elp-wrapper sneaking into .newsrc.eld

elp-wrapper sneaking into .newsrc.eld

[Dan Christensen]

I just restarted Gnus and emacs, and now can't enter any groups.
Somehow elp-wrapper has gotten into my .newsrc.eld file.  I was doing
profiling earlier today, and I have (gnus-compile) in my .gnus.el.
Re-running gnus-compile doesn't seem to help.  Any suggestions?

Backtrace below with control characters deleted.  Below that is
the tail end of my .newsrc.eld.

Please Cc me on replies, or else I won't see them!

Thanks,

Dan

Debugger entered--Lisp error: (void-function elp-wrapper)
  elp-wrapper(gnus-summary-line-message-size nil ([74719 "Re: RSS setup (encoding and link problems)" "Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen <larsi@gnus.org>" "Sun, 05 Dec 2010 22:27:43 +0100" "<m3r5dvewq8.fsf@quimbies.gnus.org>" "<87r5dv9apd.fsf@gmx.co.uk>" 5672 38 "news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.gnus.general:74719" nil]))
  byte-code("\306.\307\310	\n\311\v!\f\vC.\312\313\306.#)\314\v!\315\v\316H!&\bc\210i\317V\203E.`.\x1f\320\317!\317U\2038.`.\x1f|\210\202A.`S.\x1f|\210\321c\210)\202N.\322\323\317iZ\324]\"\210\321c\210`.. c\210\325`\307\326\327\211\330\v.!\"!.\"\331.\"!\332V\203w.\333.\"\324\332#\202y..\")!.\"\332\331.\"!Z\211.#\324V\203\227.\306.\"\334.#\323\"Q\202\231..\"*\"c\210`.$.%$\210\307\335.&.'.($c\210\b\205\272.\325\b\211T\300\336$)\207" [gnus-position gnus-tmp-unread gnus-tmp-replied gnus-tmp-header gnus-tmp-lines args nil format "%c%c%s%5sL %4s %4s %-10s" gnus-user-format-function-t elp-wrapper gnus-summary-line-message-size gnus-user-format-function-s gnus-user-date 3 31 move-to-column " " insert-char 32 0 gnus-put-text-property "%-23s" eval gnus-summary-from-or-to-or-newsgroups string-width 23 gnus-correct-substring make-string " %c%s%c\n" t end gnus-tmp-indentation gnus-tmp-from val need gnus-mouse-face-prop gnus-mouse-face gnus-tmp-opening-bracket gnus-tmp-subject-or-nil gnus-tmp-closing-bracket] 12)
  eval((byte-code "\306.\307\310	\n\311\v!\f\vC.\312\313\306.#)\314\v!\315\v\316H!&\bc\210i\317V\203E.`.\x1f\320\317!\317U\2038.`.\x1f|\210\202A.`S.\x1f|\210\321c\210)\202N.\322\323\317iZ\324]\"\210\321c\210`.. c\210\325`\307\326\327\211\330\v.!\"!.\"\331.\"!\332V\203w.\333.\"\324\332#\202y..\")!.\"\332\331.\"!Z\211.#\324V\203\227.\306.\"\334.#\323\"Q\202\231..\"*\"c\210`.$.%$\210\307\335.&.'.($c\210\b\205\272.\325\b\211T\300\336$)\207" [gnus-position gnus-tmp-unread gnus-tmp-replied gnus-tmp-header gnus-tmp-lines args nil format "%c%c%s%5sL %4s %4s %-10s" gnus-user-format-function-t elp-wrapper gnus-summary-line-message-size gnus-user-format-function-s gnus-user-date 3 31 move-to-column " " insert-char 32 0 gnus-put-text-property "%-23s" eval gnus-summary-from-or-to-or-newsgroups string-width 23 gnus-correct-substring make-string " %c%s%c\n" t end gnus-tmp-indentation gnus-tmp-from val need gnus-mouse-face-prop gnus-mouse-face gnus-tmp-opening-bracket gnus-tmp-subject-or-nil gnus-tmp-closing-bracket] 12))
  gnus-summary-prepare-threads((([74719 "Re: RSS setup (encoding and link problems)" "Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen <larsi@gnus.org>" "Sun, 05 Dec 2010 22:27:43 +0100" "<m3r5dvewq8.fsf@quimbies.gnus.org>" "<87r5dv9apd.fsf@gmx.co.uk>" 5672 38 "news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.gnus.general:74719" nil])))
  gnus-summary-prepare()
  gnus-summary-read-group-1("nntp+news.gmane.org:gmane.emacs.gnus.general" 1 nil nil nil nil)
  gnus-summary-read-group("nntp+news.gmane.org:gmane.emacs.gnus.general" 1 nil nil nil nil nil)
  gnus-group-read-group(1 nil nil)
  gnus-topic-read-group(1)
  call-interactively(gnus-topic-read-group nil nil)



