[pups] Suitable PDP11s, in the UK

[pups] Suitable PDP11s, in the UK

[Toby Thain]

On 17-Nov-07, at 4:15 PM, Bob Eager wrote:

> ** Reply to note from Toby Thain <toby at smartgames.ca> Sat, 17 Nov  
> 2007 12:44:53 -0200
>
>> On 17-Nov-07, at 11:21 AM, Bob Eager wrote:
>>
>>> ** Reply to note from Toby Thain <toby at smartgames.ca> Sat, 17 Nov
>>> 2007 11:08:32 -0200
>>>
>>>> On 2-Nov-07, at 11:59 AM, Bob Eager wrote:
>>>>> ** Reply to note from Brantley Coile <brantley at coraid.com> Fri, 2
>>>>> Nov 2007 09:42:47 -0400
>>>>>> Wes,
>>>>>> Is this the book you are thinking of?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> http://research.microsoft.com/users/gbell/Computer_Engineering/
>>>>>> index.html
>>>>>
>>>>> Probably was!
>>>>>
>>>>> I just bought a copy on eBay a couple of weeks ago, and have just
>>>>> read it
>>>>> cover to cover.
>>>>
>>>> There's more than one edition. ...

> I have the earlier "Computer Engineering" and the 2nd edition of  
> "Art of
> Digital Design". I have now ordered the 1998 edition of "Computer
> Engineering". I look forward to all of the stuff that was too late  
> for the
> first edition.

Bob,

Sorry! I think I was actually talking about a different Bell title. I  
checked my past orders and found the following:

Author: Bell, C. Gordon; Newell, Allen
Title: Computer Structures: Readings and Examples

Author: Siewiorek, Daniel; Bell, C. Gordon; Newell, Allen,
Title: Computer Structures: Principles and Examples

Both of these contain many architectural case studies (each book  
covers a different set). And both should be findable in this list:
http://www.abebooks.com/servlet/SearchResults? 
an=bell&sts=t&tn=computer+structures

I also have Computer Engineering but it's a different book! Sorry  
again about the confusion.

--Toby

>
>
> Bob

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[pups] Suitable PDP11s, in the UK

[Bob Eager]

** Reply to note from Brantley Coile <brantley at coraid.com> Fri, 2 Nov 2007 09:42:47 -0400

> Wes,
> Is this the book you are thinking of?
>   
> http://research.microsoft.com/users/gbell/Computer_Engineering/index.html

Probably was!

I just bought a copy on eBay a couple of weeks ago, and have just read it
cover to cover. A bit dry at the start, but fascinating...I starting using
PDP11s back in 1972. (an 11/20)

And used what I think was the first v6 UNIX system in England...



Bob

cc: pups at minnie.tuhs.org

[pups] Suitable PDP11s, in the UK

[Toby Thain]

On 2-Nov-07, at 11:59 AM, Bob Eager wrote:

> ** Reply to note from Brantley Coile <brantley at coraid.com> Fri, 2  
> Nov 2007 09:42:47 -0400
>
>> Wes,
>> Is this the book you are thinking of?
>>
>> http://research.microsoft.com/users/gbell/Computer_Engineering/ 
>> index.html
>
> Probably was!
>
> I just bought a copy on eBay a couple of weeks ago, and have just  
> read it
> cover to cover.

There's more than one edition. I bought both but I don't have them  
with me here to provide details. It's worth also finding the other  
one, as it has a different cross-section of designs.

Should be easily found on abebooks.com, bibliofind etc.

--Toby

> A bit dry at the start, but fascinating...I starting using
> PDP11s back in 1972. (an 11/20)
>
> And used what I think was the first v6 UNIX system in England...
>
>
>
> Bob
>
> cc: pups at minnie.tuhs.org
> _______________________________________________
> PUPS mailing list
> PUPS at minnie.tuhs.org
> https://minnie.tuhs.org/mailman/listinfo/pups

[pups] Suitable PDP11s, in the UK

[Tim Bradshaw]

Having long ago got rid of my collection of ageing British (super) 
minis, I realise I'm missing them, though I'm not sure why.  I can't  
pretend any more that something running 4.2BSD is really practical,  
so I'd like to get something really impractical, like a pdp11.

