bogus group

bogus group

[Richard Riley]

why do I have a group called "bogus" on my nnml server?

Any emails that go to root I have forwarded to me via aliases file. Sure
enough they end up in ~/Mail but in a "bogus" dir as well as in Maildir
format in ~/Mail. I cant really make head or tail of the docs as I've
been staring at them too long .. I'm blind  now ;)

Can someone share their system email settings please (eg cron emails).

Re: bogus group

[Steinar Bang]

Grepping the .el files of gnus for "bogus" it looks like it is created
when there is an error in nnmail-split-methods.

See lines 1173 through 1177 in nnmail.el.

Re: bogus group

[Richard Riley]

Steinar Bang <sb@dod.no> writes:

> Grepping the .el files of gnus for "bogus" it looks like it is created
> when there is an error in nnmail-split-methods.
>
> See lines 1173 through 1177 in nnmail.el.
>

Uh oh... I hoped never to have to look at the spam handling again ;=

My nnmail-split-methods is set to nnmail-split-fancy which in turn is
set to

nnmail-split-fancy is a variable defined in `nnmail.el'.
Its value is 
(|
 (: spam-split))

This is not correct anymore?

Re: bogus group

[Richard Riley]

Richard Riley <rileyrg@googlemail.com> writes:

> Steinar Bang <sb@dod.no> writes:
>
>> Grepping the .el files of gnus for "bogus" it looks like it is created
>> when there is an error in nnmail-split-methods.
>>
>> See lines 1173 through 1177 in nnmail.el.
>>
>
> Uh oh... I hoped never to have to look at the spam handling again ;=
>
> My nnmail-split-methods is set to nnmail-split-fancy which in turn is
> set to
>
> nnmail-split-fancy is a variable defined in `nnmail.el'.
> Its value is 
> (|
>  (: spam-split))
>
> This is not correct anymore?

*bump*

And I tried setting it to null. sys mail to me@localhost are still going
into a group called bogus on the nnml server.

Re: bogus group

[Adam Sjøgren]

On Fri, 10 Dec 2010 18:16:40 +0100, Richard wrote:

> And I tried setting it to null. sys mail to me@localhost are still going
> into a group called bogus on the nnml server.

As far as I recall email will be put in the bogus group if the splitting
doesn't match any group at all (so the email doesn't just disappear).

What group do you want non-spam to end up in? Does your split-rule put
them there?


  Best regards,

    Adam

-- 
 "Efter 89 blev det faste pladser. Kopper med navn på."       Adam Sjøgren
                                                         asjo@koldfront.dk

Re: bogus group

[Richard Riley]

asjo@koldfront.dk (Adam Sjøgren) writes:

> On Fri, 10 Dec 2010 18:16:40 +0100, Richard wrote:
>
>> And I tried setting it to null. sys mail to me@localhost are still going
>> into a group called bogus on the nnml server.
>
> As far as I recall email will be put in the bogus group if the splitting
> doesn't match any group at all (so the email doesn't just disappear).
>
> What group do you want non-spam to end up in? Does your split-rule put
> them there?
>
>   Best regards,
>
>     Adam

Thanks for taking the time to replay. Whats the simplest split rule
to put it into "inbox"? And I assume this only applies to nnmail? I'm
not sure I even understand what nnmail is to be honest... Im kind of
Gnus'd out and cant see the wood for the trees.

Re: bogus group

[Adam Sjøgren]

On Fri, 10 Dec 2010 22:37:57 +0100, Richard wrote:

> Whats the simplest split rule to put it into "inbox"?

My nnmail-split-fancy looks like this:

  (setq nnmail-split-fancy
        '(|
            ; Get rid of spam:
            (: spam-split)
            ; [... splitting out into various groups elided ...]
            "normal"))

Email that isn't spam (and not sorted out to folders by any of the
elided rules) ends up in my (nnml:)normal folder.

