[Caml-list] is ocaml 3.07 object-file compatible with 3.06?

[Caml-list] is ocaml 3.07 object-file compatible with 3.06?

[Basile STARYNKEVITCH]

A question to the caml team whose answer would probably be interesting
to the whole list.

Is the beta (or the final, when available) release of 3.07 compatible
at the the object level with 3.06? In other words, if my application
uses a lot of (findlib managed) third parties' libraries, do I need to
recompile all of them, or can I use ocaml 3.07 to link with libraries
compiled with ocaml 3.06?

BTW, I did search (the 'format4' word) in the beta documentation of
3.07 and did not found a clear explanation of the long awaited
('a,'b,'c,'d) Pervasives.format4 type - I would like a *detailed*
explanation of what 'a 'b 'c 'd type variables stand for (even if I do
guess partly what they are for).

Are there any hints for using format4 strings with localisation (ie a
wrapper to gettext)?
-- 

Basile STARYNKEVITCH         http://starynkevitch.net/Basile/ 
email: basile<at>starynkevitch<dot>net 
aliases: basile<at>tunes<dot>org = bstarynk<at>nerim<dot>net
8, rue de la Faïencerie, 92340 Bourg La Reine, France

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Re: [Caml-list] is ocaml 3.07 object-file compatible with 3.06?

[Xavier Leroy]

> Is the beta (or the final, when available) release of 3.07 compatible
> at the the object level with 3.06? In other words, if my application
> uses a lot of (findlib managed) third parties' libraries, do I need to
> recompile all of them, or can I use ocaml 3.07 to link with libraries
> compiled with ocaml 3.06?

You need to recompile all third-party libraries.  The format of Caml
compiled files didn't change, but the standard library interfaces
(Pervasives, etc) against which these libs were compiled changed
between 3.06 and 3.07beta.  And you might have to recompile again when
3.07 is out.

If you try to use these libraries without recompiling them, you'll get
plenty of "Files xxx and yyy make inconsistent assumptions about
module Z".

That should explain why we really need some kind of library packaging
tools: so that such recompilations can be performed automatically by
the packaging tool.

> BTW, I did search (the 'format4' word) in the beta documentation of
> 3.07 and did not found a clear explanation of the long awaited
> ('a,'b,'c,'d) Pervasives.format4 type - I would like a *detailed*
> explanation of what 'a 'b 'c 'd type variables stand for (even if I do
> guess partly what they are for).

A *detailed* explanation would be one page of inference rules,
paraphrasing the code in Typecore.type_format.  I'm not sure this will
really help...  

However, it's easy to explain the difference between the old type
('a,'b,'c) format and the new type ('a,'b,'c1,'c2) format4:
in type format, 'c is both the type of the final result of the
printf-like function (e.g. unit for fprintf and string for sprintf)
*and* the result type for the function parameters corresponding to %a
and %t formats.  In type format4, these two roles are divided between two
independent variables 'c1 and 'c2.  There are cases (as with kprintf)
where different types are required for these two roles.

> Are there any hints for using format4 strings with localisation (ie a
> wrapper to gettext)?

The same hints that I gave in an earlier post in terms of the
"format" type apply equally well to the "format4" type.

- Xavier Leroy

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Re: [Caml-list] is ocaml 3.07 object-file compatible with 3.06?

[Stefano Zacchiroli]

On Fri, Jul 25, 2003 at 10:56:32AM +0200, Xavier Leroy wrote:
> If you try to use these libraries without recompiling them, you'll get
> plenty of "Files xxx and yyy make inconsistent assumptions about
> module Z".

If you think it's useful you can try a tool we are using for debian
packaging to discover where those incosistencies are. The tool (namely
"tofubar") scans a set of ocaml objects/interfaces or the ocaml standard
library and, using objinfo to discover them, print out inconsistencies.

tofubar is a simple ocaml _script_ and is available here:
  http://bononia.it/zack/stuff/tofubar.ml

Cheers.

-- 
Stefano Zacchiroli  --  Master in Computer Science @ Uni. Bologna, Italy
zack@{cs.unibo.it,debian.org,bononia.it}  -  http://www.bononia.it/zack/
"  I know you believe you understood what you think I said, but I am not
sure you realize that what you heard is not what I meant!  " -- G.Romney

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Re: [Caml-list] is ocaml 3.07 object-file compatible with 3.06?

[Debian User]

On Thu, Jul 24, 2003 at 01:36:59PM +0200, Basile STARYNKEVITCH wrote:
> A question to the caml team whose answer would probably be interesting
> to the whole list.
> 
> Is the beta (or the final, when available) release of 3.07 compatible
> at the the object level with 3.06? In other words, if my application
> uses a lot of (findlib managed) third parties' libraries, do I need to
> recompile all of them, or can I use ocaml 3.07 to link with libraries
> compiled with ocaml 3.06?
> 
> BTW, I did search (the 'format4' word) in the beta documentation of
> 3.07 and did not found a clear explanation of the long awaited
> ('a,'b,'c,'d) Pervasives.format4 type - I would like a *detailed*
> explanation of what 'a 'b 'c 'd type variables stand for (even if I do
> guess partly what they are for).
> 
> Are there any hints for using format4 strings with localisation (ie a
> wrapper to gettext)?
> -- 
> 

Hello,

Are you interested in gettext ? I have write a bind to gettext function
+ a patch to xgettext for extracting string. The package is not mature
enough to be submited, but i will give it in one or two month. But i
need beta tester...

