Unnecessary nntp reading?

Unnecessary nntp reading?

[John Griffith]

I have all my mail (nnml) groups on levels 1 and 2 and all nntp groups
on 3 and 4.

I'm trying to figure out what several variables do and how they
interact with each other.  Namely the variables:
  - gnus-activate-level
  - gnus-read-active-file
  - gnus-check-new-newsgroups

A) If I set gnus-activate-level to 1 and gnus-check-new-newsgroups to
   nil I would suspect that the nntp server should not be read at all,
   but it is - even if gnus-read-active-file is nil as well. However,
   as I would expect, the nntp groups are not updated.  What is Gnus
   looking for?  It's not looking for newgroups and it's not looking
   for active information on my nntp groups.

B) If I set gnus-activate-level to 1 and gnus-check-new-newsgroups to
   nil and gnus-read-active-file to `some' then I would suspect that
   (regardless of A above) the nntp groups' active information would
   not be read - but they are.

The documentation for gnus-read-active-file says "If this variable is
`some', Gnus will try to only read the relevant parts of the active
file from the server."  I would think that the definition of a
"relevant part" should take into consideration that fact that if
gnus-activate-level is lower than all nntp groups (and no prefix
argument was given) then there are _no_ relevant parts.

Furthermore, what I would like (and expect) is that setting
gnus-activate-level to 3 and gnus-read-active-file to `some' would
allow me to put some "subscribed" nntp groups on level 4 but not have
their active information updated (and therefor not spend lots of time)
unless I use an explicit prefix argument to "M-x gnus" or "g" from the
group buffer, etc.

If these things are not bugs, then I think the documentation of these
variables should explain and motivate this behavior.

Re: Unnecessary nntp reading?

[Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen]

John Griffith <griffith@sfs.nphil.uni-tuebingen.de> writes:

> A) If I set gnus-activate-level to 1 and gnus-check-new-newsgroups to
>    nil I would suspect that the nntp server should not be read at all,
>    but it is - even if gnus-read-active-file is nil as well. However,
>    as I would expect, the nntp groups are not updated.  What is Gnus
>    looking for?  It's not looking for newgroups and it's not looking
>    for active information on my nntp groups.

If `gnus-read-active-file' is nil, the active file shouldn't be read.
Sounds like a bug.

> B) If I set gnus-activate-level to 1 and gnus-check-new-newsgroups to
>    nil and gnus-read-active-file to `some' then I would suspect that
>    (regardless of A above) the nntp groups' active information would
>    not be read - but they are.

The activation level is orthogonal to the issue of reading the active
file. 

-- 
(domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.)
  larsi@gnus.org * Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen

Re: Unnecessary nntp reading?

[John Griffith]

>> "LMI" == Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen <larsi@gnus.org> writes:

LMI> The activation level is orthogonal to the issue of reading the active
LMI> file. 

OK.  What does "activation level" mean?  What does it do that
subscribedness levels don't do?  Does it just control which lines in
the group buffer get updated?

I haven't tried this, but does it mean that if my activation level say
2 and I have nntp groups on level 3 and gnus-read-active-file is
`some' (and level 3 is a subscribed level - or even an unsubscribed
level) then all the active file information will be retrieved but it
just won't be shown?

If so, then what is the purpose of activation level?  If I don't want
to see the level 3 groups I can just look at the level 2 and below
groups.

[Guessing wildly] Or does activation level just prevent foreign groups
from being read?  This I guess would be an advantage - if I have
foreign nntp groups on level 5 I may not want their servers to be read
but I may still want to read all of the groups on my primary server.

In any case, I think the documentation for gnus-activate-level (and
perhaps gnus-read-active-file) should explain better what it does.
And/or define activation level in the terminology section.

Re: Unnecessary nntp reading?

[Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen]

John Griffith <griffith@sfs.nphil.uni-tuebingen.de> writes:

> OK.  What does "activation level" mean?

It means that Gnus does the math to figure out how many unread
articles there are in groups.  Unactivated groups are listed with "*"
in the group buffer.

> What does it do that subscribedness levels don't do?  Does it just
> control which lines in the group buffer get updated?

Yes.

> I haven't tried this, but does it mean that if my activation level say
> 2 and I have nntp groups on level 3 and gnus-read-active-file is
> `some' (and level 3 is a subscribed level - or even an unsubscribed
> level) then all the active file information will be retrieved but it
> just won't be shown?

Yes.

> If so, then what is the purpose of activation level?  If I don't want
> to see the level 3 groups I can just look at the level 2 and below
> groups.

Yes, that's true.

The activation level is mostly irrelevant -- unless you have set
`gnus-read-active-file' to nil.  In which case it is relevant.

> [Guessing wildly] Or does activation level just prevent foreign groups
> from being read?

No, that's controlled by `gnus-activate-foreign-newsgroups'.

-- 
(domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.)
  larsi@gnus.org * Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen