* [TUHS] PWB contributions
@ 2015-11-09 1:39 Doug McIlroy
2015-11-09 1:48 ` John Cowan
` (2 more replies)
0 siblings, 3 replies; 33+ messages in thread
From: Doug McIlroy @ 2015-11-09 1:39 UTC (permalink / raw)
>> I thought PWB (makers of "make") came from Harvard?
> PWB ... came straight out of Bell. Not sure about all the
> applications (well, SCCS came from Bell).
PWB did not create make; Stu Feldman did it in research.
PWB did make SCCS. I believe it also originated cico,
find and eval. Probably more, too, but I can't reliably
separate PWB's other contributions from USG's.
Doug
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 33+ messages in thread* [TUHS] PWB contributions 2015-11-09 1:39 [TUHS] PWB contributions Doug McIlroy @ 2015-11-09 1:48 ` John Cowan 2015-11-09 2:12 ` Clement T. Cole 2015-11-09 4:44 ` Larry McVoy 2 siblings, 0 replies; 33+ messages in thread From: John Cowan @ 2015-11-09 1:48 UTC (permalink / raw) Doug McIlroy scripsit: > PWB did not create make; Stu Feldman did it in research. Which is why, according to Google folklore, the desktop he was set up with on the first day did not have a TAB key. > PWB did make SCCS. I believe it also originated cico, > find and eval. The Mashey shell, obviously, and -mm. Wikipedia claims that cpio, expr, xargs, yacc, and lex first appeared outside the Bell Labs boundary in the PWB release, though at least the last two were certainly not PWB-specific. -- John Cowan http://www.ccil.org/~cowan cowan at ccil.org If you understand, things are just as they are. if you do not understand, things are just as they are. ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 33+ messages in thread
* [TUHS] PWB contributions 2015-11-09 1:39 [TUHS] PWB contributions Doug McIlroy 2015-11-09 1:48 ` John Cowan @ 2015-11-09 2:12 ` Clement T. Cole 2015-11-09 2:54 ` Win Treese ` (2 more replies) 2015-11-09 4:44 ` Larry McVoy 2 siblings, 3 replies; 33+ messages in thread From: Clement T. Cole @ 2015-11-09 2:12 UTC (permalink / raw) Doug Eric Shienbrood originally wrote more(1) at UCB when he came as a grad student. It was based on functionality from ITS that he as used to having at MIT. Summit wrote a similar program with the same called page(1) and I'm fairly sure it was few years after Eric's program. Btw page(1) which did not have the same functionality (no termcap or in there case terminfo yet). Less(1) would show up a few years later and replace them both. Clem Sent from my iPad On Nov 8, 2015, at 8:39 PM, Doug McIlroy <doug at cs.dartmouth.edu> wrote: >>> I thought PWB (makers of "make") came from Harvard? > >> PWB ... came straight out of Bell. Not sure about all the >> applications (well, SCCS came from Bell). > > PWB did not create make; Stu Feldman did it in research. > PWB did make SCCS. I believe it also originated cico, > find and eval. Probably more, too, but I can't reliably > separate PWB's other contributions from USG's. > > Doug > _______________________________________________ > TUHS mailing list > TUHS at minnie.tuhs.org > https://minnie.tuhs.org/mailman/listinfo/tuhs ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 33+ messages in thread
* [TUHS] PWB contributions 2015-11-09 2:12 ` Clement T. Cole @ 2015-11-09 2:54 ` Win Treese 2015-11-09 2:58 ` Win Treese 2015-11-09 13:58 ` Doug McIlroy 2015-11-09 22:23 ` [TUHS] PWB contributions Jeremy C. Reed 2 siblings, 1 reply; 33+ messages in thread From: Win Treese @ 2015-11-09 2:54 UTC (permalink / raw) [-- Warning: decoded text below may be mangled, UTF-8 assumed --] [-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 1948 bytes --] Clem, In trying to check on some memories of mine, I came across your answer on Quora about "What is the difference between less and cat command?”, in which you mention that Wikipedia had it wrong about Dan Halbert writing more(1). What Dan did tell me many years ago is that he wrote a program called “less” when he was at Berkeley as a near-parody on more(1). Its notable feature was that it went backwards through the file, displaying in the opposite direction. This, of course, had nothing to do with what we now know as less(1), and that code is probably lost to history. - Win > On Nov 8, 2015, at 9:12 PM, Clement T. Cole <clemc at ccc.com> wrote: > > Doug > > Eric Shienbrood originally wrote more(1) at UCB when he came as a grad student. It was based on functionality from ITS that he as used to having at MIT. Summit wrote a similar program with the same called page(1) and I'm fairly sure it was few years after Eric's program. Btw page(1) which did not have the same functionality (no termcap or in there case terminfo yet). Less(1) would show up a few years later and replace them both. > > Clem > > Sent from my iPad > > On Nov 8, 2015, at 8:39 PM, Doug McIlroy <doug at cs.dartmouth.edu> wrote: > >>>> I thought PWB (makers of "make") came from Harvard? >> >>> PWB ... came straight out of Bell. Not sure about all the >>> applications (well, SCCS came from Bell). >> >> PWB did not create make; Stu Feldman did it in research. >> PWB did make SCCS. I believe it also originated cico, >> find and eval. Probably more, too, but I can't reliably >> separate PWB's other contributions from USG's. >> >> Doug >> _______________________________________________ >> TUHS mailing list >> TUHS at minnie.tuhs.org >> https://minnie.tuhs.org/mailman/listinfo/tuhs > _______________________________________________ > TUHS mailing list > TUHS at minnie.tuhs.org > https://minnie.tuhs.org/mailman/listinfo/tuhs ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 33+ messages in thread
