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* [TUHS] (no subject)
@ 2021-04-05 22:43 M Douglas McIlroy
  2021-04-06  7:23 ` arnold
  2021-04-06 23:25 ` Dave Horsfall
  0 siblings, 2 replies; 19+ messages in thread
From: M Douglas McIlroy @ 2021-04-05 22:43 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: TUHS main list

> I had been debating leaving Usenix for several years already;
> the move to soft copy ;login: clinched it for me.

I have been a loyal nonmember of ACM ever since the CACM was
converted from a journal to a magazine. Usenix didn't strike quite
such a decisive blow when it abandoned Computing Systems.
;login: remains as a Cheshire grin. It remains to be seen whether
I'll continue to scan it in its non-tactile form.

Doug

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 19+ messages in thread

* Re: [TUHS] (no subject)
  2021-04-05 22:43 [TUHS] (no subject) M Douglas McIlroy
@ 2021-04-06  7:23 ` arnold
  2021-04-06 23:25 ` Dave Horsfall
  1 sibling, 0 replies; 19+ messages in thread
From: arnold @ 2021-04-06  7:23 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: tuhs, m.douglas.mcilroy

M Douglas McIlroy <m.douglas.mcilroy@dartmouth.edu> wrote:

> > I had been debating leaving Usenix for several years already;
> > the move to soft copy ;login: clinched it for me.
>
> I have been a loyal nonmember of ACM ever since the CACM was
> converted from a journal to a magazine. Usenix didn't strike quite
> such a decisive blow when it abandoned Computing Systems.
> ;login: remains as a Cheshire grin. It remains to be seen whether
> I'll continue to scan it in its non-tactile form.
>
> Doug

I know myself. When Linux Journal (for which I even wrote some articles)
went soft-copy, I downloaded the files for over 2 years, but never
bothered to read them, either on a computer or on my Kindle.

Oh well.  At least the threads here have been interesting reading.

Arnold

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 19+ messages in thread

* Re: [TUHS] (no subject)
  2021-04-05 22:43 [TUHS] (no subject) M Douglas McIlroy
  2021-04-06  7:23 ` arnold
@ 2021-04-06 23:25 ` Dave Horsfall
  2021-04-07  1:01   ` Jon Steinhart
  1 sibling, 1 reply; 19+ messages in thread
From: Dave Horsfall @ 2021-04-06 23:25 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: The Eunuchs Hysterical Society

On Mon, 5 Apr 2021, M Douglas McIlroy wrote:

> I have been a loyal nonmember of ACM ever since the CACM was converted 
> from a journal to a magazine. Usenix didn't strike quite such a decisive 
> blow when it abandoned Computing Systems. ;login: remains as a Cheshire 
> grin. It remains to be seen whether I'll continue to scan it in its 
> non-tactile form.

I quit the ACM when they jacked up their fees to the point of being 
unaffordable (and refused to justify it when asked); that, and they were 
no longer relevant since I stopped working in academia and went to 
industry instead.

Same story with ACS and IEEE (although they made for useful tax 
deductions).

-- Dave

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 19+ messages in thread

* Re: [TUHS] (no subject)
  2021-04-06 23:25 ` Dave Horsfall
@ 2021-04-07  1:01   ` Jon Steinhart
  0 siblings, 0 replies; 19+ messages in thread
From: Jon Steinhart @ 2021-04-07  1:01 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: The Eunuchs Hysterical Society

Dave Horsfall writes:
> I quit the ACM when they jacked up their fees to the point of being 
> unaffordable (and refused to justify it when asked); that, and they were 
> no longer relevant since I stopped working in academia and went to 
> industry instead.
>
> Same story with ACS and IEEE (although they made for useful tax 
> deductions).

Same thing happened to me.  I was really annoyed by their refusal to allow
the purchase of any of the digital library for offline use because I have
such crappy internet service here.  Just wanted to have access to stuff that
I had already purchased so that I could get rid of the paper copies.  The
final straw was when being a SIGGRAPH member stopped including the proceedings.

