Pterodactyl Gnus v0.29 is released

Pterodactyl Gnus v0.29 is released

[Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen]

Working under the assumption that an undocumented feature is a bug --
here's the Emacs MIME manual.  (Veddy, veddy incomplete, though.)

So -- major bugfix, then.

Get it from <URL:http://www.gnus.org/pgnus.tar.gz> or
"/ftp@ftp.gnus.org:/pub/emacs/gnus/".  The patch is available as
<URL:http://www.gnus.org/patches/pgnus-0.28-0.29.diff.gz>.

ChangeLog since last release:

Sat Sep 12 13:27:15 1998  Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen  <larsi@menja.ifi.uio.no>

	* gnus.el: Pterodactyl Gnus v0.29 is released.

1998-09-12 12:46:30  Istvan Marko  <imarko@pacificnet.net>

	* mm-decode.el (mm-save-part): Message right.

1998-09-12 11:30:01  Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen  <larsi@gnus.org>

	* drums.el (drums-parse-address): Returned a list instead of a
	string. 
	(drums-remove-whitespace): Skip comments.
	(drums-parse-addresses): Didn't work.



-- 
(domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.)
  larsi@ifi.uio.no * Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen

Re: Pterodactyl Gnus v0.29 is released

[David Mentre]

Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen <larsi@ifi.uio.no> writes:

> 	* gnus.el: Pterodactyl Gnus v0.29 is released.

pgnus-0.28.tar.gz. . . . . . . .  [Sep 12 07:16]    805k
pgnus-0.29.tar.gz. . . . . . . .  [Sep 12 11:29]    747k

Bad EOF of the tar. Something wrong with .29 release ?

d.
-- 
 David.Mentre@irisa.fr -- http://www.irisa.fr/prive/dmentre/

Re: Pterodactyl Gnus v0.29 is released

[Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen]

David Mentre <David.Mentre@irisa.fr> writes:

> Bad EOF of the tar. Something wrong with .29 release ?

Should be OK now.

-- 
(domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.)
  larsi@gnus.org * Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen

Re: Pterodactyl Gnus v0.29 is released

[David Mentre]

Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen <larsi@gnus.org> writes:

> Should be OK now.

IS ok now.

BTW, forget about my last message about a bug in pgnus-0.28. In fact I
was using gnus 5.5 (emacs 20.3 standard version). Shame on me!

d.
-- 
 David.Mentre@irisa.fr -- http://www.irisa.fr/prive/dmentre/

pgnus 0.29 and quote coloring in message display

[David Mentre]

For pgnus-0.29:

In articles with multi-part mime, coloring of quotes is lost when
displayed. No problem with mime less messages.

my gnus-article-display-hook's value is 
(gnus-article-date-lapsed gnus-article-highlight gnus-article-hide-headers-if-wanted gnus-article-hide-boring-headers gnus-article-treat-overstrike gnus-article-maybe-highlight)

d.
-- 
 David.Mentre@irisa.fr -- http://www.irisa.fr/prive/dmentre/

Re: pgnus 0.29 and quote coloring in message display

[Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen]

David Mentre <David.Mentre@irisa.fr> writes:

> In articles with multi-part mime, coloring of quotes is lost when
> displayed. No problem with mime less messages.

Yes, the highlighting hooks aren't run after displaying MIME parts.
Perhaps they should be, though.

-- 
(domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.)
  larsi@gnus.org * Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen

Re: Pterodactyl Gnus v0.29 is released

[Wes Hardaker]

>>>>> On 12 Sep 1998 13:28:52 +0200, Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen <larsi@ifi.uio.no> said:

Lars> Working under the assumption that an undocumented feature is a bug --
Lars> here's the Emacs MIME manual.  (Veddy, veddy incomplete, though.)

Lars> So -- major bugfix, then.

Subtle hint to get me to fix all my bugs?

-- 
"Ninjas aren't dangerous.  They're more afraid of you than you are of them."

Re: Pterodactyl Gnus v0.29 is released

[Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen]

Wes Hardaker <wjhardaker@ucdavis.edu> writes:

> Lars> So -- major bugfix, then.
> 
> Subtle hint to get me to fix all my bugs?

Me?  Subtle?  Whatever can you mean...

-- 
(domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.)
  larsi@gnus.org * Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen

Re: pgnus 0.29 and quote coloring in message display

[David Mentre]

Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen <larsi@gnus.org> writes:

> Yes, the highlighting hooks aren't run after displaying MIME parts.
> Perhaps they should be, though.

I think so. Or maybe there is a proper hook after mime decoding ?

d.
-- 
 David.Mentre@irisa.fr -- http://www.irisa.fr/prive/dmentre/

Re: pgnus 0.29 and quote coloring in message display

[Per Abrahamsen]

Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen <larsi@gnus.org> writes:

> Yes, the highlighting hooks aren't run after displaying MIME parts.
> Perhaps they should be, though.

