Re: [9front] cwfs and hjfs

Re: [9front] cwfs and hjfs

[sl]

> I replaced this by SanDisk SDHC 4GB sd card.
> it improved the speed high.   However, it is
> still slow for me.
> To use Japanese, I use ktrans, and the speed is
> very slow.   It takes 2 to 3 seconds after I hit 
> transkation key.   Also, it is difficult to acquire
> update by hg, where it stops on its work.
> 
> I'd like to use cwfs on this SD card pi.

Hi Kenji,

In fqa4[0] we recommend at least 12GB for a cwfs installation. By default,
cwfs uses 16KB blocks and creates three separate subdivisions within the Plan 9
partition (worm, other, fscache), which ends up requiring more working space
than hjfs with it's 4KB blocks and single partition. At 4GB you may run out
of space fairly quickly after rebuilding the system and periodic dumps are
taken into account.

It also seems unlikely that file system speed is really your bottleneck. I used
the rpi tcp booted (no local disk access after boot) and experienced similar
problems. The USB ethernet seems to tax the system severely: when the network
was active I routinely experienced dropouts in typing on my USB keyboard. This
could also be related to voltage.

For what it's worth, the cat-v.org sites run on hjfs (at ramnode.com, KVM
backed by an SSD).

sl

[0] http://code.google.com/p/plan9front/wiki/fqa4#4.3.6_-_configfs

Re: [9front] cwfs and hjfs

[hiro]

The SD doesn't use USB.
Only thing I know is that SD gets unstable when you overclock the rpi.

But I also experienced that everything with rpi is just very slow. My
Celeron 400MHz with windows98 is much more responsive.

Re: [9front] cwfs and hjfs

[kokamoto]

> The SD doesn't use USB.
> Only thing I know is that SD gets unstable when you overclock the rpi.

The no-brand SD card I used had trouble even to compile programs.

Kenji

Re: [9front] cwfs and hjfs

[kokamoto]

> The SD doesn't use USB.
He said it when we use the root from tcp case.

> Only thing I know is that SD gets unstable when you overclock the rpi.

Why you can be so CONFIDENTIAL?
You know very little may be the solution.
Why you don't think of such possibility?
I remind the 2ちゃんねる every time I read your comments.

By the way, the no-brand SD card I used had trouble 
even to compile programs.

Kenji

Re: [9front] cwfs and hjfs

[kokamoto]

Thanks sl

> than hjfs with it's 4KB blocks and single partition. At 4GB you may run out
> of space fairly quickly after rebuilding the system and periodic dumps are
> taken into account.

Now I got why 9front people use hjfs instead of cwfs for 9pi.

> It also seems unlikely that file system speed is really your bottleneck. I used
> the rpi tcp booted (no local disk access after boot) and experienced similar
> problems. The USB ethernet seems to tax the system severely: when the network
> was active I routinely experienced dropouts in typing on my USB keyboard. This
> could also be related to voltage.

Yes, when I use root from tcp, many things got better.
Richard's rpi has the option of ipconfig='....' in cmdline.txt,
but 9front-9pi doesn't.   I had to use termrc.local to setup ipconfig line.
This means two versions have some diference in the firmware?

> For what it's worth, the cat-v.org sites run on hjfs (at ramnode.com, KVM
> backed by an SSD).

The reason why I tried 9front-rpi instead of original one is that I cannot cpu
from the original to our 9ront cpu machine.   This is neccessary to read pdf
files on the 9pi terminal.☺

Kenji

Re: [9front] cwfs and hjfs

[kokamoto]

I forgot one thing.

When I use ktrans, things happen like this:

^n (or 漢字key on Japanese key board)
かんじ
<shif>+<space> (or 変換key)
then above ひらがな inputs will be translated to
漢字 on the screen.

I said this translation speed is too slow
on hjfs 9pi.

In this case network is no matter, because just to read 
$home/lib/ktrans-jisho file and write (to cosole), I think.

Kenji

Re: [9front] cwfs and hjfs

[kokamoto]

I tried to pxe boot of the pi box, but failed.
We don't have 9bootpxe for rpi...

I understand now hjfs is for the replacement of kfs.
Ok, then I'll try to find a way to use cpu command
from Richard's 9pi to our 9front network.

Kenji

Re: [9front] cwfs and hjfs

[cinap_lenrek]

> Richard's rpi has the option of ipconfig='....' in cmdline.txt,
> but 9front-9pi doesn't.   I had to use termrc.local to setup ipconfig line.
> This means two versions have some diference in the firmware?

what is ipconfig='....' doing? you always could specify arguments
to ipconfig with the tcp[!....] boot method. should work as well
on labs.

so, what does ipconfig='....' do differently than bootargs=tcp!....?