(setq gnus-format-specs '((group "%m%S%8uX%4~(form (print-int \"%d!\" (gnus-range-length (cdr (assq 'tick gnus-tmp-marked)))))@%4~(form (print-int \"%d?\" (gnus-range-length (cdr (assq 'dormant gnus-tmp-marked)))))@%* %G(%L)\n" (let (gnus-position) (insert (format "%c%c%8s%4s%4s" (gnus-group-new-mail gnus-tmp-group) gnus-tmp-subscribed (gnus-user-format-function-X gnus-tmp-header) (print-int "%d!" (gnus-range-length (cdr (assq 'tick gnus-tmp-marked)))) (print-int "%d?" (gnus-range-length (cdr (assq 'dormant gnus-tmp-marked)))))) (setq gnus-position (point)) (insert (format " %s(%d)\n" gnus-tmp-qualified-group gnus-tmp-level)) (if gnus-position (gnus-put-text-property gnus-position (1+ gnus-position) 'gnus-position t)))) (version . "23.1.50.1") (article-mode "%p [%w] %~(max-right 20)S%m" (byte-code "\303\304\b.\305\306	\"\203..	\307\225\310O\202..	)\311 \312\n!\313V\203'.\314\n\307\313#\202(.\n\315 %\260.\207" [gnus-tmp-group-name gname gnus-tmp-subject format "%s [%s] %s%s" string-match "^[^:]+:" 0 nil gnus-article-wash-status string-width 20 gnus-correct-substring gnus-article-mime-part-status] 8)) (summary-dummy "   %(:                             :%) %S\n" (byte-code "\303c\210\304`\305c\210`\b	$\210\306\n\307\261.\207" [gnus-mouse-face-prop gnus-mouse-face gnus-tmp-subject "   " gnus-put-text-property ":                             :" " " "\n"] 5)) (summary-mode "%G [%A] %Z" (byte-code "\303\304\b	\n$\260.\207" [gnus-tmp-group-name gnus-tmp-article-number gnus-tmp-unread-and-unselected format "%s [%d] %s"] 5)) (summary "%U%R%ut%5LL %4k %4us %-10&user-date;%-31= %*%I%(%-23,23f%) %[%s%]\n" (byte-code "\306.\307\310	\n\311\v!\f\vC.\312\313\306.#)\314\v!\315\v\316H!&\bc\210i\317V\203E.`.\x1f\320\317!\317U\2038.`.\x1f|\210\202A.`S.\x1f|\210\321c\210)\202N.\322\323\317iZ\324]\"\210\321c\210`.. c\210\325`\307\326\327\211\330\v.!\"!.\"\331.\"!\332V\203w.\333.\"\324\332#\202y..\")!.\"\332\331.\"!Z\211.#\324V\203\227.\306.\"\334.#\323\"Q\202\231..\"*\"c\210`.$.%$\210\307\335.&.'.($c\210\b\205\272.\325\b\211T\300\336$)\207" [gnus-position gnus-tmp-unread gnus-tmp-replied gnus-tmp-header gnus-tmp-lines args nil format "%c%c%s%5sL %4s %4s %-10s" gnus-user-format-function-t elp-wrapper gnus-summary-line-message-size gnus-user-format-function-s gnus-user-date 3 31 move-to-column " " insert-char 32 0 gnus-put-text-property "%-23s" eval gnus-summary-from-or-to-or-newsgroups string-width 23 gnus-correct-substring make-string " %c%s%c\n" t end gnus-tmp-indentation gnus-tmp-from val need gnus-mouse-face-prop gnus-mouse-face gnus-tmp-opening-bracket gnus-tmp-subject-or-nil gnus-tmp-closing-bracket] 12)) (topic "%i[ %(%{%n%}%) -- %A ]%v\n" (byte-code "\b\306\261.\210\307`\310`	c\210`\311#\210`\n\v$\210\312\313\f.#c\207" [indentation name gnus-mouse-face-prop gnus-mouse-face total-number-of-articles visible "[ " gnus-put-text-property gnus-add-text-properties (gnus-face t face bold) format " -- %d ]%s\n"] 6)) (group-mode "Gnus: %%b {%M%:%S}" (byte-code "\303\304\b	\n$\260.\207" [gnus-tmp-news-method gnus-tmp-colon gnus-tmp-news-server format "Gnus: %%b {%s%s%s}"] 5))))

Re: elp-wrapper sneaking into .newsrc.eld

[Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen]

Dan Christensen <jdc@uwo.ca> writes:

> I just restarted Gnus and emacs, and now can't enter any groups.
> Somehow elp-wrapper has gotten into my .newsrc.eld file.