What I'd like to be able to do is run 7th edition or thereabouts and/ 
or 2.11BSD on something which is not too large (so full-height 19"  
racks are out).   I'm not interested in emulators.  It looks to me  
like there are such systems - for instance the recently-discussed  
11/23 (or 11/73) looks practical, other than being in Utah.

So I guess I have two questions:

Firstly is this a practical thing to do in terms of reliability of HW  
etc?  I finally gave up on the previous lot of machines at least  
partly because disks &c were just so flaky that it was too painful to  
keep things working (also we're talking full-height 19" racks in some  
cases so they were a bit, well, big).  I don't want to spend my life  
trying to source ancient disks etc (though I'm clearly not expecting  
things to be as reliable as good, new modern kit).

Secondly, does anyone in the UK (may be there is no one but me, of  
course...) have any hints where I might look and what I might expect  
to pay.  I've looked on ebay but I'm a little nervous of what I might  
get that way.

Thanks

--tim

[pups] Suitable PDP11s, in the UK

[Wesley Parish]

To add to this, there used to be a book on computer engineering with details 
on designing a PDP of some particular nature.  (It might even have been a 
PDP-11.)

Is it possible to persuade the writer of that book - a University textbook I 
think - to donate it to PUPS?  Alternatively, does someone have an updated 
PDP-11 design that they would be willing to donate to PUPS for anyone with a 
soldering iron and enough time, to play with?

I'm thinking this would be the way to solve this sort of problem in one fell 
swoop, if as I suspect is likely, it is impossible to find a working and 
available PDP-11 in the UK.

Just my 0.02c worth - and my, hasn't inflation risen ... ;)

Wesley Parish

On Friday 02 November 2007 06:31, Tim Bradshaw wrote:
> Having long ago got rid of my collection of ageing British (super)
> minis, I realise I'm missing them, though I'm not sure why.  I can't
> pretend any more that something running 4.2BSD is really practical,
> so I'd like to get something really impractical, like a pdp11.
>
> What I'd like to be able to do is run 7th edition or thereabouts and/
> or 2.11BSD on something which is not too large (so full-height 19"
> racks are out).   I'm not interested in emulators.  It looks to me
> like there are such systems - for instance the recently-discussed
> 11/23 (or 11/73) looks practical, other than being in Utah.
>
> So I guess I have two questions:
>
> Firstly is this a practical thing to do in terms of reliability of HW
> etc?  I finally gave up on the previous lot of machines at least
> partly because disks &c were just so flaky that it was too painful to
> keep things working (also we're talking full-height 19" racks in some
> cases so they were a bit, well, big).  I don't want to spend my life
> trying to source ancient disks etc (though I'm clearly not expecting
> things to be as reliable as good, new modern kit).
>
> Secondly, does anyone in the UK (may be there is no one but me, of
> course...) have any hints where I might look and what I might expect
> to pay.  I've looked on ebay but I'm a little nervous of what I might
> get that way.
>
> Thanks
>
> --tim
> _______________________________________________
> PUPS mailing list
> PUPS at minnie.tuhs.org
> https://minnie.tuhs.org/mailman/listinfo/pups

-- 
Clinersterton beademung, with all of love - RIP James Blish
-----
Gaul is quartered into three halves.  Things which are 
impossible are equal to each other.  Guerrilla 
warfare means up to their monkey tricks. 
Extracts from "Schoolboy Howlers" - the collective wisdom 
of the foolish.
-----
Mau e ki, he aha te mea nui?
You ask, what is the most important thing?
Maku e ki, he tangata, he tangata, he tangata.
I reply, it is people, it is people, it is people.

[pups] Suitable PDP11s, in the UK

[Robert Tillyard]

On 2 Nov 2007, at 10:34, Wesley Parish wrote:

> To add to this, there used to be a book on computer engineering with  
> details
> on designing a PDP of some particular nature.  (It might even have  
> been a
> PDP-11.)
>
> Is it possible to persuade the writer of that book - a University  
> textbook I
> think - to donate it to PUPS?  Alternatively, does someone have an  
> updated
> PDP-11 design that they would be willing to donate to PUPS for  
> anyone with a
> soldering iron and enough time, to play with?
>
> I'm thinking this would be the way to solve this sort of problem in  
> one fell
> swoop, if as I suspect is likely, it is impossible to find a working  
> and
> available PDP-11 in the UK.
>
> Just my 0.02c worth - and my, hasn't inflation risen ... ;)
>
> Wesley Parish
>
> On Friday 02 November 2007 06:31, Tim Bradshaw wrote:
>> Having long ago got rid of my collection of ageing British (super)
>> minis, I realise I'm missing them, though I'm not sure why.  I can't
>> pretend any more that something running 4.2BSD is really practical,
>> so I'd like to get something really impractical, like a pdp11.
>>
>> What I'd like to be able to do is run 7th edition or thereabouts and/
>> or 2.11BSD on something which is not too large (so full-height 19"
>> racks are out).   I'm not interested in emulators.  It looks to me
>> like there are such systems - for instance the recently-discussed
>> 11/23 (or 11/73) looks practical, other than being in Utah.
>>
>> So I guess I have two questions:
>>
>> Firstly is this a practical thing to do in terms of reliability of HW
>> etc?  I finally gave up on the previous lot of machines at least
>> partly because disks &c were just so flaky that it was too painful to
>> keep things working (also we're talking full-height 19" racks in some
>> cases so they were a bit, well, big).  I don't want to spend my life
>> trying to source ancient disks etc (though I'm clearly not expecting
>> things to be as reliable as good, new modern kit).
>>
>> Secondly, does anyone in the UK (may be there is no one but me, of
>> course...) have any hints where I might look and what I might expect
>> to pay.  I've looked on ebay but I'm a little nervous of what I might
>> get that way.
>>
>> Thanks
>>
>> --tim
>>
> -- 
> Clinersterton beademung, with all of love - RIP James Blish
> -----
> Gaul is quartered into three halves.  Things which are
> impossible are equal to each other.  Guerrilla
> warfare means up to their monkey tricks.
> Extracts from "Schoolboy Howlers" - the collective wisdom
> of the foolish.
> -----
> Mau e ki, he aha te mea nui?
> You ask, what is the most important thing?
> Maku e ki, he tangata, he tangata, he tangata.
> I reply, it is people, it is people, it is people.

[pups] Suitable PDP11s, in the UK

[Robert Tillyard]

Sorry my previous message seemed to be missing the text that I wanted  
to send... see below...

I have what I believe is a PDP 11/23 in a cabinet with two RL02  
drives. I rescued it from a company who were just going to skip it in  
the 90's. I've never used it and don't have an OS for it but the  
company had been using it up until the day the that I rescued it.

The machine is located in Bury St. Edmunds in Suffolk. If someone can  
put this to good use then they can have it. I'll post a picture of it  
up somewhere tonight to help identify it. I think it may have some  
schematics with it as well.

Regards, Rob.

On 2 Nov 2007, at 10:34, Wesley Parish wrote:

> To add to this, there used to be a book on computer engineering with  
> details
> on designing a PDP of some particular nature.  (It might even have  
> been a
> PDP-11.)
>
> Is it possible to persuade the writer of that book - a University  
> textbook I
> think - to donate it to PUPS?  Alternatively, does someone have an  
> updated
> PDP-11 design that they would be willing to donate to PUPS for  
> anyone with a
> soldering iron and enough time, to play with?
>
> I'm thinking this would be the way to solve this sort of problem in  
> one fell
> swoop, if as I suspect is likely, it is impossible to find a working  
> and
> available PDP-11 in the UK.
>
> Just my 0.02c worth - and my, hasn't inflation risen ... ;)
>
> Wesley Parish
>
> On Friday 02 November 2007 06:31, Tim Bradshaw wrote:
>> Having long ago got rid of my collection of ageing British (super)
>> minis, I realise I'm missing them, though I'm not sure why.  I can't
>> pretend any more that something running 4.2BSD is really practical,
>> so I'd like to get something really impractical, like a pdp11.
>>
>> What I'd like to be able to do is run 7th edition or thereabouts and/
>> or 2.11BSD on something which is not too large (so full-height 19"
>> racks are out).   I'm not interested in emulators.  It looks to me
>> like there are such systems - for instance the recently-discussed
>> 11/23 (or 11/73) looks practical, other than being in Utah.
>>
>> So I guess I have two questions:
>>
>> Firstly is this a practical thing to do in terms of reliability of HW
>> etc?  I finally gave up on the previous lot of machines at least
>> partly because disks &c were just so flaky that it was too painful to
>> keep things working (also we're talking full-height 19" racks in some
>> cases so they were a bit, well, big).  I don't want to spend my life
>> trying to source ancient disks etc (though I'm clearly not expecting
>> things to be as reliable as good, new modern kit).
>>
>> Secondly, does anyone in the UK (may be there is no one but me, of
>> course...) have any hints where I might look and what I might expect
>> to pay.  I've looked on ebay but I'm a little nervous of what I might
>> get that way.
>>
>> Thanks
>>
>> --tim
>> _______________________________________________
>> PUPS mailing list
>> PUPS at minnie.tuhs.org
>> https://minnie.tuhs.org/mailman/listinfo/pups
>
> -- 
> Clinersterton beademung, with all of love - RIP James Blish
> -----
> Gaul is quartered into three halves.  Things which are
> impossible are equal to each other.  Guerrilla
> warfare means up to their monkey tricks.
> Extracts from "Schoolboy Howlers" - the collective wisdom
> of the foolish.
> -----
> Mau e ki, he aha te mea nui?
> You ask, what is the most important thing?
> Maku e ki, he tangata, he tangata, he tangata.
> I reply, it is people, it is people, it is people.
> _______________________________________________
> PUPS mailing list
> PUPS at minnie.tuhs.org
> https://minnie.tuhs.org/mailman/listinfo/pups

