From: bakul@bitblocks.com (Bakul Shah)
Subject: [TUHS] OT: critical Intel design flaw
Date: Wed, 03 Jan 2018 19:31:35 -0800 [thread overview]
Message-ID: <20180104033151.04D5A156E523@mail.bitblocks.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: Your message of "Wed, 03 Jan 2018 18:26:04 -0800." <20180104022604.GL1534@mcvoy.com>
On Wed, 03 Jan 2018 18:26:04 -0800 Larry McVoy <lm at mcvoy.com> wrote:
Larry McVoy writes:
>
> > > The problem is that most people / companies are not that disciplined.
> >
> > The whole idea is not to hack on the ukernel endlessly but to
> > build apps on top of it. On something like Mill you won't even
>
> Um, I've been reading about Mill for at least a decade. It's not
> real until it ships. It's still vaporware, no?
It is vaporware mainly because it's a largely self/unfunded
effort led by one guy and a very lean volunteer team. I don't
know if it will actually get funded -- in my view there are
enough interesting things in it that it is worth supporting by
one of the big 3 or 4 companies (or a 3 letter govt agency).
Its architecture certainly seems realizable (of course, proof
is in the pudding etc). But even just with ukernels we can
achieve similar isolation & security.
Here is a recent paper:
http://ssrg.nicta.com.au/publications/csiro_full_text//Elphinstone_ZMH_17.pdf
They show that seL4+rumpkernel is actually faster than native NetBSD on
the same hardware (atleast on some TCP throughput tests).
> I *love* the idea of a microkernel with a bunch of processes implementing
> the OS, it's so much a better design. I also have been in the real world
> long enough to think that I'm not going to see Linux replaced with a
> microkernel in my lifetime. I wish, but I don't see it happening.
It won't *replace* linux but linux API can be made available
via such processes and a shared lib. You may be right about
real world inertia. And Security is simply not taken seriously
enough. I still think it would be well worth it for
knowledgeable OS folks like you to /actually/ explore this
design space and see what is possible. It would certainly be
more fun than hacking on Linux or FreeBSD!
next prev parent reply other threads:[~2018-01-04 3:31 UTC|newest]
Thread overview: 40+ messages / expand[flat|nested] mbox.gz Atom feed top
2018-01-03 13:43 Noel Chiappa
2018-01-03 14:26 ` Clem Cole
2018-01-03 17:28 ` Bakul Shah
2018-01-03 17:46 ` ron minnich
2018-01-03 18:28 ` Bakul Shah
2018-01-03 18:27 ` Clem Cole
2018-01-03 18:39 ` Forrest, Jon
2018-01-03 18:50 ` ron minnich
2018-01-03 19:56 ` Paul Winalski
2018-01-03 20:24 ` Bakul Shah
2018-01-03 23:40 ` Theodore Ts'o
2018-01-04 0:51 ` Larry McVoy
2018-01-04 2:13 ` Bakul Shah
2018-01-04 2:26 ` Larry McVoy
2018-01-04 3:31 ` Bakul Shah [this message]
2018-01-04 2:09 ` Arthur Krewat
2018-01-04 3:21 ` Dan Cross
2018-01-04 17:42 ` Arthur Krewat
2018-01-04 11:53 ` Harald Arnesen
2018-01-04 14:03 ` Clem Cole
2018-01-04 15:54 ` Larry McVoy
2018-01-04 16:45 ` Theodore Ts'o
2018-01-04 17:10 ` Andy Kosela
2018-01-04 17:17 ` Larry McVoy
2018-01-04 18:29 ` Bakul Shah
2018-01-04 18:50 ` Larry McVoy
2018-01-04 20:52 ` Warner Losh
2018-01-04 20:56 ` Bakul Shah
2018-01-04 20:56 ` Theodore Ts'o
2018-01-04 21:16 ` Warner Losh
2018-01-04 22:55 ` Andy Kosela
2018-01-05 14:27 ` Clem Cole
2018-01-04 21:17 ` Bakul Shah
2018-01-04 17:20 ` Tom Ivar Helbekkmo
2018-01-04 17:28 ` Warner Losh
2018-01-03 17:07 ` Bakul Shah
-- strict thread matches above, loose matches on Subject: below --
2018-01-03 17:06 Norman Wilson
2018-01-03 7:53 Andy Kosela
2018-01-03 11:57 ` Ron Natalie
2018-01-03 14:22 ` Random832
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