I think gnus-article-display-hook should be dropped.  Old settings
will cause trouble in pgnus anyway.

Instead we should have a number of more specialized options, including
separate hooks to highlight/wash the headers, and hooks to
highlight/wash any text/plain section found anywhere in the article.

Re: pgnus 0.29 and quote coloring in message display

[Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen]

Per Abrahamsen <abraham@dina.kvl.dk> writes:

> Instead we should have a number of more specialized options, including
> separate hooks to highlight/wash the headers, and hooks to
> highlight/wash any text/plain section found anywhere in the article.

I'm inclined to agree with this.

gnus-article-display-header-hook
gnus-article-display-body-hook

Er...  Would that be it?  And the latter hook would be run when
displaying any parts, including the top-level part.  The buffer would
be narrowed to the part that is to be washed/highlighted.

The header hook would only be run when displaying the top-level part. 

Or do we need more hooks?

-- 
(domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.)
  larsi@gnus.org * Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen

Re: pgnus 0.29 and quote coloring in message display

[Edward J. Sabol]

Excerpts from mail: (16-Sep-98) Re: pgnus 0.29 and quote coloring in message display by Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen
> Per Abrahamsen <abraham@dina.kvl.dk> writes:
>> Instead we should have a number of more specialized options, including
>> separate hooks to highlight/wash the headers, and hooks to
>> highlight/wash any text/plain section found anywhere in the article.
>
> I'm inclined to agree with this.
>
> gnus-article-display-header-hook
> gnus-article-display-body-hook
>
> Er...  Would that be it?
[snip]
> Or do we need more hooks?

I really think it would be cleaner if we had separate hooks for highlighting
and washing/altering the text to insure that any and all
highlighting/coloring comes after any washing.

gnus-article-wash-header-hook
gnus-article-wash-body-hook
gnus-article-display-header-hook
gnus-article-display-body-hook

Later,
Ed

Re: pgnus 0.29 and quote coloring in message display

[Per Abrahamsen]

Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen <larsi@gnus.org> writes:

> Or do we need more hooks?

I'd assume the main MIME function would be on a separate variable, or
not specificable?

And that `gnus-article-display-body-hook' is only called for
text/plain?  Maybe it should have text/plain in the name.

Re: pgnus 0.29 and quote coloring in message display

[Per Abrahamsen]

"Edward J. Sabol" <sabol@alderaan.gsfc.nasa.gov> writes:

> gnus-article-wash-header-hook
> gnus-article-wash-body-hook
> gnus-article-display-header-hook
> gnus-article-display-body-hook

Another posibility would be to use the occasion to switch to boolean
options for turning each feature on and of, and let the hooks be nil
as default.

Non-nil hooks are suspect anyway, since they lead to customization
that depends on the order you load things.  E.g.

	(add-hook 'some-gnus-hook 'my-function)
	(require 'gnus)

will give different results than

	(require 'gnus)
	(add-hook 'some-gnus-hook 'my-function)

unless the default value for `some-gnus-hook' is nil.

Re: pgnus 0.29 and quote coloring in message display

[Hrvoje Niksic]

Per Abrahamsen <abraham@dina.kvl.dk> writes:

> Another posibility would be to use the occasion to switch to boolean
> options for turning each feature on and of, and let the hooks be nil
> as default.
[... example elided ...]

I agree.  Hook variables with non-nil default values are totally,
totally losing with Customize, as well as in the example that Per
posted.

-- 
Hrvoje Niksic <hniksic@srce.hr> | Student at FER Zagreb, Croatia
--------------------------------+--------------------------------
Predestination was doomed from the start.

Re: pgnus 0.29 and quote coloring in message display

[Kai Grossjohann]

>>>>> On 17 Sep 1998, Hrvoje Niksic said:

  Hrvoje> I agree.  Hook variables with non-nil default values are totally,
  Hrvoje> totally losing with Customize, as well as in the example that Per
  Hrvoje> posted.

<alert description="off-topic">
  WIBNI Customize provided a way to do the equivalent of add-hook?
</alert>

kai
-- 
OOP: object oriented programming;  OOPS: object oriented mistakes

Re: pgnus 0.29 and quote coloring in message display

[Per Abrahamsen]

Hrvoje Niksic <hniksic@srce.hr> writes:

> Per Abrahamsen <abraham@dina.kvl.dk> writes:
> 
> > Another posibility would be to use the occasion to switch to boolean
> > options for turning each feature on and of, and let the hooks be nil
> > as default.
> [... example elided ...]
> 
> I agree.  Hook variables with non-nil default values are totally,
> totally losing with Customize, as well as in the example that Per
> posted.