Note that I do not use imap, and I'm not really sure whether inbox has
some special significance there.

> And I assume this only applies to nnmail? I'm not sure I even
> understand what nnmail is to be honest... Im kind of Gnus'd out and
> cant see the wood for the trees.

I don't quite know what the nnmail prefix signifies, perhaps "this is
used for mail (not news), regardless of which nn* backend is used"? Wild
guess... caveat emptor - I'm sure someone will correct me now :-)


  Best regards,

    Adam

-- 
 "Scare yourself all away from the light                      Adam Sjøgren
  When you look down - you never left the ground"        asjo@koldfront.dk

Re: bogus group

[Richard Riley]

asjo@koldfront.dk (Adam Sjøgren) writes:

> On Fri, 10 Dec 2010 22:37:57 +0100, Richard wrote:
>
>> Whats the simplest split rule to put it into "inbox"?
>
> My nnmail-split-fancy looks like this:
>
>   (setq nnmail-split-fancy
>         '(|
>             ; Get rid of spam:
>             (: spam-split)
>             ; [... splitting out into various groups elided ...]
>             "normal"))
>
> Email that isn't spam (and not sorted out to folders by any of the
> elided rules) ends up in my (nnml:)normal folder.
>
> Note that I do not use imap, and I'm not really sure whether inbox has
> some special significance there.

imap has nothing to do with nnmail does it?

>
>> And I assume this only applies to nnmail? I'm not sure I even
>> understand what nnmail is to be honest... Im kind of Gnus'd out and
>> cant see the wood for the trees.
>
> I don't quite know what the nnmail prefix signifies, perhaps "this is
> used for mail (not news), regardless of which nn* backend is used"? Wild
> guess... caveat emptor - I'm sure someone will correct me now :-)

Heh. I have nnimap backs ends talking to dovecot which is fed by
offlineimap. No worries. But simply reading my system email is becoming
quite a chore.

Re: bogus group

[Adam Sjøgren]

On Fri, 10 Dec 2010 23:36:09 +0100, Richard wrote:

> imap has nothing to do with nnmail does it?

I haven't been following the imap development closely (I prefer to ssh
to my computer and connect to emacs rather than having multiple mail
clients; to each their own) - I think there used to be a seperate
variable for imap-splitting, but I'm not sure.

Anyway, I think your split rules should end with the folder you want
email to default to end up in.


  Best regards,

    Adam

-- 
 "That's a mystery, but I don't intend to inquire into        Adam Sjøgren
  it further."                                           asjo@koldfront.dk

Re: bogus group

[Richard Riley]

asjo@koldfront.dk (Adam Sjøgren) writes:

> On Fri, 10 Dec 2010 23:36:09 +0100, Richard wrote:
>
>> imap has nothing to do with nnmail does it?
>
> I haven't been following the imap development closely (I prefer to ssh
> to my computer and connect to emacs rather than having multiple mail
> clients; to each their own) - I think there used to be a seperate
> variable for imap-splitting, but I'm not sure.
>
> Anyway, I think your split rules should end with the folder you want
> email to default to end up in.
>
>   Best regards,
>
>     Adam

I tried this and I still get all incoming system mail into "bogus".

   (setq nnmail-split-fancy '(|(: spam-split) "inbox"))
   (setq nnmail-split-methods 'nnmail-split-fancy)

Re: bogus group

[Adam Sjøgren]

On Sat, 11 Dec 2010 16:17:53 +0100, Richard wrote:

> I tried this and I still get all incoming system mail into "bogus".

>    (setq nnmail-split-fancy '(|(: spam-split) "inbox"))
>    (setq nnmail-split-methods 'nnmail-split-fancy)

Did using the imap-specific variant of the variables make any
difference?


