[NTG-context] Re: redefine space to be the same as \␣ similar to knuthian approach

[Hans Hagen <j.hagen@xs4all.nl>]

On 8/20/2023 5:51 PM, Carlos wrote:
> On Sun, Aug 20, 2023 at 03:38:15PM +0200, Wolfgang Schuster wrote:
>> Carlos schrieb am 19.08.2023 um 15:32:
>>> On Fri, Aug 18, 2023 at 08:58:58PM +0200, Wolfgang Schuster wrote:
>>>> Hi,
>>>>
>>>> 1. Learn to two provide a working minimal example which shows the problem.
>>>>
>>> Did the minimal example I provided earlier wasn't enough for you?
>>>
>>> Besides, You know perfectly well that \stoptext is not even necessary,
>>> superflous; it's not required to compile any context flavor file for
>>> ages now.
>>>
>>> So I suggest you to save those keystrokes for other tasks. Not those,
>>> petty petty betty. I know it's hard to teach an ol' dog new tricks,
>>> but… it's worth to try! right?
>>
>> Please explain why this example (which is a valid ConTeXt document) works
> 
> Opening a group with \starttext makes no sense because there is nothing after \stoptext.
> 
> The possibility to nest \starttext is necessary when you \startproduct etc. where components can be be documents on its own and this means \startcomponent includes \starttext in its
> definition.
> 
>> %%%% begin example
>> \starttext
>>
>> \starttext
>>
>> \stoptext
>>
>> \stoptext
>> %%%% end example
>>
>> but this doesn't.
>>
>> %%%% begin example
>> \starttext
>>
>> \starttext
>> %%%% end example
>>
>> Wolfgang
> 
> Take a look at the command line when you process a file and you should see something like this:
> 
> As you can see the luatex engine processes the file cont-yes.mkiv and not your document which put as argument to context. Your document is just read by cont-yes.mkiv and at the end of the document ConTeXt inserts an extra \stoptext which is ignored when your document
> is valid (equal number of \starttext and \stoptext).

The bonus \starttext is just there so that we can use \startTEXpage etc 
without wrapper and a second bonus is that it catches sloppy coding and 
if a user want to take a shortcut and save a handful of keystrokes it's 
fine for me but support converges to zero (unless one pays top money for 
the incovenience). There is only so much you can expect from volunteers.

> Wolfgang. I do appreciate your emphasis and your input on all of this.
> I do. I really do. But we can't go over this, over and over again. Do
> you know who said the above? Not me. You. Do you know whose remarks
> are those? Not mine.  Yours.
> 
> Replace cont-yes.mkiv with the newer equivalent. And you're right though. \starttext is not even needed most of the times.
Wolfgang tries to educate you ... starttext is the anchor for checking 
if a bodyfont has been defined and if not it kicks in some default.

Now with that said:

When Wolfgang asks / tells something because there is nothing in context 
that he doesn't know. And you can bet then he knowa more than you do 
about the internals, objectives and implementation. So, let me put it a 
bit stronger: if Wolfgang gives you an answer that you don't like, you 
should be very careful in your answering because there is very little 
change that he's wrong. To stress his position here: if he sends me a 
patch I can merge it in without testing it which (believe me) is a 
rather unique positin. From this you might conclude that I don't like 
your tone.

And with that out if the way:

When Mikael wonders if there might be something with your installation 
you should indeed sit down and wonder a bit if that could be the case 
because he is a pretty good tester who had been around for quite a 
while. So you can be sure that he tested it well and that he has a 
proper setup. Personally I'd be worried if someone doubts my installation.

Did you install from the garden, using the lmtx installer? Because that 
is the reference. Everything installed otherwise is the users problem.

Which brings me to this file read only thing you mention. If your font 
cache is not writable you migth end up with bad metrics indeed just 
because there are no font resources but that's not up to context to deal 
with.

Also, \␣ is a fixed space and has no glue so i keep wondering what  this 
brings to the picture,

Hans

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