[pups] Suitable PDP11s, in the UK

[Tim Bradshaw]

On 2 Nov 2007, at 10:34, Wesley Parish wrote:

> I'm thinking this would be the way to solve this sort of problem in  
> one fell
> swoop, if as I suspect is likely, it is impossible to find a  
> working and
> available PDP-11 in the UK.

It's a cool idea, but I think it depends.  That would be a bit like  
making a vintage car.  People do that (even without the intention to  
fake them - there are, I think, many more type 35 Bugattis in  
existence than were ever made), but sometimes you want a vintage car,  
or computer, because it's vintage.

--tim (owner of a vintage car, but also owner of an electronic enigma  
replica...)

[pups] Suitable PDP11s, in the UK

[Gregg Levine]

On 11/2/07, Tim Bradshaw <tfb at tfeb.org> wrote:
> On 2 Nov 2007, at 10:34, Wesley Parish wrote:
>
> > I'm thinking this would be the way to solve this sort of problem in
> > one fell
> > swoop, if as I suspect is likely, it is impossible to find a
> > working and
> > available PDP-11 in the UK.
>
> It's a cool idea, but I think it depends.  That would be a bit like
> making a vintage car.  People do that (even without the intention to
> fake them - there are, I think, many more type 35 Bugattis in
> existence than were ever made), but sometimes you want a vintage car,
> or computer, because it's vintage.
>
> --tim (owner of a vintage car, but also owner of an electronic enigma
> replica...)

Hello!
There is just such a textbook, I've read it. However as luck would
have it today I can not remember its title. It might be the one that
MSResearch remembers, but its unlikely at best.
-- 
Gregg C Levine gregg.drwho8 at gmail.com
"This signature was once found posting rude
 messages in English in the Moscow subway."

[pups] Suitable PDP11s, in the UK

[Carl Lowenstein]

On 11/2/07, Gregg Levine <gregg.drwho8 at gmail.com> wrote:
> On 11/2/07, Tim Bradshaw <tfb at tfeb.org> wrote:
> > On 2 Nov 2007, at 10:34, Wesley Parish wrote:
> >
> > > I'm thinking this would be the way to solve this sort of problem in
> > > one fell
> > > swoop, if as I suspect is likely, it is impossible to find a
> > > working and
> > > available PDP-11 in the UK.
> >
> > It's a cool idea, but I think it depends.  That would be a bit like
> > making a vintage car.  People do that (even without the intention to
> > fake them - there are, I think, many more type 35 Bugattis in
> > existence than were ever made), but sometimes you want a vintage car,
> > or computer, because it's vintage.
> >
> > --tim (owner of a vintage car, but also owner of an electronic enigma
> > replica...)
>
> Hello!
> There is just such a textbook, I've read it. However as luck would
> have it today I can not remember its title. It might be the one that
> MSResearch remembers, but its unlikely at best.

Are you perhaps thinking of _The Art of Digital Design_?