Eek.

> I was doing
> profiling earlier today, and I have (gnus-compile) in my .gnus.el.
> Re-running gnus-compile doesn't seem to help.  Any suggestions?
>
> Backtrace below with control characters deleted.  Below that is
> the tail end of my .newsrc.eld.

[...]

> Debugger entered--Lisp error: (void-function elp-wrapper)

If you just load elp, then you should be able to get Gnus started, and
then perhaps when you recompile, it'll go away?

-- 
(domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.)
  larsi@gnus.org * Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen

Re: elp-wrapper sneaking into .newsrc.eld

[Dan Christensen]

[Please continue to Cc me.]

After `M-x load-library RET elp RET', I still get the following when I
try to enter a group (sorry about the cut-and-paste wrapping):

Debugger entered--Lisp error: (wrong-type-argument arrayp nil)
  elp-wrapper(gnus-summary-line-message-size nil ([74719 "Re: RSS setup
  (encoding and link problems)" "Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen
  <larsi@gnus.org>" "Sun, 05 Dec 2010 22:27:43 +0100"
  "<m3r5dvewq8.fsf@quimbies.gnus.org>" "<87r5dv9apd.fsf@gmx.co.uk>" 5672
  38 "news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.gnus.general:74719" nil]))
  byte-code("\306307\310                             \n\311
  gnus-summary-prepare-threads((([74719 "Re: RSS setup (encoding and
  link problems)" "Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen <larsi@gnus.org>" "Sun, 05
  Dec 2010 22:27:43 +0100" "<m3r5dvewq8.fsf@quimbies.gnus.org>"
  "<87r5dv9apd.fsf@gmx.co.uk>" 5672 38 "news.gmane.org
  gmane.emacs.gnus.general:74719" nil])))
  gnus-summary-prepare()
  gnus-summary-read-group-1("nntp+news.gmane.org:gmane.emacs.gnus.general"
  1 nil nil nil nil)
  gnus-summary-read-group("nntp+news.gmane.org:gmane.emacs.gnus.general"
  1 nil nil nil nil nil)
  gnus-group-read-group(1 nil nil)
  gnus-topic-read-group(1)
  call-interactively(gnus-topic-read-group nil nil)

Re: elp-wrapper sneaking into .newsrc.eld

[Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen]

Dan Christensen <jdc@uwo.ca> writes:

> After `M-x load-library RET elp RET', I still get the following when I
> try to enter a group (sorry about the cut-and-paste wrapping):
>
> Debugger entered--Lisp error: (wrong-type-argument arrayp nil)
>   elp-wrapper(gnus-summary-line-message-size nil ([74719 "Re: RSS setup

Actually, I think this should be easy to fix.  Just load the .newsrc.eld
file.  The last form is the (setq gnus-format-specs ...) thing.  Just
delete it.  It'll be regenerated later according to your settings.

-- 
(domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.)
  larsi@gnus.org * Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen

Re: elp-wrapper sneaking into .newsrc.eld

[Dan Christensen]

Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen <larsi@gnus.org> writes:

> Actually, I think this should be easy to fix.  Just load the .newsrc.eld
> file.  The last form is the (setq gnus-format-specs ...) thing.  Just
> delete it.  It'll be regenerated later according to your settings.

Thanks, that fixed it.  For the record, I quit Gnus, opened .newsrc.eld
in a random text editor, deleted that form, started emacs and gnus, and
all was well.

Dan

Re: elp-wrapper sneaking into .newsrc.eld

[Steinar Bang]

>>>>> Dan Christensen <jdc@uwo.ca>:

> Thanks, that fixed it.  For the record, I quit Gnus, opened
> .newsrc.eld in a random text editor, deleted that form, started emacs
> and gnus, and all was well.

In my opinion, the .newsrc.eld should be split up.