  Best regards,

    Adam

-- 
 "That's a mystery, but I don't intend to inquire into        Adam Sjøgren
  it further."                                           asjo@koldfront.dk

Re: bogus group

[Richard Riley]

asjo@koldfront.dk (Adam Sjøgren) writes:

> On Sat, 11 Dec 2010 16:17:53 +0100, Richard wrote:
>
>> I tried this and I still get all incoming system mail into "bogus".
>
>>    (setq nnmail-split-fancy '(|(: spam-split) "inbox"))
>>    (setq nnmail-split-methods 'nnmail-split-fancy)
>
> Did using the imap-specific variant of the variables make any
> difference?
>
>   Best regards,
>
>     Adam

This is to do with nnml - nothing to do with imap.

Or am I missing something?

Just to reiterate:

this is only about my "local system mail". It has me totally and utterly
confused.

Any mail to root@local host I have aliased to rgr@localhost. This ends
up in ~/Mail.

The default nnml back end seems to know about this. I dont know how or
why but my select method is simply:-

   (setq gnus-select-method '(nnml "nnml"))

I sent root a mail and it ended up in Gnus-Spam on nnml backend.

I then reverted to

(setq nnmail-split-fancy '("inbox") ; I suspect this is wrong for a start.

and it ended up in bogus again.

As I said, I'm a bit blind to it all now and cant see the wood for the
trees is anymore as I dont understand how nnmail vars and nnml are
related. Anyone?

Re: bogus group

[Richard Riley]

Richard Riley <rileyrg@googlemail.com> writes:

> asjo@koldfront.dk (Adam Sjøgren) writes:
>
>> On Sat, 11 Dec 2010 16:17:53 +0100, Richard wrote:
>>
>>> I tried this and I still get all incoming system mail into "bogus".
>>
>>>    (setq nnmail-split-fancy '(|(: spam-split) "inbox"))
>>>    (setq nnmail-split-methods 'nnmail-split-fancy)
>>
>> Did using the imap-specific variant of the variables make any
>> difference?
>>
>>   Best regards,
>>
>>     Adam
>
> This is to do with nnml - nothing to do with imap.
>
> Or am I missing something?
>
> Just to reiterate:
>
> this is only about my "local system mail". It has me totally and utterly
> confused.
>
> Any mail to root@local host I have aliased to rgr@localhost. This ends
> up in ~/Mail.
>
> The default nnml back end seems to know about this. I dont know how or
> why but my select method is simply:-
>
>    (setq gnus-select-method '(nnml "nnml"))
>
> I sent root a mail and it ended up in Gnus-Spam on nnml backend.
>
> I then reverted to
>
> (setq nnmail-split-fancy '("inbox") ; I suspect this is wrong for a start.
>
> and it ended up in bogus again.
>
> As I said, I'm a bit blind to it all now and cant see the wood for the
> trees is anymore as I dont understand how nnmail vars and nnml are
> related. Anyone?
>

Just to reply to myself, the docs say the nnmail-split-methods should be
   a list of lists.

,----
| The `nnmail-split-methods' variable says how the incoming mail is to be
| split into groups.
| 
|      (setq nnmail-split-methods
|        '(("mail.junk" "^From:.*Lars Ingebrigtsen")
|          ("mail.crazy" "^Subject:.*die\\|^Organization:.*flabby")
|          ("mail.other" "")))
| 
|    This variable is a list of lists, where the first element of each of
| these lists is the name of the mail group (they do not have to be called
| something beginning with `mail', by the way), and the second element is
| a regular expression used on the header of each mail to determine if it
| belongs in this mail group.
`----

So I tried:-

   (setq nnmail-split-methods '(("inbox" "")))

The new mail still goes to bogus.

Suggestions?

Re: bogus group

[Adam Sjøgren]

On Sat, 11 Dec 2010 23:51:14 +0100, Richard wrote:

> This is to do with nnml - nothing to do with imap.

Sorry, I misunderstood you. I thought you said you only use IMAP.

> Any mail to root@local host I have aliased to rgr@localhost. This ends
> up in ~/Mail.