Last of my old CACM and proceedings of the IEEE went out recycling today.

BTW, as part of my dodsstada project I have found extra copies of the
1992, 1993, 1997, 2000, 2001, 2002, and 2003 SIGGRAPH proceedings if
anybody wants 'em.

Jon

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 19+ messages in thread

* [TUHS] (no subject)
@ 2015-12-26  4:51 Doug McIlroy
  0 siblings, 0 replies; 19+ messages in thread
From: Doug McIlroy @ 2015-12-26  4:51 UTC (permalink / raw)





^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 19+ messages in thread

* [TUHS] (no subject)
@ 2015-12-26  4:49 Doug McIlroy
  0 siblings, 0 replies; 19+ messages in thread
From: Doug McIlroy @ 2015-12-26  4:49 UTC (permalink / raw)





^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 19+ messages in thread

* [TUHS] (no subject)
@ 2015-12-24 18:09 scj
  0 siblings, 0 replies; 19+ messages in thread
From: scj @ 2015-12-24 18:09 UTC (permalink / raw)


Actually, I could easily see Usenix doing this kind of thing on a regular
basis.  Add my vote as another ex president...




^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 19+ messages in thread

* [TUHS] (no subject)
@ 2015-12-24 18:09 scj
  0 siblings, 0 replies; 19+ messages in thread
From: scj @ 2015-12-24 18:09 UTC (permalink / raw)


Actually, I could easily see Usenix doing this kind of thing on a regular
basis.  Add my vote as another ex president...




^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 19+ messages in thread

* [TUHS] (no subject)
@ 2015-07-19 20:55 Brian Walden
  0 siblings, 0 replies; 19+ messages in thread
From: Brian Walden @ 2015-07-19 20:55 UTC (permalink / raw)



I authored those files so I could render the Seventh Edition manuals
as PDF in 1998 (long after I had departed the Labs). As pic did not
exist yet (Kernighan had not written it) there were never any
original pic files for these documents. I do not know what 1127 was
doing to publish diagrams at the time.

The Bell logo I did directly in postscript so \(bs would render. The logo
was originally it's own custom "character" just like an A, B or C, on the
phototypesetter's optical font wheel.

You can see what they look liked from the v7 PDF manuals --

In Volume 2A (http://plan9.bell-labs.com/7thEdMan/v7vol2a.pdf)
bs.ps is on variety of pages such as 129, 130, 216
ms.pic is on page 127
make.ps is on page 282

In Volume 2B (http://plan9.bell-labs.com/7thEdMan/v7vol2b.pdf)
implfig1.pic is on page 162
implfig2.pic is on page 168

these are the PDF page numbers (where the title is page 1)


> From: Mark Longridge <cubexyz at gmail.com>
>
> I came across some Unix files in v7add such as bs.ps for the Bell logo
> and ms.pic (described as Figure 1 for msmacros).
>
> http://www.maxhost.org/other/ms.pic
>
> I was wondering if there was some viewer or conversion program so we
> could look at pic files from this era?
>
> Mark
>
>



^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 19+ messages in thread

* [TUHS] (no subject)
  2015-07-19  1:13     ` Larry McVoy
@ 2015-07-19  1:19       ` Milo Velimirovic
  0 siblings, 0 replies; 19+ messages in thread
From: Milo Velimirovic @ 2015-07-19  1:19 UTC (permalink / raw)



> On Jul 18, 2015, at 8:13 PM, Larry McVoy <lm at mcvoy.com> wrote:
> 
> On Sun, Jul 19, 2015 at 10:57:18AM +1000, Warren Toomey wrote:
>> On Sat, Jul 18, 2015 at 10:53:23AM -0700, Larry McVoy wrote:
>>> Apply these changes and you can do 
>>> 
>>> gpic ms.pic | grep > PS
>> 
>> gpic ms.pic | groff > PS
>> 
>> Took me a while to work out the empty grep! Obviously your brain
>> sent groff and your fingers auto-corrected to grep as your fingers
>> use that command more :-)
> 
> Sorry about that, you are right.  Shame on me.  And it was in the morning
> so I can't blame it on a glass of wine or something.