<http://preview.tinyurl.com/28p6am>

    carl
-- 
    carl lowenstein         marine physical lab     u.c. san diego
                                                 clowenstein at ucsd.edu

[pups] Suitable PDP11s, in the UK

[Gregg Levine]

On 11/2/07, Carl Lowenstein <carl.lowenstein at gmail.com> wrote:
> On 11/2/07, Gregg Levine <gregg.drwho8 at gmail.com> wrote:
> > On 11/2/07, Tim Bradshaw <tfb at tfeb.org> wrote:
> > > On 2 Nov 2007, at 10:34, Wesley Parish wrote:
> > >
> > > > I'm thinking this would be the way to solve this sort of problem in
> > > > one fell
> > > > swoop, if as I suspect is likely, it is impossible to find a
> > > > working and
> > > > available PDP-11 in the UK.
> > >
> > > It's a cool idea, but I think it depends.  That would be a bit like
> > > making a vintage car.  People do that (even without the intention to
> > > fake them - there are, I think, many more type 35 Bugattis in
> > > existence than were ever made), but sometimes you want a vintage car,
> > > or computer, because it's vintage.
> > >
> > > --tim (owner of a vintage car, but also owner of an electronic enigma
> > > replica...)
> >
> > Hello!
> > There is just such a textbook, I've read it. However as luck would
> > have it today I can not remember its title. It might be the one that
> > MSResearch remembers, but its unlikely at best.
>
> Are you perhaps thinking of _The Art of Digital Design_?
>
> <http://preview.tinyurl.com/28p6am>
>
>     carl
> --
>     carl lowenstein         marine physical lab     u.c. san diego
>                                                  clowenstein at ucsd.edu
>

Hello!
Actually yes! That is the book I was trying to think of this morning.
I even came very close to building the thing, but ran out of time
trying to find the parts, let alone the actual time needed to build
the thing.

Since their ideas are good ones for what I do, I'll probably buy the
book via that method from Amazon, in addition to a few trillion
others.
-- 
Gregg C Levine gregg.drwho8 at gmail.com
"This signature was once found posting rude
 messages in English in the Moscow subway."

[pups] Suitable PDP11s, in the UK

[Brantley Coile]

Wes,
Is this the book you are thinking of?

http://research.microsoft.com/users/gbell/Computer_Engineering/index.html

> To add to this, there used to be a book on computer engineering with details 
> on designing a PDP of some particular nature.  (It might even have been a 
> PDP-11.)
> 
> Is it possible to persuade the writer of that book - a University textbook I 
> think - to donate it to PUPS?  Alternatively, does someone have an updated 
> PDP-11 design that they would be willing to donate to PUPS for anyone with a 
> soldering iron and enough time, to play with?
> 
> I'm thinking this would be the way to solve this sort of problem in one fell 
> swoop, if as I suspect is likely, it is impossible to find a working and 
> available PDP-11 in the UK.
> 
> Just my 0.02c worth - and my, hasn't inflation risen ... ;)
> 
> Wesley Parish
> 
> On Friday 02 November 2007 06:31, Tim Bradshaw wrote:
>> Having long ago got rid of my collection of ageing British (super)
>> minis, I realise I'm missing them, though I'm not sure why.  I can't
>> pretend any more that something running 4.2BSD is really practical,
>> so I'd like to get something really impractical, like a pdp11.
>>
>> What I'd like to be able to do is run 7th edition or thereabouts and/
>> or 2.11BSD on something which is not too large (so full-height 19"
>> racks are out).   I'm not interested in emulators.  It looks to me
>> like there are such systems - for instance the recently-discussed
>> 11/23 (or 11/73) looks practical, other than being in Utah.
>>
>> So I guess I have two questions:
>>
>> Firstly is this a practical thing to do in terms of reliability of HW
>> etc?  I finally gave up on the previous lot of machines at least
>> partly because disks &c were just so flaky that it was too painful to
>> keep things working (also we're talking full-height 19" racks in some
>> cases so they were a bit, well, big).  I don't want to spend my life
>> trying to source ancient disks etc (though I'm clearly not expecting
>> things to be as reliable as good, new modern kit).
>>
>> Secondly, does anyone in the UK (may be there is no one but me, of
>> course...) have any hints where I might look and what I might expect
>> to pay.  I've looked on ebay but I'm a little nervous of what I might
>> get that way.
>>
>> Thanks
>>
>> --tim
>> _______________________________________________
>> PUPS mailing list
>> PUPS at minnie.tuhs.org
>> https://minnie.tuhs.org/mailman/listinfo/pups
> 
> -- 
> Clinersterton beademung, with all of love - RIP James Blish
> -----
> Gaul is quartered into three halves.  Things which are 
> impossible are equal to each other.  Guerrilla 
> warfare means up to their monkey tricks. 
> Extracts from "Schoolboy Howlers" - the collective wisdom 
> of the foolish.
> -----
> Mau e ki, he aha te mea nui?
> You ask, what is the most important thing?
> Maku e ki, he tangata, he tangata, he tangata.
> I reply, it is people, it is people, it is people.
> _______________________________________________
> PUPS mailing list
> PUPS at minnie.tuhs.org
> https://minnie.tuhs.org/mailman/listinfo/pups