If you or any other people on the list are intersted....

Sylvain LE GALL

ps : if you have any hint about having a solution without Obj.magic for
the format4, i take it. 
pps : in fact i am trying to build something with camlp4 and  <" ">
string, but i do it without any reference... If someone, has any idea.

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Re: [Caml-list] is ocaml 3.07 object-file compatible with 3.06?

[Michal Moskal]

On Fri, Jul 25, 2003 at 06:38:39PM +0200, Debian User wrote:
> Are you interested in gettext ? I have write a bind to gettext function
> + a patch to xgettext for extracting string. 

No need to write a patch (that probably won't get accepted), you just need
to generate .pot file, and then run msgmarge. We got such thing for shell
scripts (it's 2k of perl), so it shouldn't be hard to write it for ocaml.

> The package is not mature
> enough to be submited, but i will give it in one or two month. But i
> need beta tester...

IMHO you should not be afraid of putting stuff on ftp, hump or whatever,
even when you don't think it's mature enough. People will often use
half-finished stuff.

-- 
: Michal Moskal :: http://www.kernel.pl/~malekith : GCS {C,UL}++++$ a? !tv
: When in doubt, use brute force. -- Ken Thompson : {E-,w}-- {b++,e}>+++ h

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Re: [Caml-list] is ocaml 3.07 object-file compatible with 3.06?

[Sylvain LE GALL]

On Fri, Jul 25, 2003 at 08:05:46PM +0200, Michal Moskal wrote:
> On Fri, Jul 25, 2003 at 06:38:39PM +0200, Debian User wrote:
> > Are you interested in gettext ? I have write a bind to gettext function
> > + a patch to xgettext for extracting string. 
> 
> No need to write a patch (that probably won't get accepted), you just need
> to generate .pot file, and then run msgmarge. We got such thing for shell
> scripts (it's 2k of perl), so it shouldn't be hard to write it for ocaml.
> 

.... :->

you don't understand me : the patch is already made. I have use it
against the code of cameleon ( around 1000 lines of code ). It works, it
extract all strings etc. So it is done.

> > The package is not mature
> > enough to be submited, but i will give it in one or two month. But i
> > need beta tester...
> 
> IMHO you should not be afraid of putting stuff on ftp, hump or whatever,
> even when you don't think it's mature enough. People will often use
> half-finished stuff.
> 

Yep, but it is a case of personnal taste... I hate work which is not
almost finished...

Regard
Sylvain LE GALL

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Re: [Caml-list] is ocaml 3.07 object-file compatible with 3.06?

[Michal Moskal]

On Sat, Jul 26, 2003 at 12:32:29AM +0200, Sylvain LE GALL wrote:
> On Fri, Jul 25, 2003 at 08:05:46PM +0200, Michal Moskal wrote:
> > On Fri, Jul 25, 2003 at 06:38:39PM +0200, Debian User wrote:
> > > Are you interested in gettext ? I have write a bind to gettext function
> > > + a patch to xgettext for extracting string. 
> > 
> > No need to write a patch (that probably won't get accepted), you just need
> > to generate .pot file, and then run msgmarge. We got such thing for shell
> > scripts (it's 2k of perl), so it shouldn't be hard to write it for ocaml.
> > 
> 
> .... :->
> 
> you don't understand me : the patch is already made. I have use it
> against the code of cameleon ( around 1000 lines of code ). It works, it
> extract all strings etc. So it is done.

I mean it won't get accepted by gettext authors, so you force users to
use non-standard version of standard tool, which is Bad Thing. It's far
easier to use standalone tool that does just one thing.

-- 
: Michal Moskal :: http://www.kernel.pl/~malekith : GCS {C,UL}++++$ a? !tv
: When in doubt, use brute force. -- Ken Thompson : {E-,w}-- {b++,e}>+++ h

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Re: [Caml-list] is ocaml 3.07 object-file compatible with 3.06?

[Sylvain LE GALL]

On Wed, Aug 06, 2003 at 01:24:18PM +0200, Michal Moskal wrote:
> On Sat, Jul 26, 2003 at 12:32:29AM +0200, Sylvain LE GALL wrote:
> > On Fri, Jul 25, 2003 at 08:05:46PM +0200, Michal Moskal wrote:
> > > On Fri, Jul 25, 2003 at 06:38:39PM +0200, Debian User wrote:
> > > > Are you interested in gettext ? I have write a bind to gettext function
> > > > + a patch to xgettext for extracting string. 
> > > 
> > > No need to write a patch (that probably won't get accepted), you just need
> > > to generate .pot file, and then run msgmarge. We got such thing for shell
> > > scripts (it's 2k of perl), so it shouldn't be hard to write it for ocaml.
> > > 
> > 
> > .... :->
> > 
> > you don't understand me : the patch is already made. I have use it
> > against the code of cameleon ( around 1000 lines of code ). It works, it
> > extract all strings etc. So it is done.
> 
> I mean it won't get accepted by gettext authors, so you force users to
> use non-standard version of standard tool, which is Bad Thing. It's far
> easier to use standalone tool that does just one thing.
> 

Hello,

Why it won't be accepted by gettext author ? As it is written in his
TODO file, he wants more langage to be accepted by xgettext. I will
offer him a ocaml support. Is it not good ?

Regard
Sylvain LE GALL

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