[9fans] Welcome Plan 9 community

[9fans] Welcome Plan 9 community

[Szymon Olewniczak]

Hi,
I've just registerd to this mailing list, so hello everyone.

I've read about Plan 9 several months ago and fascinated with ideas
behind this OS. Now I've decided to try the system on my own and although
I don't know much about it yet, I believe that it can be something that
I would like to work for(I'm an IT student, so if I find myself clever
enough to understand the power of Plan 9, I will try to help the project
during the GOSC).

But to begin with the main issue that brings me to write this message. I
know that before I can do anything on Plan 9, I need hardware that
cooperate with it. I've read the Supported PC Hardware[0] and
realised that there is not much of it. Is there only one reliable motherboard
(ASUS A8R32-MVP without NIC) that can run Plan9? I've also read there that
there are several laptops pointed in this page without any additional
comments in brackets. Does it mean that they are fully supported? I've
also read that RaspberryPI can run Plan 9. I have RP rev. 2 so maybe it
should be the hardware which I can use to start my Plan 9 adventure.

What hardware can you recommend? What hardware do you use? Is there is
any PC that can run both Plan 9 and Inferno?

[0]http://www.plan9.bell-labs.com/wiki/plan9/Supported_PC_hardware/index.html

Re: [9fans] Welcome Plan 9 community

[erik quanstrom]

> But to begin with the main issue that brings me to write this message. I
> know that before I can do anything on Plan 9, I need hardware that
> cooperate with it. I've read the Supported PC Hardware[0] and
> realised that there is not much of it. Is there only one reliable motherboard
> (ASUS A8R32-MVP without NIC) that can run Plan9? I've also read there that
> there are several laptops pointed in this page without any additional
> comments in brackets. Does it mean that they are fully supported? I've
> also read that RaspberryPI can run Plan 9. I have RP rev. 2 so maybe it
> should be the hardware which I can use to start my Plan 9 adventure.

i've had good luck with plan 9 on a wide variety of hardware.  i've probablly
run it on 20-30 motherboards in the last 5-6 years.  everything from little
soekris to dell/ibm/hp blade servers.  but there are a few little changes that
i made, esp. to the 82563 (intel gigabit) and ahci drivers.

- erik

Re: [9fans] Welcome Plan 9 community

[Grant Mather]

> I've also read that RaspberryPI can run Plan 9. I have RP rev. 2 so maybe it
> should be the hardware which I can use to start my Plan 9 adventure.
>
> What hardware can you recommend? What hardware do you use? Is there is
> any PC that can run both Plan 9 and Inferno?

If you have a Raspberry Pi, I would just recommend running it on that.
This is currently the machine that I run Plan 9 on, and it runs fast and
very stable. Installing is simply a matter of using dd to copy it to a
SD card.

Re: [9fans] Welcome Plan 9 community

[Peter Hull]

It’s not as exciting as real hardware but you could always run it on a virtual machine. I’ve got it running fine on VirtualBox, with networking (internet and between VMs) 
Pete

On 2 Mar 2014, at 22:16, Szymon Olewniczak <szymon.olewniczak@rid.pl> wrote:

> Hi,
> I've just registerd to this mailing list, so hello everyone.
> 
> I've read about Plan 9 several months ago and fascinated with ideas
> behind this OS. Now I've decided to try the system on my own and although 
> I don't know much about it yet, I believe that it can be something that
> I would like to work for(I'm an IT student, so if I find myself clever 
> enough to understand the power of Plan 9, I will try to help the project
> during the GOSC). 
> 
> But to begin with the main issue that brings me to write this message. I
> know that before I can do anything on Plan 9, I need hardware that
> cooperate with it. I've read the Supported PC Hardware[0] and
> realised that there is not much of it. Is there only one reliable motherboard  
> (ASUS A8R32-MVP without NIC) that can run Plan9? I've also read there that
> there are several laptops pointed in this page without any additional
> comments in brackets. Does it mean that they are fully supported? I've
> also read that RaspberryPI can run Plan 9. I have RP rev. 2 so maybe it
> should be the hardware which I can use to start my Plan 9 adventure.
> 
> What hardware can you recommend? What hardware do you use? Is there is
> any PC that can run both Plan 9 and Inferno?
> 
> [0]http://www.plan9.bell-labs.com/wiki/plan9/Supported_PC_hardware/index.html
> 
> 

