Re: A new game

Re: A new game

[Will Yardley]

mattn wrote:
> This is a new game
> This game is my first work.
> You're the first player.
> I hope you would like it.

is there still widespread opposition to closing this list to non-members
(or at least using tdma for confirmation, or holding posts from
non-members)?

i think i get almost as many messages that are UBE or viruses from this
list as i do actual messages.

-- 
Will Yardley
input: william < @ hq . newdream . net . >

Re: A new game

[Bart Schaefer]

On Jun 29, 12:04pm, Will Yardley wrote:
}
} is there still widespread opposition to closing this list to non-members

I don't think that's the solution, at least for viruses.  The virus
that started this particular thread mails itself to address book entries
while using other address book entries to forge the From: header.  That
makes it reasonably likely that either the sender is a subscriber, or
would appear to be one unless the SMTP envelope were examined by the list
software.

The list is run with ezmlm, which implies qmail; it ought to be possible
to plug in some kind of a virus filter with qmail-scanner.

-- 
Bart Schaefer                                 Brass Lantern Enterprises
http://www.well.com/user/barts              http://www.brasslantern.com

Zsh: http://www.zsh.org | PHPerl Project: http://phperl.sourceforge.net   

Closed list? (was Re: A new game)

[Will Yardley]

Bart Schaefer wrote:
> On Jun 29, 12:04pm, Will Yardley wrote:

> > is there still widespread opposition to closing this list to non-members

> I don't think that's the solution, at least for viruses.  The virus
> that started this particular thread mails itself to address book
> entries while using other address book entries to forge the From:
> header.  That makes it reasonably likely that either the sender is a
> subscriber, or would appear to be one unless the SMTP envelope were
> examined by the list software.
> 
> The list is run with ezmlm, which implies qmail; it ought to be
> possible to plug in some kind of a virus filter with qmail-scanner.

yes, but if the From address is forged, isn't there a good chance that
the person whose address is in the From: header isn't a subscriber?

anyway piping the list through demime might help a bit, although a lot
of viruses would still get through that.  i am not worried about being
infected, but it is a waste of time and bandwidth for all parties
involved.

also, closing the list (or better, requiring confirmation for posts from
non-list members) would still cut out most / all of the spam that gets
sent to this list.

i haven't personally used TMDA, and it looks like it's a bit of a pain
to setup, but it would be good for this sort of thing (and i'd imagine
it can be configured to work with qmail / EZMLM).

just my $0.02

-- 
Will Yardley
input: william < @ hq . newdream . net . >

Re: Closed list? (was Re: A new game)

[Cameron McBride]

I would be up for something that at least strips out the large mime
stuff.  I can still filter spam client side, but getting the several
daily large attachments is getting annoying. (yes, I still use dial-up)

If you wanted to do some limiting -- I think that non-members having to
be 'approved' is the most severe that should be implemented.  

Cameron

Re: Closed list? (was Re: A new game)

[Borsenkow Andrej]

В Вск, 30.06.2002, в 00:13, Cameron McBride написал:
> I would be up for something that at least strips out the large mime
> stuff.


No. I do not understand why MIME is still considered the root of all
evils. This is the most natural way of posting patches and patches can
be large.

>  I can still filter spam client side, but getting the several
> daily large attachments is getting annoying. (yes, I still use dial-up)
>

In which case MIME is exactly what helps to avoid them. Get provider
that supports IMAP and kill these messages without even downloading
them. If you get reasonable mail client you can read test without
downloading the whole attachments.
 
> If you wanted to do some limiting -- I think that non-members having to
> be 'approved' is the most severe that should be implemented.  
> 

Who is going to be moderator? 

-andrej

Re: Closed list? (was Re: A new game)

[Vincent Lefevre]

On Sun, Jun 30, 2002 at 12:12:40 +0400, Borsenkow Andrej wrote:
> ? ???, 30.06.2002, ? 00:13, Cameron McBride ???????:
> > I would be up for something that at least strips out the large mime
> > stuff.
> 
> No. I do not understand why MIME is still considered the root of all
> evils. This is the most natural way of posting patches and patches can
> be large.

I agree, but the virus seems to use multipart/alternative content-type
and when patches are attached, it should be something else (for
instance, multipart/mixed). Perhaps only detect multipart/alternative?

-- 
Vincent Lefèvre <vincent@vinc17.org> - Web: <http://www.vinc17.org/> - 100%
validated (X)HTML - Acorn Risc PC, Yellow Pig 17, Championnat International
des Jeux Mathématiques et Logiques, TETRHEX, etc.
Work: CR INRIA - computer arithmetic / SPACES project at LORIA

Re: Closed list? (was Re: A new game)

[Cameron McBride]

> > I would be up for something that at least strips out the large mime
> > stuff.
> 
> No. I do not understand why MIME is still considered the root of all
> evils. This is the most natural way of posting patches and patches can
> be large.

OK, reasonable argument -- and you are right.  However, there does have
to be *some* method of elimination before they get sent.  Perhaps filter
on content type from the mime attachments (say 'application/octet-stream', 
etc), which would eliminate a few.

> that supports IMAP and kill these messages without even downloading
> them. If you get reasonable mail client you can read test without
> downloading the whole attachments.

Heh.  OK, so the argument here is to better enjoy the list, I change my
provider and get a decent mail client.  Nice response...  At least it
is a reasonable suggestion of things to try if I hadn't thought of them
and had it available.

> > If you wanted to do some limiting -- I think that non-members having to
> > be 'approved' is the most severe that should be implemented.  

I guess I wasn't clear -- I was trying to say that I think the list
should stay open, with the above choice as the most severe limitation to
be chosen.  For a support / informational ML, I do not see the point of
limiting posts only to subscribers.  Sorry for my lack of clarity in the
previous message.

If I am the only one annoyed, or represent a severe minority -- it
shouldn't matter, as I can live with it.  However, if there are other
members that are as annoyed...

Cameron

Re: Closed list? (was Re: A new game)

[Heinrich Götzger]

ok, now I feel that I have to say something about this as well.

In my daily eMail delivery are 10-20% of Spam and all these stuff from
nigeria and so on. It's not about the traffic, but about the time I need
to sort the good and the bad ones. I feel anoyed about getting all these
stuff, but, as Cameron said, I can live with it so far.

What about a filter in the listagent. I do not know about ezmlm but I know
majordomo for example and it allows to filter about content and subject
and all these stuff. I'm sure this is possible with ezmlm as well.

I have to deal with these subjects as an administrator of a mailinglist
for an open source project which we don't want to close for none
subscribers as well.
We won't aprove every mail but we want to keep it clear of dirt.
So we set up the filter and it worked out fine till now. But I have to
say, our list dosn't have as much traffic as this one.

so far,

regards

Heinrich
--
http://www.xmlBlaster.org

RE: Closed list? (was Re: A new game)

[Borsenkow Andrej]

> > that supports IMAP and kill these messages without even downloading
> > them. If you get reasonable mail client you can read test without
> > downloading the whole attachments.
> 
> Heh.  OK, so the argument here is to better enjoy the list, I change
my
> provider and get a decent mail client.  Nice response...  At least it
> is a reasonable suggestion of things to try if I hadn't thought of
them
> and had it available.
> 

I did not intend to offend anybody just pointed out that blocking mail
just because it is in MIME makes little sense.

I do not like spam here as well but the problem with any mail blocking
is you end up blocking legitimate mail. More than once my posts to other
lists were rejected because mail software found them offending for
whatever reason.

Besides this mail list is run by external authority and in the past we
had problems contacting maintainers.

-andrej