You can always claim insufficient coffee intake.

 - Milo




^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 19+ messages in thread

* [TUHS] (no subject)
  2015-07-19  0:57   ` Warren Toomey
@ 2015-07-19  1:13     ` Larry McVoy
  2015-07-19  1:19       ` Milo Velimirovic
  0 siblings, 1 reply; 19+ messages in thread
From: Larry McVoy @ 2015-07-19  1:13 UTC (permalink / raw)


On Sun, Jul 19, 2015 at 10:57:18AM +1000, Warren Toomey wrote:
> On Sat, Jul 18, 2015 at 10:53:23AM -0700, Larry McVoy wrote:
> > Apply these changes and you can do 
> > 
> > gpic ms.pic | grep > PS
> 
> gpic ms.pic | groff > PS
> 
> Took me a while to work out the empty grep! Obviously your brain
> sent groff and your fingers auto-corrected to grep as your fingers
> use that command more :-)

Sorry about that, you are right.  Shame on me.  And it was in the morning
so I can't blame it on a glass of wine or something.
-- 
---
Larry McVoy            	     lm at mcvoy.com             http://www.mcvoy.com/lm 



^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 19+ messages in thread

* [TUHS] (no subject)
  2015-07-18 17:53 ` Larry McVoy
@ 2015-07-19  0:57   ` Warren Toomey
  2015-07-19  1:13     ` Larry McVoy
  0 siblings, 1 reply; 19+ messages in thread
From: Warren Toomey @ 2015-07-19  0:57 UTC (permalink / raw)


On Sat, Jul 18, 2015 at 10:53:23AM -0700, Larry McVoy wrote:
> Apply these changes and you can do 
> 
> gpic ms.pic | grep > PS

gpic ms.pic | groff > PS

Took me a while to work out the empty grep! Obviously your brain
sent groff and your fingers auto-corrected to grep as your fingers
use that command more :-)

Cheers, Warren



^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 19+ messages in thread

* [TUHS] (no subject)
  2015-07-18 17:43 Mark Longridge
@ 2015-07-18 17:53 ` Larry McVoy
  2015-07-19  0:57   ` Warren Toomey
  0 siblings, 1 reply; 19+ messages in thread
From: Larry McVoy @ 2015-07-18 17:53 UTC (permalink / raw)


Apply these changes and you can do 

gpic ms.pic | grep > PS
gv PS

--- ms.pic      2015-07-18 10:39:27.000000000 -0700
+++ ms.fixed    2015-07-18 10:52:04.110328358 -0700
@@ -2,11 +2,11 @@
 lineht=0.25
 boxht=0.25
 boxwid=0.25
-ST: down arrow
+ST: arrow down
 arrow right then down
 box invis "RP"
 arrow down
-left line
+line left
 X: line to ST
 arrow down at X
 box invis "TL"

On Sat, Jul 18, 2015 at 01:43:20PM -0400, Mark Longridge wrote:
> I came across some Unix files in v7add such as bs.ps for the Bell logo
> and ms.pic (described as Figure 1 for msmacros).
> 
> http://www.maxhost.org/other/ms.pic
> 
> I was wondering if there was some viewer or conversion program so we
> could look at pic files from this era?
> 
> Mark
> _______________________________________________
> TUHS mailing list
> TUHS at minnie.tuhs.org
> https://minnie.tuhs.org/mailman/listinfo/tuhs

-- 
---
Larry McVoy            	     lm at mcvoy.com             http://www.mcvoy.com/lm 



^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 19+ messages in thread

* [TUHS] (no subject)
@ 2015-07-18 17:43 Mark Longridge
  2015-07-18 17:53 ` Larry McVoy
  0 siblings, 1 reply; 19+ messages in thread
From: Mark Longridge @ 2015-07-18 17:43 UTC (permalink / raw)


I came across some Unix files in v7add such as bs.ps for the Bell logo
and ms.pic (described as Figure 1 for msmacros).

http://www.maxhost.org/other/ms.pic

I was wondering if there was some viewer or conversion program so we
could look at pic files from this era?