--
cinap

Re: [9front] cwfs and hjfs

[kokamoto]

> what is ipconfig='....' doing? you always could specify arguments
> to ipconfig with the tcp[!....] boot method. should work as well
> on labs.
in cmdline.txt of Richard's is:
readparts=1 bootargs=local!#S/sdM0/fossil ipconfig='-g 192.168.11.1 ether /net/ether0 192.168.11.17 255.255.255.0' kbmap=/boot/jp.

So I wrote the same phrase of ipconfig= line to
9front's /n/pidos/cmdline.txt, but it doen't work.
I had to write my /rc/bin/termrc.local including the above ipconfig=
line.

Kenji

Re: [9front] cwfs and hjfs

[cinap_lenrek]

oh, you'r not netbooting! ok. in 9front, you'd just
use static network configuration in ndb, or, if your
setup is more complicated like having multiple ethernet
cards, put ipconfig command in /cfg/$sysname/(term|cpu)rc
to set stuff up.

theres no reason for the kernel to setup the network
before mounting root filesystem. this is only neccesary
when you do pxe/network boot and thats covered by
bootargs of tcp[!ipconfig args ...].

--
cinap

Re: [9front] cwfs and hjfs

[kokamoto]

>> what is ipconfig='....' doing? you always could specify arguments
>> to ipconfig with the tcp[!....] boot method. should work as well
>> on labs.

I've been using static ip address even for terminals.
This is my custum, which may be originate the fact I bootup
terminals without dhcp/dns server sometime.
However, it's time to change this because I got energy-saving
file/auth etc server like A68N-5000...

Kenji

Re: [9front] cwfs and hjfs

[cinap_lenrek]

you can do static ip configuration with bootargs like:

tcp!-g 192.168.0.1 ether /net/ether0 192.168.0.23 255.255.255.0

where 192.168.0.1 is the gateway, 192.168.0.23 is your static ip
address and 255.255.255.0 is the subnet mask.

everthing after tcp! is just passed as arguments to ipconfig.

you can even pass file and auth servers like that, just look up
ipconfig(8). thats why i dont understand the usefullness of
that new ipconfig= parameter.

if your machine boots from a local disk fileserver, then
you do not need this. you boot with local!/some/disk and
termrc sets up network from ndb, static or dynamic.
 
--
cinap

cwfs and hjfs

[kokamoto]

I made cinap's 9pi SD, and found it was built
for hjfs.

Is the /dev/sdM0/fs is compatible, if I use cwfs
on the same media?

I know I'd be better to help t0 debug the experimental
hjfs.   However, I want to confine my effort to another now,
therefore I'd like to use cwfs also on 9pif, because it 
is much faster than hjfs in my environment (micro SD card).

Kenji

Re: [9front] cwfs and hjfs

[dante]

Hi,

In my opinion, you should use the stable cwfs.
I don't think it is a good idea to confront new users (that need to 
learn the system first) with an experimental file system.
I tried hjfs as a newbie myself and only had problems and lacked the 
knowledge to debug it so I moved on to stock Plan9.
What a deterrent!

Cheers,
Dante

On 25.08.2014 05:33, kokamoto@hera.eonet.ne.jp wrote:
> I made cinap's 9pi SD, and found it was built
> for hjfs.
> 
> Is the /dev/sdM0/fs is compatible, if I use cwfs
> on the same media?
> 
> I know I'd be better to help t0 debug the experimental
> hjfs.   However, I want to confine my effort to another now,
> therefore I'd like to use cwfs also on 9pif, because it
> is much faster than hjfs in my environment (micro SD card).
> 
> Kenji

Re: [9front] cwfs and hjfs

[kokamoto]

Thanks Dante

> In my opinion, you should use the stable cwfs.

After I reported the problem, I found the problem was
in the SD card itself.
I used cheap no-brand micro SD card, not intended
just took a cheaper one at the store, which is very
unstable.   One time it suceeds to read data from it, 
one time not.  I could not find any systematics on that.
I'll replace it soon, and retry.

Kenji

Re: [9front] cwfs and hjfs

[kokamoto]

> I'll replace it soon, and retry.

I replaced this by SanDisk SDHC 4GB sd card.
it improved the speed high.   However, it is
still slow for me.
To use Japanese, I use ktrans, and the speed is
very slow.   It takes 2 to 3 seconds after I hit 
transkation key.   Also, it is difficult to acquire
update by hg, where it stops on its work.

I'd like to use cwfs on this SD card pi.

Kenji