>  reinstall and have the installer format fossil etc., you'll end up
>  with all the old files still on your disk--highly annoying. After
>  you've zeroed the partition, you can try installing again.
>
>  Or, of course, you can try the lguest thing, but I for one like
>  running native.
>
>  Good luck!
>
>  John
>
>



--
HZ

Re: [9fans] An unsuccessful attempt to install on Thinkpad T43

[Kernel Panic]

Hongzheng Wang wrote:

>Hi John,
>
>Many thanks.  Your tip, zeroing the partition mannually first, may
>answer the strange thing I encountered during installation.  And, I
>also prefer to native running Plan9.  But an installation without
>workable ethernet is quite unacceptable.  So I might try the method
>Eric recommended first.  Alternatively, I will try to config the
>previously installed Plan9 to be a  CPU server.
>
>
>
is this nic integrated into the mainboard or can it be replaced (some sort
of mini pci slot)? maybe a pcmcia network card will do?

cinap

Re: [9fans] An unsuccessful attempt to install on Thinkpad T43

[Hongzheng Wang]

Using another new network card shoule be ok.  But extra cost is needed :P

On Wed, Feb 20, 2008 at 11:15 PM, Kernel Panic <cinap_lenrek@gmx.de> wrote:
> Hongzheng Wang wrote:
>
>  >Hi John,
>  >
>  >Many thanks.  Your tip, zeroing the partition mannually first, may
>  >answer the strange thing I encountered during installation.  And, I
>  >also prefer to native running Plan9.  But an installation without
>  >workable ethernet is quite unacceptable.  So I might try the method
>  >Eric recommended first.  Alternatively, I will try to config the
>  >previously installed Plan9 to be a  CPU server.
>  >
>  >
>  >
>  is this nic integrated into the mainboard or can it be replaced (some sort
>  of mini pci slot)? maybe a pcmcia network card will do?
>
>  cinap
>



--
HZ

Re: [9fans] An unsuccessful attempt to install on Thinkpad T43

[Federico G. Benavento]

I got a tullip clone for less than US$ 5

On Feb 20, 2008 12:26 PM, Hongzheng Wang <wanghz@gmail.com> wrote:
> Using another new network card shoule be ok.  But extra cost is needed :P
>
>
> On Wed, Feb 20, 2008 at 11:15 PM, Kernel Panic <cinap_lenrek@gmx.de> wrote:
> > Hongzheng Wang wrote:
> >
> >  >Hi John,
> >  >
> >  >Many thanks.  Your tip, zeroing the partition mannually first, may
> >  >answer the strange thing I encountered during installation.  And, I
> >  >also prefer to native running Plan9.  But an installation without
> >  >workable ethernet is quite unacceptable.  So I might try the method
> >  >Eric recommended first.  Alternatively, I will try to config the
> >  >previously installed Plan9 to be a  CPU server.
> >  >
> >  >
> >  >
> >  is this nic integrated into the mainboard or can it be replaced (some sort
> >  of mini pci slot)? maybe a pcmcia network card will do?
> >
> >  cinap
> >
>
>
>
> --
> HZ
>



--
Federico G. Benavento

Re: [9fans] An unsuccessful attempt to install on Thinkpad T43

[john]

> I got a tullip clone for less than US$ 5
>
> On Feb 20, 2008 12:26 PM, Hongzheng Wang <wanghz@gmail.com> wrote:
>> Using another new network card shoule be ok.  But extra cost is needed :P
>>
>>
>> On Wed, Feb 20, 2008 at 11:15 PM, Kernel Panic <cinap_lenrek@gmx.de> wrote:
>> > Hongzheng Wang wrote:
>> >
>> >  >Hi John,
>> >  >
>> >  >Many thanks.  Your tip, zeroing the partition mannually first, may
>> >  >answer the strange thing I encountered during installation.  And, I
>> >  >also prefer to native running Plan9.  But an installation without
>> >  >workable ethernet is quite unacceptable.  So I might try the method
>> >  >Eric recommended first.  Alternatively, I will try to config the
>> >  >previously installed Plan9 to be a  CPU server.
>> >  >
>> >  >
>> >  >
>> >  is this nic integrated into the mainboard or can it be replaced (some sort
>> >  of mini pci slot)? maybe a pcmcia network card will do?
>> >
>> >  cinap
>> >

If we're still talking about a Thinkpad T43, your average cheap/free 100Mbit
card isn't going to cut it. I'm partial to the 3Com Etherlink cards myself,
since they seem to be very plentiful and very cheap (or free). Laptops are
a tricky business. If you can get an orinoco wireless card, that ought to
work well provided you don't need WPA.

John

Re: [9fans] An unsuccessful attempt to install on Thinkpad T43

[Hongzheng Wang]

Another reason for configuring Plan9, which is installed on another
PC, as a CPU server, rather than struggling with T43, is that I still
prefer to Linux as my daily work platform.  Plan9 is, on the other
hand, yet a research and experiment testbed for me.

On Wed, Feb 20, 2008 at 11:26 PM, Hongzheng Wang <wanghz@gmail.com> wrote:
> Using another new network card shoule be ok.  But extra cost is needed :P

--
HZ

Re: [9fans] An unsuccessful attempt to install on Thinkpad T43

[Kernel Panic]

Hongzheng Wang wrote:

>Using another new network card shoule be ok.  But extra cost is needed :P
>
>
sorry... this is just the simplest obvious thing someone can do... the
other option
would be writing/porting a driver and i guess thats a lot harder.
but maybe here is hope... ron mentiond on irc that he will try porting
ndis-wrapper
to plan9 to get more wlan-hardware supported.

but i would not wait for it... just find a temoprary solution and keep
on... if
here is a better solution in the future, you can switch to it and sell
your replacement
card to ebay or something :-)

>On Wed, Feb 20, 2008 at 11:15 PM, Kernel Panic <cinap_lenrek@gmx.de> wrote:
>
>
>>Hongzheng Wang wrote:
>>
>> >Hi John,
>> >
>> >Many thanks.  Your tip, zeroing the partition mannually first, may
>> >answer the strange thing I encountered during installation.  And, I
>> >also prefer to native running Plan9.  But an installation without
>> >workable ethernet is quite unacceptable.  So I might try the method
>> >Eric recommended first.  Alternatively, I will try to config the
>> >previously installed Plan9 to be a  CPU server.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> is this nic integrated into the mainboard or can it be replaced (some sort
>> of mini pci slot)? maybe a pcmcia network card will do?
>>
>> cinap
>>
>>

cinap

Re: [9fans] An unsuccessful attempt to install on Thinkpad T43

[Alexander Sychev]

On Tue, 19 Feb 2008 20:10:14 +0300, john@csplan9.rit.edu
<john@csplan9.rit.edu> wrote:

> First off, Plan 9 does not need to be on the first free partition. I
> have it installed on the second partition on my laptop and it boots
> fine.

Oh, sorry, Plan9 needs a free PRIMARY partition.
I was wrong.

--
Best regards,
   santucco