Actually, I think it works fine with customize.  It is add-hook that
causes problems.

Re: pgnus 0.29 and quote coloring in message display

[Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen]

"Edward J. Sabol" <sabol@alderaan.gsfc.nasa.gov> writes:

> I really think it would be cleaner if we had separate hooks for highlighting
> and washing/altering the text to insure that any and all
> highlighting/coloring comes after any washing.

That would make sense...

-- 
(domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.)
  larsi@gnus.org * Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen

Re: pgnus 0.29 and quote coloring in message display

[Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen]

Per Abrahamsen <abraham@dina.kvl.dk> writes:

> Another posibility would be to use the occasion to switch to boolean
> options for turning each feature on and of, and let the hooks be nil
> as default.

And then we would have an additional hook to let users add functions
of their own?

But I don't want to add a gazillion variables like
`gnus-article-hide-pgp-in-bodies' (etc).  

> Non-nil hooks are suspect anyway, since they lead to customization
> that depends on the order you load things.  E.g.

Yes, that's a problem.

Ideally, all hooks should default to nil.  

-- 
(domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.)
  larsi@gnus.org * Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen

Re: pgnus 0.29 and quote coloring in message display

[Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen]

Per Abrahamsen <abraham@dina.kvl.dk> writes:

> I'd assume the main MIME function would be on a separate variable, or
> not specificable?

A separate variable.  

> And that `gnus-article-display-body-hook' is only called for
> text/plain?  Maybe it should have text/plain in the name.

It would also be called for multipart articles, wouldn't it?  And
message/rfc822, and possibly others...

-- 
(domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.)
  larsi@gnus.org * Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen

Re: pgnus 0.29 and quote coloring in message display

[Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen]

"Edward J. Sabol" <sabol@alderaan.gsfc.nasa.gov> writes:

> I really think it would be cleaner if we had separate hooks for highlighting
> and washing/altering the text to insure that any and all
> highlighting/coloring comes after any washing.

A different approach to the hook situation would be to mark each hook
function as to what it's appliccable to.

For instance, we could have properties `header', `body', `wash' and
`highlight'.  The functions would be marked as to what they're meant
to do (with `put'), and we'd have a function like

(gnus-run-hooks-with-property '(body highlight wash) gnus-article-display-hook)

that would run the highlighting and washing functions for the body.
And so on.  

-- 
(domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.)
  larsi@gnus.org * Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen

Re: pgnus 0.29 and quote coloring in message display

[Per Abrahamsen]

Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen <larsi@gnus.org> writes:

> > And that `gnus-article-display-body-hook' is only called for
> > text/plain?  Maybe it should have text/plain in the name.
> 
> It would also be called for multipart articles, wouldn't it?  And
> message/rfc822, and possibly others...

Only on the content, which is presumably text/plain (or else the hook
shouldn't be called).

Re: pgnus 0.29 and quote coloring in message display

[Per Abrahamsen]

Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen <larsi@gnus.org> writes:

> For instance, we could have properties `header', `body', `wash' and
> `highlight'.  The functions would be marked as to what they're meant
> to do (with `put'), and we'd have a function like

I think this would make it harder to learn how to write hook functions
in Gnus, for very little benefit.

You do not reduce program complexity by having fewer options, if each
option is more complex.

Re: pgnus 0.29 and quote coloring in message display

[Per Abrahamsen]

Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen <larsi@gnus.org> writes:

> And then we would have an additional hook to let users add functions
> of their own?

Yes.

> But I don't want to add a gazillion variables like
> `gnus-article-hide-pgp-in-bodies' (etc).  

I don't think they would complicate things, at least not for the
customize users.  It would be a lot of checkboxes, just like today.

In general, many small simple options are preferable over large
complex options in customize, since you have to save everything or
nothing.  This gives migration problems when the standard value
changes in later version of Gnus.  As you have just experienced with
`gnus-article-dislay-hook'.

Re: pgnus 0.29 and quote coloring in message display

[Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen]

Per Abrahamsen <abraham@dina.kvl.dk> writes:

> > But I don't want to add a gazillion variables like
> > `gnus-article-hide-pgp-in-bodies' (etc).  
> 
> I don't think they would complicate things, at least not for the
> customize users.  It would be a lot of checkboxes, just like today.

They don't complicate things, but I think adding a whole slew of new
variables is an ugly way to do this.

> In general, many small simple options are preferable over large
> complex options in customize, since you have to save everything or
> nothing.  This gives migration problems when the standard value
> changes in later version of Gnus.  As you have just experienced with
> `gnus-article-dislay-hook'.

That's true.

-- 
(domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.)
  larsi@gnus.org * Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen