Re: [9fans] /sys/include/ip.h 5c(1)

[Aharon Robbins <arnold@skeeve.com>]

In article <13426df10910061021g3b033abbia134769baee934d3@mail.gmail.com> you write:
>as bad as the ARM may be, it can't hold a candle to what the pentium has become:
>1. RISC CPU (undocumented) in the northbridge (MCH) running ThreadX
>2. RISC CPU in the Ethernet part running ThreadX
>3. Simple CPU in the southbridge (ICH) running, well, who knows. But
>the entire system won't come up without that CPU coming up, and the
>code for that CPU is (of course!) never going to be available in any
>general sense.

Much of this is available as "Intel AMT", part of vPro(R) technology.
Start googling, you'll find information and maybe even a blog or two
from yours truly.

I won't say that manageability standards are wonderful; they're not.
But you can do some amazing things by talking to those CPUs in the chipset,
even when the main CPU is down.

>All of this stuff is without any useful docs -- intentionally. You
>can't write code for (1) and (2) because the code in the FLASH has to
>be signed with Intel's private key, public version of which is *burned
>into the chip in read-only registers*.

You bet.  Intel doesn't want to be on the wrong end of some lawyers
when somebody puts their own code into the chipset and wipes out
their company's crown jewels from the hard drive.  Welcome to America,
Land Of The Lawsuit.

>How much do you feel like trusting this platform?

Think of it as "smart hardware". Seriously.  If the I/O and networking
happen according to the documentation, then don't worry about how
Intel makes it happen.

>Daniel Liu of RIT studied (1) and (2) this summer, we're going to drop
>a paper into some publication this fall we hope.

I'd like to see this.

>PCs used to be open. They are now quite closed. I am holding out hope
>for the ARM as the next open thing. I realize the OMAP 35 manual is
>long, but at least there is a manual you can get!

You can always build a board with other peoples' chipsets.

I understand all your points, and many of them are good ones. But there
really are places where you don't want to go, and into the chipset
is one of them.  Just like you wouldn't have wanted to redo the microcode
in your Vax 11/750, even if you could have.

Arnold
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