[pups] Suitable PDP11s, in the UK

[Wesley Parish]

On Saturday 03 November 2007 02:42, Brantley Coile wrote:
> Wes,
> Is this the book you are thinking of?
>
> http://research.microsoft.com/users/gbell/Computer_Engineering/index.html

Yes, thanks!

Wesley Parish
>
> > To add to this, there used to be a book on computer engineering with
> > details on designing a PDP of some particular nature.  (It might even
> > have been a PDP-11.)
> >
> > Is it possible to persuade the writer of that book - a University
> > textbook I think - to donate it to PUPS?  Alternatively, does someone
> > have an updated PDP-11 design that they would be willing to donate to
> > PUPS for anyone with a soldering iron and enough time, to play with?
> >
> > I'm thinking this would be the way to solve this sort of problem in one
> > fell swoop, if as I suspect is likely, it is impossible to find a working
> > and available PDP-11 in the UK.
> >
> > Just my 0.02c worth - and my, hasn't inflation risen ... ;)
> >
> > Wesley Parish
> >
> > On Friday 02 November 2007 06:31, Tim Bradshaw wrote:
> >> Having long ago got rid of my collection of ageing British (super)
> >> minis, I realise I'm missing them, though I'm not sure why.  I can't
> >> pretend any more that something running 4.2BSD is really practical,
> >> so I'd like to get something really impractical, like a pdp11.
> >>
> >> What I'd like to be able to do is run 7th edition or thereabouts and/
> >> or 2.11BSD on something which is not too large (so full-height 19"
> >> racks are out).   I'm not interested in emulators.  It looks to me
> >> like there are such systems - for instance the recently-discussed
> >> 11/23 (or 11/73) looks practical, other than being in Utah.
> >>
> >> So I guess I have two questions:
> >>
> >> Firstly is this a practical thing to do in terms of reliability of HW
> >> etc?  I finally gave up on the previous lot of machines at least
> >> partly because disks &c were just so flaky that it was too painful to
> >> keep things working (also we're talking full-height 19" racks in some
> >> cases so they were a bit, well, big).  I don't want to spend my life
> >> trying to source ancient disks etc (though I'm clearly not expecting
> >> things to be as reliable as good, new modern kit).
> >>
> >> Secondly, does anyone in the UK (may be there is no one but me, of
> >> course...) have any hints where I might look and what I might expect
> >> to pay.  I've looked on ebay but I'm a little nervous of what I might
> >> get that way.
> >>
> >> Thanks
> >>
> >> --tim
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> PUPS mailing list
> >> PUPS at minnie.tuhs.org
> >> https://minnie.tuhs.org/mailman/listinfo/pups
> >
> > --
> > Clinersterton beademung, with all of love - RIP James Blish
> > -----
> > Gaul is quartered into three halves.  Things which are
> > impossible are equal to each other.  Guerrilla
> > warfare means up to their monkey tricks.
> > Extracts from "Schoolboy Howlers" - the collective wisdom
> > of the foolish.
> > -----
> > Mau e ki, he aha te mea nui?
> > You ask, what is the most important thing?
> > Maku e ki, he tangata, he tangata, he tangata.
> > I reply, it is people, it is people, it is people.
> > _______________________________________________
> > PUPS mailing list
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-- 
Clinersterton beademung, with all of love - RIP James Blish
-----
Gaul is quartered into three halves.  Things which are 
impossible are equal to each other.  Guerrilla 
warfare means up to their monkey tricks. 
Extracts from "Schoolboy Howlers" - the collective wisdom 
of the foolish.
-----
Mau e ki, he aha te mea nui?
You ask, what is the most important thing?
Maku e ki, he tangata, he tangata, he tangata.
I reply, it is people, it is people, it is people.