Lars always asks "why?" when I suggest this.  The answers are: 
 - It's a big file that's fragile wrt. to small obscure changes (it's
   better to lose tick marks in one group, than in all of them)
 - I would like to have my manually edited stuff (group parameters, and
   servers, and perhaps other stuff) out of .newsrc.eld and into a file,
   or set of files, that can be version controlled and shared together
   with the rest of the configuration files in my home directory

(I think there are other reasons as well, but these are the ones that
came to mind right now)

Re: elp-wrapper sneaking into .newsrc.eld

[Vegard Vesterheim]

On Mon, 06 Dec 2010 09:31:34 +0100 Steinar Bang <sb@dod.no> wrote:

> In my opinion, the .newsrc.eld should be split up.
>
> Lars always asks "why?" when I suggest this.  The answers are: 
>  - It's a big file that's fragile wrt. to small obscure changes (it's
>    better to lose tick marks in one group, than in all of them)
>  - I would like to have my manually edited stuff (group parameters, and
>    servers, and perhaps other stuff) out of .newsrc.eld and into a file,
>    or set of files, that can be version controlled and shared together
>    with the rest of the configuration files in my home directory
>
> (I think there are other reasons as well, but these are the ones that
> came to mind right now)

Another reason is to simplify the process of using separate Gnusae
(across several computers/user accounts) for IMAP. Other IMAP clients
only needs the connection details for the IMAP server, and will fetch
the rest of the information from the server.

To bootstrap a new Gnus, you need to take several steps

 - configure your .authinfo.gpg file for credentials
 - configure the TLS mechanism (starttls, gnutls ...)
 - configure select methods in .gnus 
 - copy your ~/.newrc.eld
 - copy some directories (~/News etc)

I would love to see a simpler mechanism for getting Gnus running on a
new user account. There has been some ideas floating around about
storing some info on the IMAP server (using IMAP as a file storage with
tramp), but I am not sure how well this works in practise. Can anyone
share any details about how to do this?

Yes, I know that Gnus is not just an IMAP-server. It is for me.

Yes, I know there is a potential chicken-and-egg problem here about
bootstrapping Gnus using information from IMAP.

 - Vegard V -

Re: elp-wrapper sneaking into .newsrc.eld

[Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen]

Vegard Vesterheim <vegard.vesterheim@uninett.no> writes:

> Another reason is to simplify the process of using separate Gnusae
> (across several computers/user accounts) for IMAP. Other IMAP clients
> only needs the connection details for the IMAP server, and will fetch
> the rest of the information from the server.
>
> To bootstrap a new Gnus, you need to take several steps
>
>  - configure your .authinfo.gpg file for credentials

This will be created automatically.

>  - configure the TLS mechanism (starttls, gnutls ...)

Not necessary.  nnimap should find that out by default.

>  - configure select methods in .gnus 

Yes...

>  - copy your ~/.newrc.eld
>  - copy some directories (~/News etc)

Neither are necessary if you just use IMAP.

Just putting

(setq gnus-select-method '(nnimap "imap.gmail.com"))

should be all that's necessary to start using IMAP on a new account.
The rest you will be prompted for (credentials) or pulled from the IMAP
server (the article data).

-- 
(domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.)
  larsi@gnus.org * Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen

Re: elp-wrapper sneaking into .newsrc.eld

[Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen]

Steinar Bang <sb@dod.no> writes:

> Lars always asks "why?" when I suggest this.  The answers are: 
>  - It's a big file that's fragile wrt. to small obscure changes (it's
>    better to lose tick marks in one group, than in all of them)

If you have a hierarchy of data, it's as easy to mess up the hierarchy
as to mess up a file, really.  Unless you know what you're doing.

>  - I would like to have my manually edited stuff (group parameters, and
>    servers, and perhaps other stuff) out of .newsrc.eld and into a file,
>    or set of files, that can be version controlled and shared together
>    with the rest of the configuration files in my home directory

Yes, that would be nice, but I don't really see that as essential.  I
mean, no other mail reader separates out per-group conf stuff like that.

-- 
(domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.)
  larsi@gnus.org * Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen

Re: elp-wrapper sneaking into .newsrc.eld

[Steinar Bang]

>>>>> Vegard Vesterheim <vegard.vesterheim@uninett.no>:

> I would love to see a simpler mechanism for getting Gnus running on a
> new user account. There has been some ideas floating around about
> storing some info on the IMAP server (using IMAP as a file storage
> with tramp), but I am not sure how well this works in practise. Can
> anyone share any details about how to do this?

Yes.  I use Ted's gnus-sync.el (which is in git gnus).