* [TUHS] PWB contributions 2015-11-09 2:54 ` Win Treese @ 2015-11-09 2:58 ` Win Treese 2015-11-09 3:36 ` Clem cole 2015-11-09 3:38 ` Random832 0 siblings, 2 replies; 33+ messages in thread From: Win Treese @ 2015-11-09 2:58 UTC (permalink / raw) [-- Warning: decoded text below may be mangled, UTF-8 assumed --] [-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 2236 bytes --] Of course, as soon as I sent that, I found Dan Halbert’s version of things at http://www.danhalbert.org/more.html For what that’s worth. - Win > On Nov 8, 2015, at 9:54 PM, Win Treese <treese at acm.org> wrote: > > > Clem, > > In trying to check on some memories of mine, I came across your answer on > Quora about "What is the difference between less and cat command?”, in which > you mention that Wikipedia had it wrong about Dan Halbert writing more(1). > > What Dan did tell me many years ago is that he wrote a program called “less” > when he was at Berkeley as a near-parody on more(1). Its notable feature was > that it went backwards through the file, displaying in the opposite direction. > > This, of course, had nothing to do with what we now know as less(1), and that code > is probably lost to history. > > - Win > >> On Nov 8, 2015, at 9:12 PM, Clement T. Cole <clemc at ccc.com> wrote: >> >> Doug >> >> Eric Shienbrood originally wrote more(1) at UCB when he came as a grad student. It was based on functionality from ITS that he as used to having at MIT. Summit wrote a similar program with the same called page(1) and I'm fairly sure it was few years after Eric's program. Btw page(1) which did not have the same functionality (no termcap or in there case terminfo yet). Less(1) would show up a few years later and replace them both. >> >> Clem >> >> Sent from my iPad >> >> On Nov 8, 2015, at 8:39 PM, Doug McIlroy <doug at cs.dartmouth.edu> wrote: >> >>>>> I thought PWB (makers of "make") came from Harvard? >>> >>>> PWB ... came straight out of Bell. Not sure about all the >>>> applications (well, SCCS came from Bell). >>> >>> PWB did not create make; Stu Feldman did it in research. >>> PWB did make SCCS. I believe it also originated cico, >>> find and eval. Probably more, too, but I can't reliably >>> separate PWB's other contributions from USG's. >>> >>> Doug >>> _______________________________________________ >>> TUHS mailing list >>> TUHS at minnie.tuhs.org >>> https://minnie.tuhs.org/mailman/listinfo/tuhs >> _______________________________________________ >> TUHS mailing list >> TUHS at minnie.tuhs.org >> https://minnie.tuhs.org/mailman/listinfo/tuhs > ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 33+ messages in thread
* [TUHS] PWB contributions 2015-11-09 2:58 ` Win Treese @ 2015-11-09 3:36 ` Clem cole 2015-11-09 3:51 ` Clem cole ` (2 more replies) 2015-11-09 3:38 ` Random832 1 sibling, 3 replies; 33+ messages in thread From: Clem cole @ 2015-11-09 3:36 UTC (permalink / raw) [-- Warning: decoded text below may be mangled, UTF-8 assumed --] [-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 3803 bytes --] Interesting. If I run Into Eric any time soon I'll have to ask him. As I recall I don't remember Dan's version but I do remember Eric's. Nor do I remember Geoff hacking on it. Plus if you look at the CSRG db from Kirk, the DB shows Eric as the creator. What's more Dan's name is not in the man page - Eric's is. I wonder if this is a case where Dan wrote something specific for the ADM's and the 11s and Eric did something similar more general around the sametime. FWIW: Eric had always claimed to me that he wrote it and it is my memory that I got the sources from him for our systems in the CAD group in Cory hall (and have never had a reason to doubt him in that claim). I do remember more(1) was was one of the first programs that used Hortons termcap library that he had pulled out of joy's vi and greatly enhanced. Mike Arnold then took it and created curses (for Rogue actually). Btw Because of using termcap it forced a lot of us to put the termcap strings in the environment to speed up program start. Dans memory of the undergrad PDP 11 had being over loaded does line up with my memory. A couple of us were teaching CS-40 (the intro undergrad course) around that time and undergrads used the Cory 70s. I avoided them as much as possible. Sent from my iPhone > On Nov 8, 2015, at 9:58 PM, Win Treese <treese at acm.org> wrote: > > > Of course, as soon as I sent that, I found Dan Halbert’s version of things > at http://www.danhalbert.org/more.html > > For what that’s worth. > > - Win > >> On Nov 8, 2015, at 9:54 PM, Win Treese <treese at acm.org> wrote: >> >> >> Clem, >> >> In trying to check on some memories of mine, I came across your answer on >> Quora about "What is the difference between less and cat command?”, in which >> you mention that Wikipedia had it wrong about Dan Halbert writing more(1). >> >> What Dan did tell me many years ago is that he wrote a program called “less” >> when he was at Berkeley as a near-parody on more(1). Its notable feature was >> that it went backwards through the file, displaying in the opposite direction. >> >> This, of course, had nothing to do with what we now know as less(1), and that code >> is probably lost to history. >> >> - Win >> >>> On Nov 8, 2015, at 9:12 PM, Clement T. Cole <clemc at ccc.com> wrote: >>> >>> Doug >>> >>> Eric Shienbrood originally wrote more(1) at UCB when he came as a grad student. It was based on functionality from ITS that he as used to having at MIT. Summit wrote a similar program with the same called page(1) and I'm fairly sure it was few years after Eric's program. Btw page(1) which did not have the same functionality (no termcap or in there case terminfo yet). Less(1) would show up a few years later and replace them both. >>> >>> Clem >>> >>> Sent from my iPad >>> >>> On Nov 8, 2015, at 8:39 PM, Doug McIlroy <doug at cs.dartmouth.edu> wrote: >>> >>>>>> I thought PWB (makers of "make") came from Harvard? >>>> >>>>> PWB ... came straight out of Bell. Not sure about all the >>>>> applications (well, SCCS came from Bell). >>>> >>>> PWB did not create make; Stu Feldman did it in research. >>>> PWB did make SCCS. I believe it also originated cico, >>>> find and eval. Probably more, too, but I can't reliably >>>> separate PWB's other contributions from USG's. >>>> >>>> Doug >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> TUHS mailing list >>>> TUHS at minnie.tuhs.org >>>> https://minnie.tuhs.org/mailman/listinfo/tuhs >>> _______________________________________________ >>> TUHS mailing list >>> TUHS at minnie.tuhs.org >>> https://minnie.tuhs.org/mailman/listinfo/tuhs > > _______________________________________________ > TUHS mailing list > TUHS at minnie.tuhs.org > https://minnie.tuhs.org/mailman/listinfo/tuhs ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 33+ messages in thread
* [TUHS] PWB contributions 2015-11-09 3:36 ` Clem cole @ 2015-11-09 3:51 ` Clem cole 2015-11-09 15:40 ` Dave Horsfall 2015-11-09 22:12 ` Mary Ann Horton 2 siblings, 0 replies; 33+ messages in thread From: Clem cole @ 2015-11-09 3:51 UTC (permalink / raw) [-- Warning: decoded text below may be mangled, UTF-8 assumed --] [-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 4524 bytes --] I should add - I certainly remember the ITS behavior from my old accounts there. I also know Eric came to UCB after MIT. Dan may have also but I can not verify that and I have no reason to not believe his story other than what Eric had said to me over the years and my own memories of the time. Basically the two programs I remember were Eric's more(1) and later Summit's pager which was a poor cousin to Eric's program and having to put Eric's program on AT&T based flavors so my own Finger ROMs could type comfortably. Clem Sent from my iPhone > On Nov 8, 2015, at 10:36 PM, Clem cole <clemc at ccc.com> wrote: > > Interesting. If I run Into Eric any time soon I'll have to ask him. As I recall I don't remember Dan's version but I do remember Eric's. Nor do I remember Geoff hacking on it. Plus if you look at the CSRG db from Kirk, the DB shows Eric as the creator. What's more Dan's name is not in the man page - Eric's is. > > > > I wonder if this is a case where Dan wrote something specific for the ADM's and the 11s and Eric did something similar more general around the sametime. FWIW: Eric had always claimed to me that he wrote it and it is my memory that I got the sources from him for our systems in the CAD group in Cory hall (and have never had a reason to doubt him in that claim). > > I do remember more(1) was was one of the first programs that used Hortons termcap library that he had pulled out of joy's vi and greatly enhanced. Mike Arnold then took it and created curses (for Rogue actually). > > Btw Because of using termcap it forced a lot of us to put the termcap strings in the environment to speed up program start. > > Dans memory of the undergrad PDP 11 had being over loaded does line up with my memory. A couple of us were teaching CS-40 (the intro undergrad course) around that time and undergrads used the Cory 70s. I avoided them as much as possible. > > > > Sent from my iPhone > >> On Nov 8, 2015, at 9:58 PM, Win Treese <treese at acm.org> wrote: >> >> >> Of course, as soon as I sent that, I found Dan Halbert’s version of things >> at http://www.danhalbert.org/more.html >> >> For what that’s worth. >> >> - Win >> >>> On Nov 8, 2015, at 9:54 PM, Win Treese <treese at acm.org> wrote: >>> >>> >>> Clem, >>> >>> In trying to check on some memories of mine, I came across your answer on >>> Quora about "What is the difference between less and cat command?”, in which >>> you mention that Wikipedia had it wrong about Dan Halbert writing more(1). >>> >>> What Dan did tell me many years ago is that he wrote a program called “less” >>> when he was at Berkeley as a near-parody on more(1). Its notable feature was >>> that it went backwards through the file, displaying in the opposite direction. >>> >>> This, of course, had nothing to do with what we now know as less(1), and that code >>> is probably lost to history. >>> >>> - Win >>> >>>> On Nov 8, 2015, at 9:12 PM, Clement T. Cole <clemc at ccc.com> wrote: >>>> >>>> Doug >>>> >>>> Eric Shienbrood originally wrote more(1) at UCB when he came as a grad student. It was based on functionality from ITS that he as used to having at MIT. Summit wrote a similar program with the same called page(1) and I'm fairly sure it was few years after Eric's program. Btw page(1) which did not have the same functionality (no termcap or in there case terminfo yet). Less(1) would show up a few years later and replace them both. >>>> >>>> Clem >>>> >>>> Sent from my iPad >>>> >>>> On Nov 8, 2015, at 8:39 PM, Doug McIlroy <doug at cs.dartmouth.edu> wrote: >>>> >>>>>>> I thought PWB (makers of "make") came from Harvard? >>>>> >>>>>> PWB ... came straight out of Bell. Not sure about all the >>>>>> applications (well, SCCS came from Bell). >>>>> >>>>> PWB did not create make; Stu Feldman did it in research. >>>>> PWB did make SCCS. I believe it also originated cico, >>>>> find and eval. Probably more, too, but I can't reliably >>>>> separate PWB's other contributions from USG's. >>>>> >>>>> Doug >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> TUHS mailing list >>>>> TUHS at minnie.tuhs.org >>>>> https://minnie.tuhs.org/mailman/listinfo/tuhs >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> TUHS mailing list >>>> TUHS at minnie.tuhs.org >>>> https://minnie.tuhs.org/mailman/listinfo/tuhs >> >> _______________________________________________ >> TUHS mailing list >> TUHS at minnie.tuhs.org >> https://minnie.tuhs.org/mailman/listinfo/tuhs ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 33+ messages in thread
* [TUHS] PWB contributions 2015-11-09 3:36 ` Clem cole 2015-11-09 3:51 ` Clem cole @ 2015-11-09 15:40 ` Dave Horsfall 2015-11-09 15:54 ` Clem Cole 2015-11-09 22:12 ` Mary Ann Horton 2 siblings, 1 reply; 33+ messages in thread From: Dave Horsfall @ 2015-11-09 15:40 UTC (permalink / raw) On Sun, 8 Nov 2015, Clem cole wrote: > I do remember more(1) was was one of the first programs that used > Hortons termcap library that he had pulled out of joy's vi and greatly > enhanced. Mike Arnold then took it and created curses (for Rogue > actually). Wouldn't that be Ken Arnold? Clearly I remember the message "You are as smart as Ken Arnold in dungeon %d" when quaffing a certain potion. Ah, many days I spent playing Rogue, when I should've been working, and coming to grips with all its versions. Who remembers Rog-o-matic? I vaguely remember that it actually walked off with the Amulet of Yendor. -- Dave Horsfall DTM (VK2KFU) "Those who don't understand security will suffer." ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 33+ messages in thread
* [TUHS] PWB contributions 2015-11-09 15:40 ` Dave Horsfall @ 2015-11-09 15:54 ` Clem Cole 0 siblings, 0 replies; 33+ messages in thread From: Clem Cole @ 2015-11-09 15:54 UTC (permalink / raw) Sorry - typo/brain f*rt -- Ken Arnold On Mon, Nov 9, 2015 at 10:40 AM, Dave Horsfall <dave at horsfall.org> wrote: > On Sun, 8 Nov 2015, Clem cole wrote: > > > I do remember more(1) was was one of the first programs that used > > Hortons termcap library that he had pulled out of joy's vi and greatly > > enhanced. Mike Arnold then took it and created curses (for Rogue > > actually). > > Wouldn't that be Ken Arnold? Clearly I remember the message "You are as > smart as Ken Arnold in dungeon %d" when quaffing a certain potion. > > Ah, many days I spent playing Rogue, when I should've been working, and > coming to grips with all its versions. > > Who remembers Rog-o-matic? I vaguely remember that it actually walked off > with the Amulet of Yendor. > > -- > Dave Horsfall DTM (VK2KFU) "Those who don't understand security will > suffer." > _______________________________________________ > TUHS mailing list > TUHS at minnie.tuhs.org > https://minnie.tuhs.org/mailman/listinfo/tuhs > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: <http://minnie.tuhs.org/pipermail/tuhs/attachments/20151109/aa98b117/attachment.html> ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 33+ messages in thread
* [TUHS] PWB contributions 2015-11-09 3:36 ` Clem cole 2015-11-09 3:51 ` Clem cole 2015-11-09 15:40 ` Dave Horsfall @ 2015-11-09 22:12 ` Mary Ann Horton 2 siblings, 0 replies; 33+ messages in thread From: Mary Ann Horton @ 2015-11-09 22:12 UTC (permalink / raw) My recollection matches Clem's - I was there and I thought Eric wrote "more". Dan was definitely there and he might have done the first version, but I don't recall that. I do recall the story about MIT, and I sure that ITS was the inspiration. And I recall Eric noting the space bar was the "next page" key (as opposed to Return which other programs expected) because it's the biggest key on the keyboard. I can't take credit for pulling libtermcap (originally libtermlib) out of vi, Bill Joy had already done that before I took on vi and termcap. Mary Ann Quoting Clem cole <clemc at ccc.com>: > Interesting. If I run Into Eric any time soon I'll have to ask him. > As I recall I don't remember Dan's version but I do remember Eric's. > Nor do I remember Geoff hacking on it. Plus if you look at the CSRG > db from Kirk, the DB shows Eric as the creator. What's more Dan's > name is not in the man page - Eric's is. > > > > I wonder if this is a case where Dan wrote something specific for > the ADM's and the 11s and Eric did something similar more general > around the sametime. FWIW: Eric had always claimed to me that he > wrote it and it is my memory that I got the sources from him for our > systems in the CAD group in Cory hall (and have never had a reason > to doubt him in that claim). > > I do remember more(1) was was one of the first programs that used > Hortons termcap library that he had pulled out of joy's vi and > greatly enhanced. (Ken) Arnold then took it and created curses (for > Rogue actually). ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 33+ messages in thread
* [TUHS] PWB contributions 2015-11-09 2:58 ` Win Treese 2015-11-09 3:36 ` Clem cole @ 2015-11-09 3:38 ` Random832 2015-11-09 4:50 ` Clem cole 1 sibling, 1 reply; 33+ messages in thread From: Random832 @ 2015-11-09 3:38 UTC (permalink / raw) [-- Warning: decoded text below may be mangled, UTF-8 assumed --] [-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 678 bytes --] Win Treese <treese at acm.org> writes: > Of course, as soon as I sent that, I found Dan Halbert’s version of things > at http://www.danhalbert.org/more.html From that page: > I named the program more. This was a daring move at the time, since it > was such a long name for a UNIX command, and was also a real English > word. That makes me wonder... where does pg(1) fit into this history? There's a version of it in the 32V tree in the TUHS archive, but nowhere else, yet it surfaces in modern Unixes such as Solaris and there's a clone in the "util-linux" package. It also shows up in SuSv2 (marked LEGACY, and absent from later versions). Was it part of System III/V? ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 33+ messages in thread
* [TUHS] PWB contributions 2015-11-09 3:38 ` Random832 @ 2015-11-09 4:50 ` Clem cole 0 siblings, 0 replies; 33+ messages in thread From: Clem cole @ 2015-11-09 4:50 UTC (permalink / raw) [-- Warning: decoded text below may be mangled, UTF-8 assumed --] [-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 1229 bytes --] The Summit folks created pg(1). It was definitely in System V. But I think Doug's memory of it being there much earlier coincides with my memory. As I mentioned more(1) was part of the source kit I carried with me to non-BSD systems that I needed so I could type comfortably. Sent from my iPhone > On Nov 8, 2015, at 10:38 PM, Random832 <random832 at fastmail.com> wrote: > > Win Treese <treese at acm.org> writes: > >> Of course, as soon as I sent that, I found Dan Halbert’s version of things >> at http://www.danhalbert.org/more.html > > From that page: >> I named the program more. This was a daring move at the time, since it >> was such a long name for a UNIX command, and was also a real English >> word. > > That makes me wonder... where does pg(1) fit into this history? There's > a version of it in the 32V tree in the TUHS archive, but nowhere else, > yet it surfaces in modern Unixes such as Solaris and there's a clone in > the "util-linux" package. It also shows up in SuSv2 (marked LEGACY, and > absent from later versions). Was it part of System III/V? > > _______________________________________________ > TUHS mailing list > TUHS at minnie.tuhs.org > https://minnie.tuhs.org/mailman/listinfo/tuhs ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 33+ messages in thread
* [TUHS] PWB contributions 2015-11-09 2:12 ` Clement T. Cole 2015-11-09 2:54 ` Win Treese @ 2015-11-09 13:58 ` Doug McIlroy 2015-11-09 14:02 ` Ronald Natalie ` (2 more replies) 2015-11-09 22:23 ` [TUHS] PWB contributions Jeremy C. Reed 2 siblings, 3 replies; 33+ messages in thread From: Doug McIlroy @ 2015-11-09 13:58 UTC (permalink / raw) > Eric Shienbrood originally wrote more(1) at UCB Amusing result of ambiguity. I had written > PWB did make SCCS. I believe it also originated cico, > find and eval. Probably more, too, but I can't reliably > separate PWB's other contributions from USG's. The intended meaning was, "Probably more things, too", things like "cut" and "paste", whose exact provenance I can't recall. And I got 2 out of 3 wrong in the list "cico, find and eval", which should have been "cpio, find and expr". > Less(1) would show up a few years later and replace [page and more]. And to set a world benchmark for software bloat. For a good time try less --help | wc Doug ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 33+ messages in thread
* [TUHS] PWB contributions 2015-11-09 13:58 ` Doug McIlroy @ 2015-11-09 14:02 ` Ronald Natalie 2015-11-09 14:44 ` John Cowan 2015-11-10 20:26 ` [TUHS] A portrait of cut(1) (was: PWB contributions) markus schnalke 2 siblings, 0 replies; 33+ messages in thread From: Ronald Natalie @ 2015-11-09 14:02 UTC (permalink / raw) [-- Warning: decoded text below may be mangled, UTF-8 assumed --] [-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 551 bytes --] > On Nov 9, 2015, at 8:58 AM, Doug McIlroy <doug at cs.dartmouth.edu> wrote: > >> Eric Shienbrood originally wrote more(1) at UCB > > Amusing result of ambiguity. I had written What was provided by PWB? Who was provided by research? Where was provided by UCB? I don’t know…THIRD BASE! -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: smime.p7s Type: application/pkcs7-signature Size: 2284 bytes Desc: not available URL: <http://minnie.tuhs.org/pipermail/tuhs/attachments/20151109/21b96e6a/attachment.bin> ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 33+ messages in thread
* [TUHS] PWB contributions 2015-11-09 13:58 ` Doug McIlroy 2015-11-09 14:02 ` Ronald Natalie @ 2015-11-09 14:44 ` John Cowan 2015-11-10 20:26 ` [TUHS] A portrait of cut(1) (was: PWB contributions) markus schnalke 2 siblings, 0 replies; 33+ messages in thread From: John Cowan @ 2015-11-09 14:44 UTC (permalink / raw) Doug McIlroy scripsit: > And to set a world benchmark for software bloat. For a good time try > less --help | wc I disagree entirely: it's a matter of how you see less. For me it is roughly comparable to ed (and indeed the primary documentation is about the same size). Both have the function of letting you inspect, in ways not predictable in advance, the contents of a file. Ed also allows you to modify the file, whereas less has a more convenient interface for dealing with pipeline output, and has single-keystroke convenience commands, notably space. (IWBNI ed had a switch to make it read stdin into the buffer and then read commands from /dev/tty. Obviously a wrapper script could achieve this easily.) Disclaimer: I actually use ex, not ed: I'm willing to trade off a litttle less standardosity for a little more convenience. That also of a minimal subset of vi commands when dealing with code that contains highly repetitive strings, notably Lisp parentheses. -- John Cowan http://www.ccil.org/~cowan cowan at ccil.org "Repeat this until 'update-mounts -v' shows no updates. You may well have to log in to particular machines, hunt down people who still have processes running, and kill them." ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 33+ messages in thread
* [TUHS] A portrait of cut(1) (was: PWB contributions) 2015-11-09 13:58 ` Doug McIlroy 2015-11-09 14:02 ` Ronald Natalie 2015-11-09 14:44 ` John Cowan @ 2015-11-10 20:26 ` markus schnalke 2015-11-10 22:10 ` Clem Cole ` (2 more replies) 2 siblings, 3 replies; 33+ messages in thread From: markus schnalke @ 2015-11-10 20:26 UTC (permalink / raw) [2015-11-09 08:58] Doug McIlroy <doug at cs.dartmouth.edu> > > things like "cut" and "paste", whose exact provenance > I can't recall. Thanks for reminding me that I wanted to share my portrait of cut(1) with you. (I sent some questions to this list, a few months ago, remember?) Now, here it is: http://marmaro.de/docs/freiesmagazin/cut/cut.en.pdf Hope you like it. meillo ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 33+ messages in thread
* [TUHS] A portrait of cut(1) (was: PWB contributions) 2015-11-10 20:26 ` [TUHS] A portrait of cut(1) (was: PWB contributions) markus schnalke @ 2015-11-10 22:10 ` Clem Cole 2015-11-10 23:10 ` Andy Kosela 2015-11-11 0:16 ` [TUHS] A portrait of cut(1) Random832 2 siblings, 0 replies; 33+ messages in thread From: Clem Cole @ 2015-11-10 22:10 UTC (permalink / raw) [-- Warning: decoded text below may be mangled, UTF-8 assumed --] [-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 348 bytes --] On Tue, Nov 10, 2015 at 3:26 PM, markus schnalke <meillo at marmaro.de> wrote: > http://marmaro.de/docs/freiesmagazin/cut/cut.en.pdf Fascinating - thanks for sharing. Clem -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: <http://minnie.tuhs.org/pipermail/tuhs/attachments/20151110/7a172862/attachment.html> ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 33+ messages in thread
* [TUHS] A portrait of cut(1) (was: PWB contributions) 2015-11-10 20:26 ` [TUHS] A portrait of cut(1) (was: PWB contributions) markus schnalke 2015-11-10 22:10 ` Clem Cole @ 2015-11-10 23:10 ` Andy Kosela 2015-11-10 23:12 ` John Cowan 2015-11-11 0:16 ` [TUHS] A portrait of cut(1) Random832 2 siblings, 1 reply; 33+ messages in thread From: Andy Kosela @ 2015-11-10 23:10 UTC (permalink / raw) On Tue, Nov 10, 2015 at 9:26 PM, markus schnalke <meillo at marmaro.de> wrote: > [2015-11-09 08:58] Doug McIlroy <doug at cs.dartmouth.edu> >> >> things like "cut" and "paste", whose exact provenance >> I can't recall. > > Thanks for reminding me that I wanted to share my portrait of > cut(1) with you. (I sent some questions to this list, a few > months ago, remember?) Now, here it is: > > http://marmaro.de/docs/freiesmagazin/cut/cut.en.pdf > > Hope you like it. Great read. I always liked cut(1). --Andy ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 33+ messages in thread
* [TUHS] A portrait of cut(1) (was: PWB contributions) 2015-11-10 23:10 ` Andy Kosela @ 2015-11-10 23:12 ` John Cowan 2015-11-10 23:34 ` Larry McVoy 0 siblings, 1 reply; 33+ messages in thread From: John Cowan @ 2015-11-10 23:12 UTC (permalink / raw) Andy Kosela scripsit: > Great read. I always liked cut(1). The fact that it refuses to reorder fields is kinda annoying, though. -- John Cowan http://www.ccil.org/~cowan cowan at ccil.org You annoy me, Rattray! You disgust me! You irritate me unspeakably! Thank Heaven, I am a man of equable temper, or I should scarcely be able to contain myself before your mocking visage. --Stalky imitating Macrea ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 33+ messages in thread
* [TUHS] A portrait of cut(1) (was: PWB contributions) 2015-11-10 23:12 ` John Cowan @ 2015-11-10 23:34 ` Larry McVoy 2015-11-10 23:39 ` John Cowan 0 siblings, 1 reply; 33+ messages in thread From: Larry McVoy @ 2015-11-10 23:34 UTC (permalink / raw) On Tue, Nov 10, 2015 at 06:12:21PM -0500, John Cowan wrote: > Andy Kosela scripsit: > > > Great read. I always liked cut(1). > > The fact that it refuses to reorder fields is kinda annoying, though. cut .... | awk '{print $2,$1}' ? ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 33+ messages in thread
* [TUHS] A portrait of cut(1) (was: PWB contributions) 2015-11-10 23:34 ` Larry McVoy @ 2015-11-10 23:39 ` John Cowan 0 siblings, 0 replies; 33+ messages in thread From: John Cowan @ 2015-11-10 23:39 UTC (permalink / raw) Larry McVoy scripsit: > cut .... | awk '{print $2,$1}' I didn't say there was no workaround. But obviously "cut -f 3,2,1" expresses a particular intention which (by design) cut will not satisfy. -- John Cowan http://www.ccil.org/~cowan cowan at ccil.org Pour moi, les villes du Silmarillion ont plus de realite que Babylone. --Christopher Tolkien, as interviewed by Le Monde ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 33+ messages in thread
* [TUHS] A portrait of cut(1) 2015-11-10 20:26 ` [TUHS] A portrait of cut(1) (was: PWB contributions) markus schnalke 2015-11-10 22:10 ` Clem Cole 2015-11-10 23:10 ` Andy Kosela @ 2015-11-11 0:16 ` Random832 2015-11-11 12:23 ` markus schnalke 2 siblings, 1 reply; 33+ messages in thread From: Random832 @ 2015-11-11 0:16 UTC (permalink / raw) markus schnalke <meillo at marmaro.de> writes: > [2015-11-09 08:58] Doug McIlroy <doug at cs.dartmouth.edu> >> things like "cut" and "paste", whose exact provenance >> I can't recall. > > Thanks for reminding me that I wanted to share my portrait of > cut(1) with you. (I sent some questions to this list, a few > months ago, remember?) Now, here it is: > > http://marmaro.de/docs/freiesmagazin/cut/cut.en.pdf Did you happen to find out what GWRL stands for, in the the comments at the top of early versions of cut.c and paste.c? /* cut : cut and paste columns of a table (projection of a relation) (GWRL) */ /* Release 1.5; handles single backspaces as produced by nroff */ /* paste: concatenate corresponding lines of each file in parallel. Release 1.4 (GWRL) */ /* (-s option: serial concatenation like old (127's) paste command */ For that matter, what's the "old (127's) paste command" it refers to? ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 33+ messages in thread
* [TUHS] A portrait of cut(1) 2015-11-11 0:16 ` [TUHS] A portrait of cut(1) Random832 @ 2015-11-11 12:23 ` markus schnalke 0 siblings, 0 replies; 33+ messages in thread From: markus schnalke @ 2015-11-11 12:23 UTC (permalink / raw) [2015-11-10 19:16] Random832 <random832 at fastmail.com> > > Did you happen to find out what GWRL stands for, in the the comments at > the top of early versions of cut.c and paste.c? > > /* cut : cut and paste columns of a table (projection of a relation) (GWRL) * > / > /* Release 1.5; handles single backspaces as produced by nroff */ > /* paste: concatenate corresponding lines of each file in parallel. Release 1.4 (GWRL) */ > /* (-s option: serial concatenation like old (127's) paste command */ > > For that matter, what's the "old (127's) paste command" it refers to? Unfortunately I have no clue, for neither of them. To resolve ``GWRL'', insider knowledge seems to be needed. (Or a cool party with creative buddies, of course! (Today's the opening of the carnival season in Germany ... that could be an opportunity. :-D )) ``127'', whatever system that might be, it surely predates UNIX. Background knowledge from the time back then will be necessary. I can provide neither of them ... and searching for such stuff is difficult because the terms and their context are too generic. (``cut and paste'' is by no means a valuable context if you try to search for it. ;-) ) Maybe someone older or more inside has some ideas ... meillo ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 33+ messages in thread
* [TUHS] PWB contributions 2015-11-09 2:12 ` Clement T. Cole 2015-11-09 2:54 ` Win Treese 2015-11-09 13:58 ` Doug McIlroy @ 2015-11-09 22:23 ` Jeremy C. Reed 2015-11-10 4:11 ` Random832 2 siblings, 1 reply; 33+ messages in thread From: Jeremy C. Reed @ 2015-11-09 22:23 UTC (permalink / raw) On Sun, 8 Nov 2015, Clement T. Cole wrote: > Doug > > Eric Shienbrood originally wrote more(1) at UCB when he came as a grad > student. It was based on functionality from ITS that he as used to > having at MIT. Summit wrote a similar program with the same called > page(1) and I'm fairly sure it was few years after Eric's program. Btw > page(1) which did not have the same functionality (no termcap or in > there case terminfo yet). Less(1) would show up a few years later and > replace them both. From my book in progress ... -=-=-=-=-=-= Many students were writing various pieces of software not in the context of some larger purpose, but for their benefit. They were then included when Joy % and company collected up the existing software and distributed it.\cite{halbert1} In the Berkeley terminal rooms, the dumb terminals beeped incessantly so most of the bell speakers had been disconnected. Their \emph{cr3} pager tool rang the terminal bell and waited for a carriage return after every 24 lines. The terminals also rang the bell when the cursor advanced near the right margin on output or keyboard input (like a typewriter bell).\cite{halbert-jchac1-4} % TODO: mention cr3 stty mode? % archives/1970s/2bsd/src/cr3.c says 22 lines and no mention of sound So Dan Halbert\index{Halbert, Dan}. who arrived in 1978 as a first-year graduate student, wrote a pager called \emph{more} that printed ``--More--'' instead of ringing the bell and accepted the space instead of carriage return to continue. Plus it could take multiple filenames and print a line of colons around the filenames. This was inspired by his use of the ITS timesharing systems as an undergraduate at MIT that put a ``--MORE--'' prompt at the bottom of the screen when displaying files.\cite{halbert-jchac1-4} His friends and fellow graduate students, Geoff Peck\index{Peck, Geoff} and Eric Shienbrood\index{Shienbrood, Eric}, greatly expanded it, adding various options -- and \emph{more} was added into the next distribution.\cite{halbert1} -=-=-=-=-=-= Date: 17 Jun 2010 @MISC{halbert1, author = {Dan Halbert}, howpublished = "Personal correspondence", year = 2010, month = jun } @ARTICLE{halbert-jchac1-4, author = "Dan Halbert", title = "{THE "MORE" COMMAND IN UNIX}", journal = "Journal of the Computer History Association of California", year = 1994, month = "April-June", volume = "1", number = "4" } Prior to that Chuck Haley had a pager called cr3. Then Bill Joy simulated that with a filter "stopping output after each page (22 lines) to wait for a carriage return, sending 22 more lines, or a EOF, sending 10 more lines." (That quote is from the source.) By the way, I don't have experience with the CR3 control register, and don't really understand what it means from the hardware perspective. ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 33+ messages in thread
* [TUHS] PWB contributions 2015-11-09 22:23 ` [TUHS] PWB contributions Jeremy C. Reed @ 2015-11-10 4:11 ` Random832 0 siblings, 0 replies; 33+ messages in thread From: Random832 @ 2015-11-10 4:11 UTC (permalink / raw) "Jeremy C. Reed" <reed at reedmedia.net> writes: > By the way, I don't have experience with the CR3 control register, and > don't really understand what it means from the hardware perspective. If I understand correctly, it's not hardware, it's part of the kernel tty driver. There's a two bit field in the stty flags, for selecting a delay mode. The purpose of the delay was to allow the terminal time to process it (i.e. to physically move the carriage, for a printing terminal) - the kernel would wait before sending more characters. As can be seen in tty.c (link below), CR1 caused a delay of 5 units, and CR2 a delay of 10 units. CR3 had no meaning in the standard kernel, and so some custom version of the kernel could have interpreted it to have some other meaning. http://minnie.tuhs.org/cgi-bin/utree.pl?file=V7/usr/sys/dev/tty.c It's not clear where this was actually done. The 3BSD kernel used CR3 to indicate that (if I read it correctly) a number of padding characters depending on the column position should be inserted. P.S. Somewhat confusingly, searching for "CR3" finds a page about "control registers" of the _intel 386_, of which CR3 has something to do with "paging" in the virtual memory sense of the word. This has nothing to do with the topic under discussion. ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 33+ messages in thread
* [TUHS] PWB contributions 2015-11-09 1:39 [TUHS] PWB contributions Doug McIlroy 2015-11-09 1:48 ` John Cowan 2015-11-09 2:12 ` Clement T. Cole @ 2015-11-09 4:44 ` Larry McVoy 2015-11-09 4:51 ` John Cowan 2 siblings, 1 reply; 33+ messages in thread From: Larry McVoy @ 2015-11-09 4:44 UTC (permalink / raw) On Sun, Nov 08, 2015 at 08:39:12PM -0500, Doug McIlroy wrote: > >> I thought PWB (makers of "make") came from Harvard? > > > PWB ... came straight out of Bell. Not sure about all the > > applications (well, SCCS came from Bell). > > PWB did not create make; Stu Feldman did it in research. > PWB did make SCCS. Marc Rochkind did SCCS, right? Wikipedia said he did it at Bell Labs. Does anyone on the list remember him? I'd love to hear some stories about how SCCS was created. Warning: source management rant coming. SCCS got a bad rap from Walter Tichy when he created RCS, I can't remember his dislike but it's completely wrong. RCS is diff based, you have a file and a series of patches. For the tip of the trunk, that's the file, going backwards in history they are reverse patches. OK, not so crazy. But now think about a branch. You do reverse patches back to the branch point and forward patches down to the tip of the branch. Anyone living on a branch hated RCS. SCCS has interleaved deltas. It's a brilliant design that has far far better performance than anything else out there. I'll explain that if anyone cares but I'd love to know if anyone talked to Marc while he was building SCCS. Love to learn how he came up with that. The reason I know so much about SCCS is that BitKeeper is sort of SCCS on steroids, we took the file format, fixed a bunch of stuff, and made the first distributed version control system with it. Git, Mercurial, all the others, are copies of what we did. I wish Marc was on this list, be fun to chat. --lm ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 33+ messages in thread
* [TUHS] PWB contributions 2015-11-09 4:44 ` Larry McVoy @ 2015-11-09 4:51 ` John Cowan 2015-11-09 5:07 ` Larry McVoy 0 siblings, 1 reply; 33+ messages in thread From: John Cowan @ 2015-11-09 4:51 UTC (permalink / raw) Larry McVoy scripsit: > I wish Marc was on this list, be fun to chat. rochkind at basepath.com. I don't know him, but those who do, or who have more chutzpah than I, may want to tell him about us. -- John Cowan http://www.ccil.org/~cowan cowan at ccil.org Dream projects long deferred usually bite the wax tadpole. --James Lileks ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 33+ messages in thread
* [TUHS] PWB contributions 2015-11-09 4:51 ` John Cowan @ 2015-11-09 5:07 ` Larry McVoy 2015-11-09 5:09 ` Larry McVoy 0 siblings, 1 reply; 33+ messages in thread From: Larry McVoy @ 2015-11-09 5:07 UTC (permalink / raw) Doing it now. On Sun, Nov 08, 2015 at 11:51:08PM -0500, John Cowan wrote: > Larry McVoy scripsit: > > > I wish Marc was on this list, be fun to chat. > > rochkind at basepath.com. I don't know him, but those who do, or who > have more chutzpah than I, may want to tell him about us. > > -- > John Cowan http://www.ccil.org/~cowan cowan at ccil.org > Dream projects long deferred usually bite the wax tadpole. > --James Lileks -- --- Larry McVoy lm at mcvoy.com http://www.mcvoy.com/lm ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 33+ messages in thread
* [TUHS] PWB contributions 2015-11-09 5:07 ` Larry McVoy @ 2015-11-09 5:09 ` Larry McVoy 2015-11-09 5:16 ` John Cowan 2015-11-09 5:16 ` Leonardo Taccari 0 siblings, 2 replies; 33+ messages in thread From: Larry McVoy @ 2015-11-09 5:09 UTC (permalink / raw) Um, can someone tell me how to tell Marc how he signs up if he is interested? On Sun, Nov 08, 2015 at 09:07:50PM -0800, Larry McVoy wrote: > Doing it now. > > On Sun, Nov 08, 2015 at 11:51:08PM -0500, John Cowan wrote: > > Larry McVoy scripsit: > > > > > I wish Marc was on this list, be fun to chat. > > > > rochkind at basepath.com. I don't know him, but those who do, or who > > have more chutzpah than I, may want to tell him about us. > > > > -- > > John Cowan http://www.ccil.org/~cowan cowan at ccil.org > > Dream projects long deferred usually bite the wax tadpole. > > --James Lileks > > -- > --- > Larry McVoy lm at mcvoy.com http://www.mcvoy.com/lm -- --- Larry McVoy lm at mcvoy.com http://www.mcvoy.com/lm ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 33+ messages in thread
* [TUHS] PWB contributions 2015-11-09 5:09 ` Larry McVoy @ 2015-11-09 5:16 ` John Cowan 2015-11-09 5:16 ` Leonardo Taccari 1 sibling, 0 replies; 33+ messages in thread From: John Cowan @ 2015-11-09 5:16 UTC (permalink / raw) Larry McVoy scripsit: > Um, can someone tell me how to tell Marc how he signs up if he is interested? Per the Mailman page: he find Warren Toomey's email at tuhs.org and asks him. If he can't figure out how to get that email, he's lost to the Dark Side of the Force. -- John Cowan http://www.ccil.org/~cowan cowan at ccil.org If a traveler were informed that such a man [as Lord John Russell] was leader of the House of Commons, he may well begin to comprehend how the Egyptians worshiped an insect. --Benjamin Disraeli ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 33+ messages in thread
* [TUHS] PWB contributions 2015-11-09 5:09 ` Larry McVoy 2015-11-09 5:16 ` John Cowan @ 2015-11-09 5:16 ` Leonardo Taccari 1 sibling, 0 replies; 33+ messages in thread From: Leonardo Taccari @ 2015-11-09 5:16 UTC (permalink / raw) Hello Larry, Larry McVoy writes: > Um, can someone tell me how to tell Marc how he signs up if he is interested? Just send an email to Warren Toomey (wkt at tuhs dot org). Ciao, L. ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 33+ messages in thread
* [TUHS] PWB contributions
@ 2015-11-09 2:14 Doug McIlroy
2015-11-09 2:32 ` John Cowan
0 siblings, 1 reply; 33+ messages in thread
From: Doug McIlroy @ 2015-11-09 2:14 UTC (permalink / raw)
> cpio, expr, xargs, yacc, and lex first appeared outside
> the Bell Labs boundary in the PWB release
This gently corrects a statement in my posting: the name
of one of the PWB-originated programs is expr, not eval.
Doug
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 33+ messages in thread* [TUHS] PWB contributions 2015-11-09 2:14 Doug McIlroy @ 2015-11-09 2:32 ` John Cowan 0 siblings, 0 replies; 33+ messages in thread From: John Cowan @ 2015-11-09 2:32 UTC (permalink / raw) Doug McIlroy scripsit: > This gently corrects a statement in my posting: the name > of one of the PWB-originated programs is expr, not eval. Not intentionally! I figured that eval was some part of the RJE system (core to PWB, of course) that I had never heard of. -- John Cowan http://www.ccil.org/~cowan cowan at ccil.org It's the old, old story. Droid meets droid. Droid becomes chameleon. Droid loses chameleon, chameleon becomes blob, droid gets blob back again. It's a classic tale. --Kryten, Red Dwarf ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 33+ messages in thread
end of thread, other threads:[~2015-11-11 12:23 UTC | newest] Thread overview: 33+ messages (download: mbox.gz / follow: Atom feed) -- links below jump to the message on this page -- 2015-11-09 1:39 [TUHS] PWB contributions Doug McIlroy 2015-11-09 1:48 ` John Cowan 2015-11-09 2:12 ` Clement T. Cole 2015-11-09 2:54 ` Win Treese 2015-11-09 2:58 ` Win Treese 2015-11-09 3:36 ` Clem cole 2015-11-09 3:51 ` Clem cole 2015-11-09 15:40 ` Dave Horsfall 2015-11-09 15:54 ` Clem Cole 2015-11-09 22:12 ` Mary Ann Horton 2015-11-09 3:38 ` Random832 2015-11-09 4:50 ` Clem cole 2015-11-09 13:58 ` Doug McIlroy 2015-11-09 14:02 ` Ronald Natalie 2015-11-09 14:44 ` John Cowan 2015-11-10 20:26 ` [TUHS] A portrait of cut(1) (was: PWB contributions) markus schnalke 2015-11-10 22:10 ` Clem Cole 2015-11-10 23:10 ` Andy Kosela 2015-11-10 23:12 ` John Cowan 2015-11-10 23:34 ` Larry McVoy 2015-11-10 23:39 ` John Cowan 2015-11-11 0:16 ` [TUHS] A portrait of cut(1) Random832 2015-11-11 12:23 ` markus schnalke 2015-11-09 22:23 ` [TUHS] PWB contributions Jeremy C. Reed 2015-11-10 4:11 ` Random832 2015-11-09 4:44 ` Larry McVoy 2015-11-09 4:51 ` John Cowan 2015-11-09 5:07 ` Larry McVoy 2015-11-09 5:09 ` Larry McVoy 2015-11-09 5:16 ` John Cowan 2015-11-09 5:16 ` Leonardo Taccari 2015-11-09 2:14 Doug McIlroy 2015-11-09 2:32 ` John Cowan
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