Mark



^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 19+ messages in thread

* [TUHS] (no subject)
@ 2010-01-13  3:42 Larry McVoy
  0 siblings, 0 replies; 19+ messages in thread
From: Larry McVoy @ 2010-01-13  3:42 UTC (permalink / raw)


xtp at google.com
Bcc: 
Subject: Re: [TUHS] E_GREG ??
Reply-To: 
In-Reply-To: <06978479-C120-40CF-8878-BE15EFE01B76 at coraid.com>

Hey, I know and like Greg.  I used to work for him.  I've cc-ed him on this,
he may not know about this list.  And might enjoy it.

On Tue, Jan 12, 2010 at 10:07:19PM -0500, Brantley Coile wrote:
> Greg Chesson. He designed the uucp g protocol. There was a piece of  
> networking gear at Murray hill that Greg worked on that every now and  
> then would fail to connect. Someone modified the message to read "it's  
> all Greg's fault.". Later the string became an errno, I think for the  
> Netb file server protocol. Plan 9 still has an EGREG even though it is a 
> string in plan 9. It now reads "Ken has left the building."
>
> iPhone email
>
> On Dec 15, 2009, at 7:02 PM, Warren Toomey <wkt at tuhs.org> wrote:
>
>> I just saw this on Groklaw:
>>
>>    There were not many machines which ran Version 10. They were all
>>    at Murray Hill and some of them were donated to Auburn University
>>    when AT&T closed up shop.  We got some old MicroVAX machines and
>>    a couple of printed manuals. One of the printed manuals lists
>>    various error codes. One of them is
>>
>>    E_GREG Greg did it.
>>
>>    Poor Greg. who was he, really?
>>
>> Anybody know the answer? Norman?
>>
>> P.S Merry Xmas to all.
>> Cheers,
>>    Warren
>> _______________________________________________
>> TUHS mailing list
>> TUHS at minnie.tuhs.org
>> https://minnie.tuhs.org/mailman/listinfo/tuhs
>>
> _______________________________________________
> TUHS mailing list
> TUHS at minnie.tuhs.org
> https://minnie.tuhs.org/mailman/listinfo/tuhs

-- 
---
Larry McVoy                lm at bitmover.com           http://www.bitkeeper.com
_______________________________________________
TUHS mailing list
TUHS at minnie.tuhs.org
https://minnie.tuhs.org/mailman/listinfo/tuhs



^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 19+ messages in thread

* [TUHS] (no subject)
@ 2006-02-22  5:08 dmr
  0 siblings, 0 replies; 19+ messages in thread
From: dmr @ 2006-02-22  5:08 UTC (permalink / raw)


 > If I remember correctly, all of the "real" members of the 3B family
 > (i.e. 3B2, 3B5, 3B15 and 3B20) shared a common "virtual"
 > instruction set called (I think) IS25 - it was the job of the assembler
 > to translate IS25 into the actual machine code for the specific
 > processor used in each machine.

 > IS25 was a little curious because it only defined those instructions
 > that were likely to be of use to the C compiler - thus there was a
 > "push" instruction so that the compiler could push function arguments
 > onto the stack, but no "pop" instruction because the C compiler
 > never generated it.

IS25: just so. I managed to retrieve the scanned PDF for
the manual for this virtual instruction set.  It's an
internal memo, but I'll send it if anyone asks.  It's
2.8MB of page images and is 108 pages long.

The memories of Lindsly and Lowenstein are also apposite.
AT&T donated quite a few machines (3B20 and 3B2) to universities,
and though they appreciated the thought, there were
various drawbacks--the gift didn't include maintenance, for
example.

	Dennis



^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 19+ messages in thread

* [TUHS] (no subject)
@ 2005-07-20 21:17 Brantley Coile
  0 siblings, 0 replies; 19+ messages in thread
From: Brantley Coile @ 2005-07-20 21:17 UTC (permalink / raw)


>>> "vi". Editing with "cat" is possible but not very useful. I am not going
>>> to learn "ed".
>>
>> Why?
> 
> Simply because. Because I do not like ed.
> I want to have useful and user friendly system. To use ed, only because
> it is the oldest editor, does not make any sense for me.
> I appreciate ed, because of sed, because sed has some similarity to ed
> and is extremely useful as a tool.
> Unix is not about ed, Unix is about unlimited possibilities of adding
> new software , new applications or new editors, it makes Unix beautiful
> that it can develop and not editor ed.If ed were all Unix has, it would
> not survive.
> I hope You accept that someone else can have different favourite
> editors. I prefer vi, or even more vim, which is perfect editor.Of
> course in the case of emulator missing user friendly editor is not a
> problem, because I can edit under Coherent and then build under
> emulator.It is good to have a choice, and Unix offers it.

In 1983 I was using vi.  I allowed a friend to use our system to typeset
his companies UNIX manuals, and quickly found that I was having to
share the machine with a dozen troff jobs.  Vi, being a program that
ran in raw mode, didn't respond very well on that 68010 10Mhz system.
I was forced to switch to ed.  Suddenly I discovered that I had hidden
real UNIX behind all those vi commands.  I now had plenty of
mental capacity to use the rest of the tools available.

To really say you understand the spirit of the software tools approach,
you must spend a couple of months just using ed.  Today I use acme
mostly, but still find myself using ed for some edits.

I would really encourage you to give it a try.  Spend two months
just using ed.  You cerntainly should use the editor you feel most
confortable with, but the growing experience will be well worth your while.

  Brantley



^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 19+ messages in thread

* [TUHS] (no subject)
  2003-05-23  4:10 Dennis Ritchie
@ 2003-05-24  3:42 ` Kenneth Stailey
  0 siblings, 0 replies; 19+ messages in thread
From: Kenneth Stailey @ 2003-05-24  3:42 UTC (permalink / raw)


--- Dennis Ritchie <dmr at plan9.bell-labs.com> wrote:
>  > The V7 ls(1) man page says that the -s option, which prints total
>  >blocks, includes any indirect blocks.
> 
>  >However, the V7 struct stat didn't have the st_blocks member in the
>  > struct stat, and the code in ls.c uses
> 
>  > 	long
>  >	nblock(size)
>  >	long size;
>  >	{
>  >		return((size+511)>>9);
>  >	}
> 
>  >So, is this just a case of the man page being mistaken?
> 
> Yes, it looks like a manual bug. Retrieving
> the true number of indirect blocks isn't possible
> from the 7th edition stat.  I'm not sure when (or by
> whom) the st_blocks member was added.
> 
>  > While I'm at it, the V7 ls -a option only adds . and .. to the
>  > list; apparently all other dot files were printed by default.
>  > When did ls change such that -a applied to all dot files?
> 
> UCB or USL did this (I'm sure which first).
> Both tended to use more . files.
> 
> 	Dennis
> _______________________________________________
> TUHS mailing list
> TUHS at minnie.tuhs.org
> http://minnie.tuhs.org/mailman/listinfo/tuhs

1BSD ls.c has:

        for(;;) {
                p = &dentry;
                for (j=0; j<16; j++)
                        *p++ = getc(&inf);
                if (dentry.dinode==0
                 || aflg==0 && dentry.dname[0]=='.')
                        continue;
                if (dentry.dinode == -1)
                        break;
                ep = gstat(makename(dir, dentry.dname), 0);
                if (ep->lnum != -1)
                        ep->lnum = dentry.dinode;
                for (j=0; j<14; j++)
                        ep->lname[j] = dentry.dname[j];
        }

so it skips all that start with "." unless aflg is set from invoking ls with
-a.

I got it from the 1BSD tape that is on the CSRG archive CD-ROM set.  I had to
port ar11 to FreeBSD/i386 to get the sources out of the cont.a files.  If
anyone wants my port of ar11 I can send it to them.

ls.c starts with this block of comments:

#
/*
 * ls - list file or directory
 *
 * Modified by Bill Joy UCB May/August 1977
 *
 * This version of ls is designed for graphic terminals and to
 * list directories with lots of files in them compactly.
 * It supports three variants for listings:
 *
 *      1) Columnar output.
 *      2) Stream output.
 *      3) Old one per line format.
 *
 * Columnar output is the default.
 * If, however, the standard output is not a teletype, the default
 * is one-per-line.
 *
 * With columnar output, the items are sorted down the columns.
 * We use columns only for a directory we are interpreting.
 * Thus, in particular, we do not use columns for
 *
 *      ls /usr/bin/p*
 *
 * This version of ls also prints non-printing characters as '?' if
 * the standard output is a teletype.
 *
 * Flags relating to these and other new features are:
 *
 *      -m      force stream output.
 *
 *      -1      force one entry per line, e.g. to a teletype
 *
 *      -q      force non-printings to be '?'s, e.g. to a file
 *
 *      -c      force columnar output, e.g. into a file
 *
 *      -n      like -l, but user/group id's in decimal rather than
 *              looking in /etc/passwd to save time
 */

It's interesting they called CRTs "graphic terminals".


__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo.
http://search.yahoo.com



^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 19+ messages in thread

* [TUHS] (no subject)
@ 2003-05-23  4:10 Dennis Ritchie
  2003-05-24  3:42 ` Kenneth Stailey
  0 siblings, 1 reply; 19+ messages in thread
From: Dennis Ritchie @ 2003-05-23  4:10 UTC (permalink / raw)


 > The V7 ls(1) man page says that the -s option, which prints total
 >blocks, includes any indirect blocks.

 >However, the V7 struct stat didn't have the st_blocks member in the
 > struct stat, and the code in ls.c uses

 > 	long
 >	nblock(size)
 >	long size;
 >	{
 >		return((size+511)>>9);
 >	}

 >So, is this just a case of the man page being mistaken?

Yes, it looks like a manual bug. Retrieving
the true number of indirect blocks isn't possible
from the 7th edition stat.  I'm not sure when (or by
whom) the st_blocks member was added.

 > While I'm at it, the V7 ls -a option only adds . and .. to the
 > list; apparently all other dot files were printed by default.
 > When did ls change such that -a applied to all dot files?

UCB or USL did this (I'm sure which first).
Both tended to use more . files.

	Dennis



^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 19+ messages in thread

end of thread, other threads:[~2021-04-07  1:02 UTC | newest]

Thread overview: 19+ messages (download: mbox.gz / follow: Atom feed)
-- links below jump to the message on this page --
2021-04-05 22:43 [TUHS] (no subject) M Douglas McIlroy
2021-04-06  7:23 ` arnold
2021-04-06 23:25 ` Dave Horsfall
2021-04-07  1:01   ` Jon Steinhart
  -- strict thread matches above, loose matches on Subject: below --
2015-12-26  4:51 Doug McIlroy
2015-12-26  4:49 Doug McIlroy
2015-12-24 18:09 scj
2015-12-24 18:09 scj
2015-07-19 20:55 Brian Walden
2015-07-18 17:43 Mark Longridge
2015-07-18 17:53 ` Larry McVoy
2015-07-19  0:57   ` Warren Toomey
2015-07-19  1:13     ` Larry McVoy
2015-07-19  1:19       ` Milo Velimirovic
2010-01-13  3:42 Larry McVoy
2006-02-22  5:08 dmr
2005-07-20 21:17 Brantley Coile
2003-05-23  4:10 Dennis Ritchie
2003-05-24  3:42 ` Kenneth Stailey

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