[NTG-context] "Registerhaltigkeit"

[NTG-context] "Registerhaltigkeit"

[Thomas Meyer]

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Hi folks,

which settings are necessary to achieve "Registerhaltigkeit"?

Thank you in advance
Thomas

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[NTG-context] Re: "Registerhaltigkeit"

[Wolfgang Schuster]

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Thomas Meyer schrieb am 14.01.2024 um 10:30:
> Hi folks,
>
> which settings are necessary to achieve "Registerhaltigkeit"?

\setuplayout[grid=yes]

but sometimes elements elements have to be forced to be on the grid, 
e.g. tables need to be part of a float.

Wolfgang


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[NTG-context] Re: "Registerhaltigkeit"

[Henning Hraban Ramm]

Am 14.01.24 um 10:30 schrieb Thomas Meyer:
> which settings are necessary to achieve "Registerhaltigkeit"?

\setuplayout[grid=yes]

You might like \showgrid, and please read the manual details.pdf WRT to 
placement of elements that don’t fit the grid.

Hraban
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[NTG-context] Re: "Registerhaltigkeit"

[Thomas Meyer]

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Thank you Wolfgang and Hraban,
it can be so easy!

But if my last subject should be at the end of the page and I shift it 
with \vfill to the end, the last subject doesn't fit the grid!

Am 14.01.24 um 11:02 schrieb Henning Hraban Ramm:
> Am 14.01.24 um 10:30 schrieb Thomas Meyer:
>> which settings are necessary to achieve "Registerhaltigkeit"?
>
> \setuplayout[grid=yes]
>
> You might like \showgrid, and please read the manual details.pdf WRT 
> to placement of elements that don’t fit the grid.
>
> Hraban
> ___________________________________________________________________________________ 
>
> If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry 
> to the Wiki!
>
> maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / 
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> (mirror)
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>

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[NTG-context] Re: "Registerhaltigkeit"

[Wolfgang Schuster]

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Thomas Meyer schrieb am 14.01.2024 um 11:21:
> Thank you Wolfgang and Hraban,
> it can be so easy!
>
> But if my last subject should be at the end of the page and I shift it 
> with \vfill to the end, the last subject doesn't fit the grid!

Can you provide a minimal example where you show what you're trying to 
place at the bottom of the page.

Wolfgang


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[NTG-context] Re: "Registerhaltigkeit"

[Thomas Meyer]

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Here comes my minimal example.
\vfill doesn't fit the grid, the counted blank works.

Is it possible to jump to grid with blank[?] ?

Am 14.01.24 um 13:53 schrieb Wolfgang Schuster:
> Thomas Meyer schrieb am 14.01.2024 um 11:21:
>> Thank you Wolfgang and Hraban,
>> it can be so easy!
>>
>> But if my last subject should be at the end of the page and I shift 
>> it with \vfill to the end, the last subject doesn't fit the grid!
>
> Can you provide a minimal example where you show what you're trying to 
> place at the bottom of the page.
>
> Wolfgang
>

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[NTG-context] Re: "Registerhaltigkeit"

[Thomas Meyer]

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Got it.

Am 14.01.24 um 17:36 schrieb Thomas Meyer:
> Here comes my minimal example.
> \vfill doesn't fit the grid, the counted blank works.
>
> Is it possible to jump to grid with blank[?] ?
>
> Am 14.01.24 um 13:53 schrieb Wolfgang Schuster:
>> Thomas Meyer schrieb am 14.01.2024 um 11:21:
>>> Thank you Wolfgang and Hraban,
>>> it can be so easy!
>>>
>>> But if my last subject should be at the end of the page and I shift 
>>> it with \vfill to the end, the last subject doesn't fit the grid!
>>
>> Can you provide a minimal example where you show what you're trying 
>> to place at the bottom of the page.
>>
>> Wolfgang
>>
>
>
> ___________________________________________________________________________________
> If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki!
>
> maillist :ntg-context@ntg.nl  /https://mailman.ntg.nl/mailman3/lists/ntg-context.ntg.nl
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[NTG-context] context version 20240118 (was: "Registerhaltigkeit")

[Thomas Meyer]

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What is going on?

Yesterday I got a perfect on-grid-written document!
But today, with the newest context-version (20240118) all changed for 
the worse.

I may not get a reply to this e-mail either!


Am 17.01.24 um 20:57 schrieb Thomas Meyer:
> Got it.
>
> Am 14.01.24 um 17:36 schrieb Thomas Meyer:
>> Here comes my minimal example.
>> \vfill doesn't fit the grid, the counted blank works.
>>
>> Is it possible to jump to grid with blank[?] ?
>>
>> Am 14.01.24 um 13:53 schrieb Wolfgang Schuster:
>>> Thomas Meyer schrieb am 14.01.2024 um 11:21:
>>>> Thank you Wolfgang and Hraban,
>>>> it can be so easy!
>>>>
>>>> But if my last subject should be at the end of the page and I shift 
>>>> it with \vfill to the end, the last subject doesn't fit the grid!
>>>
>>> Can you provide a minimal example where you show what you're trying 
>>> to place at the bottom of the page.
>>>
>>> Wolfgang
>>>
>>
>>
>> ___________________________________________________________________________________
>> If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki!
>>
>> maillist :ntg-context@ntg.nl  /https://mailman.ntg.nl/mailman3/lists/ntg-context.ntg.nl
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>> archive  :https://github.com/contextgarden/context
>> wiki     :https://wiki.contextgarden.net
>> ___________________________________________________________________________________
>
>
> ___________________________________________________________________________________
> If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki!
>
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[NTG-context] Re: context version 20240118

[Hans Hagen via ntg-context]

On 1/18/2024 12:59 PM, Thomas Meyer wrote:
> What is going on?
> 
> Yesterday I got a perfect on-grid-written document!
> But today, with the newest context-version (20240118) all changed for 
> the worse.

as follow up on the keyword thread we decided to treat bad values to 
equivalent to 'no'

> I may not get a reply to this e-mail either!
?

Hans


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                                           Hans Hagen | PRAGMA ADE
               Ridderstraat 27 | 8061 GH Hasselt | The Netherlands
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[NTG-context] Re: context version 20240118

[Thomas Meyer]

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I may not understand it ...
Where can I find the thread (which keyword?)and which values are bad?

Greetings
Thomas

Am 18.01.24 um 13:06 schrieb Hans Hagen via ntg-context:
> as follow up on the keyword thread we decided to treat bad values to 
> equivalent to 'no'

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[NTG-context] Re: context version 20240118 (was: "Registerhaltigkeit")

[luigi scarso]

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On Thu, 18 Jan 2024 at 13:00, Thomas Meyer <thomasgmeyer@t-online.de> wrote:

> What is going on?
>
> Yesterday I got a perfect on-grid-written document!
> But today, with the newest context-version (20240118) all changed for the
> worse.
>
> I may not get a reply to this e-mail either!
>
>
> Am 17.01.24 um 20:57 schrieb Thomas Meyer:
>
> Got it.
>
> Was it with a huge attachment (> 100KB)?
In this case I could have rejected it .

--
luigi

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[NTG-context] Re: context version 20240118

[Thomas Meyer]

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Am 18.01.24 um 13:51 schrieb luigi scarso:
>
>
> On Thu, 18 Jan 2024 at 13:00, Thomas Meyer <thomasgmeyer@t-online.de> 
> wrote:
>
>     What is going on?
>
>     Yesterday I got a perfect on-grid-written document!
>     But today, with the newest context-version (20240118) all changed
>     for the worse.
>
>     I may not get a reply to this e-mail either!
>
>
>     Am 17.01.24 um 20:57 schrieb Thomas Meyer:
>>     Got it.
>>
> Was it with a huge attachment (> 100KB)?
> In this case I could have rejected it .
>
> --
> luigi
>

No attachment, only three pages text.

I have had problems to get it fine onto grid. Yesterday all was nice, 
and I wanted to make it standard for my texts.
But now ...

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[NTG-context] Re: context version 20240118 ("Registerhaltigkeit")

[Thomas Meyer]

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Hi Hans,

maybe you understand the question mark now, you are part of it. 
Unfortunately, I haven't received a reply to my last e-mail from January 
18.
Maybe only those whose questions are more serious, more interesting or 
whatever will get an answer.

I do not understand what you mean with "as follow up on the keyword 
thread we decided to treat bad values to equivalent to 'no'"! Which 
values are bad in this context?

With the new ConTeXt version, "grid" no longer works for me! Too bad.

Should my attempt to use ConTeXt end here?

Greetings

Am 18.01.24 um 13:06 schrieb Hans Hagen via ntg-context:
> On 1/18/2024 12:59 PM, Thomas Meyer wrote:
>> What is going on?
>>
>> Yesterday I got a perfect on-grid-written document!
>> But today, with the newest context-version (20240118) all changed for 
>> the worse.
>
> as follow up on the keyword thread we decided to treat bad values to 
> equivalent to 'no'
>
>> I may not get a reply to this e-mail either!
> ?
>
> Hans
>
>
> -----------------------------------------------------------------
>                                           Hans Hagen | PRAGMA ADE
>               Ridderstraat 27 | 8061 GH Hasselt | The Netherlands
>        tel: 038 477 53 69 | www.pragma-ade.nl | www.pragma-pod.nl
> -----------------------------------------------------------------
>
> ___________________________________________________________________________________ 
>
> If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry 
> to the Wiki!
>
> maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / 
> https://mailman.ntg.nl/mailman3/lists/ntg-context.ntg.nl
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> (mirror)
> archive  : https://github.com/contextgarden/context
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> ___________________________________________________________________________________ 
>

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[NTG-context] Re: context version 20240118 ("Registerhaltigkeit")

[Hans Hagen via ntg-context]

On 1/22/2024 10:47 AM, Thomas Meyer wrote:
> Hi Hans,
> 
> maybe you understand the question mark now, you are part of it. 
> Unfortunately, I haven't received a reply to my last e-mail from January 
> 18.

No I don't. Are you sayign that you want an instant reply every time? I 
assume you realize that we're talking about volunteers here and that 
answering is askign users and developers to allocate free time to answer 
them and as we all have jobs it's not like we can always answer 
immediately.

> Maybe only those whose questions are more serious, more interesting or 
> whatever will get an answer.

Depends. I guess that when folk on this list assume a question to be 
answered they move on to a next one. Also, the only way to get an answer 
fast is to provide a good small example that exposes the issue.

> I do not understand what you mean with "as follow up on the keyword 
> thread we decided to treat bad values to equivalent to 'no'"! Which 
> values are bad in this context?

Did you read Wolfgangs answers? We support "yes" but not "yes " etc etc. 
We just added a bit more rigorous test.

> With the new ConTeXt version, "grid" no longer works for me! Too bad.

Let's see what Wolfgang says as he tested your mwe.

> Should my attempt to use ConTeXt end here?
hm

Hans

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                                           Hans Hagen | PRAGMA ADE
               Ridderstraat 27 | 8061 GH Hasselt | The Netherlands
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[NTG-context] Re: context version 20240118 ("Registerhaltigkeit")

[Thomas Meyer]

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Hi Hans,

I might get a bit impatient if I have the impression that others get an 
answer faster. Sorry for that.

I thought my example couldn't be any smaller. The only answer I got 
from Wolfgang was the question for a mwe.

Now I found the missing comma and  grid works with the new version of 
ConTeXt except the last paragraph. With the older version as in MacTeX 
and without comma, the whole 3-pages-document is on grid. So the problem 
is still \hfill that the last paragraph is not on grid in the new and 
the old version (and comma).

Sorry again - and I will continue to try Context!

Greetings
Thomas

Am 22.01.24 um 10:56 schrieb Hans Hagen via ntg-context:
> On 1/22/2024 10:47 AM, Thomas Meyer wrote:
>> Hi Hans,
>>
>> maybe you understand the question mark now, you are part of it. 
>> Unfortunately, I haven't received a reply to my last e-mail from 
>> January 18.
>
> No I don't. Are you sayign that you want an instant reply every time? 
> I assume you realize that we're talking about volunteers here and that 
> answering is askign users and developers to allocate free time to 
> answer them and as we all have jobs it's not like we can always answer 
> immediately.
>
>> Maybe only those whose questions are more serious, more interesting 
>> or whatever will get an answer.
>
> Depends. I guess that when folk on this list assume a question to be 
> answered they move on to a next one. Also, the only way to get an 
> answer fast is to provide a good small example that exposes the issue.
>
>> I do not understand what you mean with "as follow up on the keyword 
>> thread we decided to treat bad values to equivalent to 'no'"! Which 
>> values are bad in this context?
>
> Did you read Wolfgangs answers? We support "yes" but not "yes " etc 
> etc. We just added a bit more rigorous test.
>
>> With the new ConTeXt version, "grid" no longer works for me! Too bad.
>
> Let's see what Wolfgang says as he tested your mwe.
>
>> Should my attempt to use ConTeXt end here?
> hm
>
> Hans
>
> -----------------------------------------------------------------
>                                           Hans Hagen | PRAGMA ADE
>               Ridderstraat 27 | 8061 GH Hasselt | The Netherlands
>        tel: 038 477 53 69 | www.pragma-ade.nl | www.pragma-pod.nl
> -----------------------------------------------------------------
>
> ___________________________________________________________________________________ 
>
> If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry 
> to the Wiki!
>
> maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / 
> https://mailman.ntg.nl/mailman3/lists/ntg-context.ntg.nl
> webpage  : https://www.pragma-ade.nl / https://context.aanhet.net 
> (mirror)
> archive  : https://github.com/contextgarden/context
> wiki     : https://wiki.contextgarden.net
> ___________________________________________________________________________________ 
>

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[NTG-context] Re: context version 20240118 ("Registerhaltigkeit")

[Henning Hraban Ramm]

Am 22.01.24 um 11:46 schrieb Thomas Meyer:
> I might get a bit impatient if I have the impression that others get an 
> answer faster. Sorry for that.

It’s not unusual to get that impression. It depends on the current 
attention, capacity and mood of the few who can answer your questions.

> So the problem 
> is still \hfill that the last paragraph is not on grid in the new and 
> the old version (and comma).

Grid is not as easy as it looks first. Low level tricks like fills or 
skips can mess it up.


Maybe \startlinecorrection helps… (No, it doesn’t.)

It also doesn’t help to add a \blank or \par after \vfill.


Hans, how about adding \blank[fill] for a vertical fill that keeps the 
grid (in grid mode, of course)?



https://wiki.contextgarden.net/Grid_typesetting is not very helpful, 
some links are dead, “someone” should change that.

The details manual has some hints about grid typesetting, but it’s not 
an easy read.

Hraban
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[NTG-context] Re: context version 20240118 ("Registerhaltigkeit")

[Thomas Meyer]

Am 22.01.24 um 12:06 schrieb Henning Hraban Ramm:
> Am 22.01.24 um 11:46 schrieb Thomas Meyer:
>> I might get a bit impatient if I have the impression that others get 
>> an answer faster. Sorry for that.
>
> It’s not unusual to get that impression. It depends on the current 
> attention, capacity and mood of the few who can answer your questions.
>
>> So the problem is still \hfill that the last paragraph is not on grid 
>> in the new and the old version (and comma).
>
> Grid is not as easy as it looks first. Low level tricks like fills or 
> skips can mess it up.
>
>
> Maybe \startlinecorrection helps… (No, it doesn’t.)
>
> It also doesn’t help to add a \blank or \par after \vfill.

I know it, i tried it. And I tried \snaptogrid \vbox {}, it doesn't work 
too.

Only counting empty rows and set the number in \blank[ *big] works!

>
>
> Hans, how about adding \blank[fill] for a vertical fill that keeps the 
> grid (in grid mode, of course)?
>
>
>
> https://wiki.contextgarden.net/Grid_typesetting is not very helpful, 
> some links are dead, “someone” should change that.
>
> The details manual has some hints about grid typesetting, but it’s not 
> an easy read.
>
> Hraban
> ___________________________________________________________________________________ 
>
> If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry 
> to the Wiki!
>
> maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / 
> https://mailman.ntg.nl/mailman3/lists/ntg-context.ntg.nl
> webpage  : https://www.pragma-ade.nl / https://context.aanhet.net 
> (mirror)
> archive  : https://github.com/contextgarden/context
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> ___________________________________________________________________________________ 
>

___________________________________________________________________________________
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___________________________________________________________________________________

[NTG-context] Re: context version 20240118 ("Registerhaltigkeit")

[Wolfgang Schuster]

Thomas Meyer schrieb am 22.01.2024 um 13:04:
> 
> 
> Am 22.01.24 um 12:06 schrieb Henning Hraban Ramm:
>> Am 22.01.24 um 11:46 schrieb Thomas Meyer:
>>> I might get a bit impatient if I have the impression that others get 
>>> an answer faster. Sorry for that.
>>
>> It’s not unusual to get that impression. It depends on the current 
>> attention, capacity and mood of the few who can answer your questions.
>>
>>> So the problem is still \hfill that the last paragraph is not on grid 
>>> in the new and the old version (and comma).
>>
>> Grid is not as easy as it looks first. Low level tricks like fills or 
>> skips can mess it up.
>>
>>
>> Maybe \startlinecorrection helps… (No, it doesn’t.)
>>
>> It also doesn’t help to add a \blank or \par after \vfill.
> 
> I know it, i tried it. And I tried \snaptogrid \vbox {}, it doesn't work 
> too.
> 
> Only counting empty rows and set the number in \blank[ *big] works!


You need a fixed space (multiple of the line distance) between the text 
blocks and \vfill is a variable space which isn't what you want here.

TO get the desired space between the blocks you have to measure the 
height of the text at the bottom and calculate the number of lines which 
have to be added in the gap. Below is a simple solution which adds the 
required number of \blank lines.

\def\PlaceAtBottom
   {\par
    \dowithnextbox
       {\scratchdimen\dimexpr\pagegoal-\pagetotal\relax
        \ifdim\nextboxht>\scratchdimen
          \page
          \getnoflines{\dimexpr\textheight-\nextboxht\relax}%
          \dontleavehmode\blank[\number\numexpr\noflines-2\relax*line]%
          \unvbox\nextbox
        \else
          \getnoflines{\dimexpr\scratchdimen-\nextboxht\relax}%
          \blank[\number\numexpr\noflines-1\relax*line]%
          \unvbox\nextbox
        \fi}
       \vbox}

\let\stopPlaceAtBottom\egroup

\def\startPlaceAtBottom
   {\PlaceAtBottom\bgroup}

\mainlanguage[de]
\setupbodyfont[libertinus, 12pt]

\setuppagenumbering
   [location={footer,middle}]

\setuplayout
   [grid=yes]

\showgrid

\starttext

\samplefile{lorem}

\startPlaceAtBottom
{\sl\samplefile{lorem}}
\stopPlaceAtBottom

\page

\dorecurse{4}{\samplefile{lorem}}

\startPlaceAtBottom
{\sl\samplefile{lorem}}
\stopPlaceAtBottom

\stoptext

Wolfgang
___________________________________________________________________________________
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___________________________________________________________________________________

[NTG-context] Re: context version 20240118 ("Registerhaltigkeit")

[Thomas Meyer]

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That's it! Many thanks to Hans, Hraban and especially Wolfgang for his 
solution. This environment should become part of ConTeXt!

I have been a LaTeX/XeTeX/LuaLaTeX user for over 30 years and used it to 
write my papers during my studies and use it for almost all my writing.
Now I wanted to try ConTeXt and will be glad if anyone can help me. As I 
said, I am only a user.

Many thanks and best regards
Thomas


Am 22.01.24 um 20:24 schrieb Wolfgang Schuster:
> Thomas Meyer schrieb am 22.01.2024 um 13:04:
>>
>>
>> Am 22.01.24 um 12:06 schrieb Henning Hraban Ramm:
>>> Am 22.01.24 um 11:46 schrieb Thomas Meyer:
>>>> I might get a bit impatient if I have the impression that others 
>>>> get an answer faster. Sorry for that.
>>>
>>> It’s not unusual to get that impression. It depends on the current 
>>> attention, capacity and mood of the few who can answer your questions.
>>>
>>>> So the problem is still \hfill that the last paragraph is not on 
>>>> grid in the new and the old version (and comma).
>>>
>>> Grid is not as easy as it looks first. Low level tricks like fills 
>>> or skips can mess it up.
>>>
>>>
>>> Maybe \startlinecorrection helps… (No, it doesn’t.)
>>>
>>> It also doesn’t help to add a \blank or \par after \vfill.
>>
>> I know it, i tried it. And I tried \snaptogrid \vbox {}, it doesn't 
>> work too.
>>
>> Only counting empty rows and set the number in \blank[ *big] works!
>
>
> You need a fixed space (multiple of the line distance) between the 
> text blocks and \vfill is a variable space which isn't what you want 
> here.
>
> TO get the desired space between the blocks you have to measure the 
> height of the text at the bottom and calculate the number of lines 
> which have to be added in the gap. Below is a simple solution which 
> adds the required number of \blank lines.
>
> \def\PlaceAtBottom
>   {\par
>    \dowithnextbox
>       {\scratchdimen\dimexpr\pagegoal-\pagetotal\relax
>        \ifdim\nextboxht>\scratchdimen
>          \page
>          \getnoflines{\dimexpr\textheight-\nextboxht\relax}%
> \dontleavehmode\blank[\number\numexpr\noflines-2\relax*line]%
>          \unvbox\nextbox
>        \else
>          \getnoflines{\dimexpr\scratchdimen-\nextboxht\relax}%
>          \blank[\number\numexpr\noflines-1\relax*line]%
>          \unvbox\nextbox
>        \fi}
>       \vbox}
>
> \let\stopPlaceAtBottom\egroup
>
> \def\startPlaceAtBottom
>   {\PlaceAtBottom\bgroup}
>
> \mainlanguage[de]
> \setupbodyfont[libertinus, 12pt]
>
> \setuppagenumbering
>   [location={footer,middle}]
>
> \setuplayout
>   [grid=yes]
>
> \showgrid
>
> \starttext
>
> \samplefile{lorem}
>
> \startPlaceAtBottom
> {\sl\samplefile{lorem}}
> \stopPlaceAtBottom
>
> \page
>
> \dorecurse{4}{\samplefile{lorem}}
>
> \startPlaceAtBottom
> {\sl\samplefile{lorem}}
> \stopPlaceAtBottom
>
> \stoptext
>
> Wolfgang
> ___________________________________________________________________________________ 
>
> If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry 
> to the Wiki!
>
> maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / 
> https://mailman.ntg.nl/mailman3/lists/ntg-context.ntg.nl
> webpage  : https://www.pragma-ade.nl / https://context.aanhet.net 
> (mirror)
> archive  : https://github.com/contextgarden/context
> wiki     : https://wiki.contextgarden.net
> ___________________________________________________________________________________ 
>

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___________________________________________________________________________________
If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki!

maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / https://mailman.ntg.nl/mailman3/lists/ntg-context.ntg.nl
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wiki     : https://wiki.contextgarden.net
___________________________________________________________________________________