Uh, it does? Doesn't it end up in /var/mail/rgr, from where Gnus reads
it and splits it into your nnml-groups under ~/Mail/?

>    (setq gnus-select-method '(nnml "nnml"))

I have nnml in my secondary select methods, like this: (nnml "").

> (setq nnmail-split-fancy '("inbox") ; I suspect this is wrong for a start.

That looks quite wrong, yes. What happens if you try: 

  (setq nnmail-split-fancy '(| "normal"))

?

> As I said, I'm a bit blind to it all now and cant see the wood for the
> trees is anymore as I dont understand how nnmail vars and nnml are
> related. Anyone?

I think I was adding to the confusion, because I didn't realize that you
by system email meant non-IMAP; I thought you meant email sent by cron
etc. Sorry.


  Best regards,

    Adam

-- 
 "That's a mystery, but I don't intend to inquire into        Adam Sjøgren
  it further."                                           asjo@koldfront.dk

Re: bogus group

[Richard Riley]

asjo@koldfront.dk (Adam Sjøgren) writes:

> On Sat, 11 Dec 2010 23:51:14 +0100, Richard wrote:
>
>> This is to do with nnml - nothing to do with imap.
>
> Sorry, I misunderstood you. I thought you said you only use IMAP.
>
>> Any mail to root@local host I have aliased to rgr@localhost. This ends
>> up in ~/Mail.
>
> Uh, it does? Doesn't it end up in /var/mail/rgr, from where Gnus reads
> it and splits it into your nnml-groups under ~/Mail/?

That could be the case. I dont know. 

>
>>    (setq gnus-select-method '(nnml "nnml"))
>
> I have nnml in my secondary select methods, like this: (nnml "").
>
>> (setq nnmail-split-fancy '("inbox") ; I suspect this is wrong for a start.
>
> That looks quite wrong, yes. What happens if you try: 
>
>   (setq nnmail-split-fancy '(| "normal"))
>
> ?

Yes, i corrected this in the next post. Thank for taking the time to
help me through this. It helps just to get a reply! ;) I have even
taken the "fancy" out and just assigned to the methods variable as
explained in my other post.

>
>> As I said, I'm a bit blind to it all now and cant see the wood for the
>> trees is anymore as I dont understand how nnmail vars and nnml are
>> related. Anyone?
>
> I think I was adding to the confusion, because I didn't realize that you
> by system email meant non-IMAP; I thought you meant email sent by cron
> etc. Sorry.

NP

Re: bogus group

[Andreas Schwab]

Richard Riley <rileyrg@googlemail.com> writes:

> I then reverted to
>
> (setq nnmail-split-fancy '("inbox") ; I suspect this is wrong for a start.

That's not a valid split.  A valid split can be a string, which is the
group to store into.

Andreas.

-- 
Andreas Schwab, schwab@linux-m68k.org
GPG Key fingerprint = 58CA 54C7 6D53 942B 1756  01D3 44D5 214B 8276 4ED5
"And now for something completely different."

Re: bogus group

[Richard Riley]

Andreas Schwab <schwab@linux-m68k.org> writes:

> Richard Riley <rileyrg@googlemail.com> writes:
>
>> I then reverted to
>>
>> (setq nnmail-split-fancy '("inbox") ; I suspect this is wrong for a start.
>
> That's not a valid split.  A valid split can be a string, which is the
> group to store into.
>
> Andreas.

Thanks to both of you.

I have it working now. As I said, maybe I was blinded by staring at it
too long. I now have this simple set up and it works:-


   (setq nnmail-split-fancy '(| "SYS-INBOX"))
   (setq nnmail-split-methods 'nnmail-split-fancy)

From the docs, I would still have expected

   (setq nnmail-split-methods '(("inbox" "")))

to work, but I am its probably some forward/backward/quoting issue ;)

regards

r.