Here's my setup, from .gnus.el:

At the start of the file I've got this (I don't know if it was required
to have it at the start of the file, or if I just put it there so I
would remember to remove it at a later stage):

(require 'gnus-sync)

Further down in the file, I've got this:

;; Synching reads in nntp groups across machines
(setq gnus-sync-backend "/ssh:myuser@hjemme.mydomain:News/gnussync" ; will use Tramp+EPA if loaded
      gnus-sync-global-vars `(gnus-newsrc-last-checked-date)
      gnus-sync-newsrc-groups `("nntp" "nnrss")
      gnus-sync-newsrc-vars `(read marks))

I decided to use tramp+ssh instead of tramp+imap, which is a decision I
now regret.

Re: elp-wrapper sneaking into .newsrc.eld

[Steinar Bang]

>>>>> Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen <larsi@gnus.org>:

> If you have a hierarchy of data, it's as easy to mess up the hierarchy
> as to mess up a file, really.  Unless you know what you're doing.

Yes.  But it is easier to navigate to the relevant part in a smaller
file, and easier to do the right thing.  And, as I said, it will only
break one group, and not all of them.

But anyway, the most important thing is to separate the tick marks from
this stuff:

>> - I would like to have my manually edited stuff (group parameters, and
>> servers, and perhaps other stuff) out of .newsrc.eld and into a file,
>> or set of files, that can be version controlled and shared together
>> with the rest of the configuration files in my home directory

> Yes, that would be nice, but I don't really see that as essential.  I
> mean, no other mail reader separates out per-group conf stuff like that.

Actually, the manually edited stuff could all still continue to exist in
a single file.  It isn't a huge amount of stuff compared to the tick
marks, so it could be nicely formatted and more human readable (and
version control system friendly).

Re: elp-wrapper sneaking into .newsrc.eld

[Ted Zlatanov]

On Mon, 06 Dec 2010 21:56:29 +0100 Steinar Bang <sb@dod.no> wrote: 

SB> ;; Synching reads in nntp groups across machines
SB> (setq gnus-sync-backend "/ssh:myuser@hjemme.mydomain:News/gnussync" ; will use Tramp+EPA if loaded
SB>       gnus-sync-global-vars `(gnus-newsrc-last-checked-date)
SB>       gnus-sync-newsrc-groups `("nntp" "nnrss")
SB>       gnus-sync-newsrc-vars `(read marks))

SB> I decided to use tramp+ssh instead of tramp+imap, which is a decision I
SB> now regret.

You can always switch :)  Just open
"/ssh:myuser@hjemme.mydomain:News/gnussync", save it as the Tramp-imap
file you want, then change your gnus-sync-backend accordingly, and voila.

Ted

Re: elp-wrapper sneaking into .newsrc.eld

[Ted Zlatanov]

On Mon, 06 Dec 2010 14:31:50 +0100 Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen <larsi@gnus.org> wrote: 

LMI> Yes, that would be nice, but I don't really see that as essential.
LMI> I mean, no other mail reader separates out per-group conf stuff
LMI> like that.

Gnus is a mail reader as much as the iPhone is a phone :)

Ted

Re: elp-wrapper sneaking into .newsrc.eld

[Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen]

Ted Zlatanov <tzz@lifelogs.com> writes:

> Gnus is a mail reader as much as the iPhone is a phone :)

No, there's a difference!  You can actually send mail with Gnus.

:-)

-- 
(domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.)
  larsi@gnus.org * Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen

Re: elp-wrapper sneaking into .newsrc.eld

[Steinar Bang]

>>>>> Ted Zlatanov <tzz@lifelogs.com>:

> You can always switch :)  Just open
> "/ssh:myuser@hjemme.mydomain:News/gnussync", save it as the Tramp-imap
> file you want, then change your gnus-sync-backend accordingly, and voila.

Ah!  I was in the process of writing a bit of elisp to do this (ie. load
the old tramp file and save as a tramp-imap file), but this is of course
a lot simpler!  Thanks! :-)

Re: elp-wrapper sneaking into .newsrc.eld

[Ted Zlatanov]

On Wed, 15 Dec 2010 20:41:09 +0100 Steinar Bang <sb@dod.no> wrote: 

>>>>>> Ted Zlatanov <tzz@lifelogs.com>:
>> You can always switch :)  Just open
>> "/ssh:myuser@hjemme.mydomain:News/gnussync", save it as the Tramp-imap
>> file you want, then change your gnus-sync-backend accordingly, and voila.

SB> Ah!  I was in the process of writing a bit of elisp to do this (ie. load
SB> the old tramp file and save as a tramp-imap file), but this is of course
SB> a lot simpler!  Thanks! :-)

Achtung: tramp-imap has been flaky for me occasionally.  Don't trust it
too much.  At worst you'll end up with a file you can open in Gnus (just
visit the IMAP group and open the latest article for the file name), but
still be careful and report any bugs.

Ted