Re: [9fans] Welcome Plan 9 community

[Lyndon Nerenberg]

On Mar 3, 2014, at 10:05, Peter Hull <peterhull90@gmail.com> wrote:

> It’s not as exciting as real hardware but you could always run it on a virtual machine. I’ve got it running fine on VirtualBox, with networking (internet and between VMs) 

Please post *actual* *working* config files to the wiki!  There is much anecdotal talk of 9 under various VMs, but almost no actual evidence of how to make it work.

FWIW, I have QEMU configs coming in a day or two.

--lyndon

Re: [9fans] Welcome Plan 9 community

[Alexandru Gheorghe]

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Networking for VBox was covered in some older posts. A search in the
ml's archive should find them.

On 03/03/2014 09:32 PM, Lyndon Nerenberg wrote:
> 
> On Mar 3, 2014, at 10:05, Peter Hull <peterhull90@gmail.com> wrote:
> 
>> It’s not as exciting as real hardware but you could always run it on a virtual machine. I’ve got it running fine on VirtualBox, with networking (internet and between VMs) 
> 
> Please post *actual* *working* config files to the wiki!  There is much anecdotal talk of 9 under various VMs, but almost no actual evidence of how to make it work.
> 
> FWIW, I have QEMU configs coming in a day or two.
> 
> --lyndon
> 
> 

-- 
; Alexandru Gheorghe
; alghe.global {at} gmail {dot} com
; OpenPGP key ID 0xCAF985D2


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Re: [9fans] Welcome Plan 9 community

[erik quanstrom]

On Mon Mar  3 15:30:02 EST 2014, alghe.global@gmail.com wrote:

> Networking for VBox was covered in some older posts. A search in the
> ml's archive should find them.

vbox networking changes with every minor release, and interacts with
the local physical hardware, and os version.  so the archives are not
necessarly helpful.

- erik

Re: [9fans] Welcome Plan 9 community

[Alexandru Gheorghe]

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On 03/03/2014 10:37 PM, erik quanstrom wrote:
> On Mon Mar  3 15:30:02 EST 2014, alghe.global@gmail.com wrote:
> 
>> Networking for VBox was covered in some older posts. A search in the
>> ml's archive should find them.
> 
> vbox networking changes with every minor release, and interacts with
> the local physical hardware, and os version.  so the archives are not
> necessarly helpful.
> 
> - erik
> 

should we gather some configuration steps/examples for known stable
builds of vbox and post them in a wiki somewhere(?) at least people
could resort to those and omit the minor releases,until a major (for
which we write yet another entry in wiki if necessary and breaks plan9).

is this reasonable?
-- 
; Alexandru Gheorghe
; alghe.global {at} gmail {dot} com
; OpenPGP key ID 0xCAF985D2


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Re: [9fans] Welcome Plan 9 community

[Lyndon Nerenberg]

On Mar 3, 2014, at 12:52, Alexandru Gheorghe <alghe.global@gmail.com> wrote:

> should we gather some configuration steps/examples for known stable
> builds of vbox and post them in a wiki somewhere(?)

Yes!  That's what the wiki is for.

Re: [9fans] Welcome Plan 9 community

[Lyndon Nerenberg]

On Mar 3, 2014, at 12:37, erik quanstrom <quanstro@quanstro.net> wrote:

> vbox networking changes with every minor release, and interacts with
> the local physical hardware, and os version.  so the archives are not
> necessarly helpful.

I have a Labs kernel still running in a Parallels VM I created in 2010.  But I have been unable to install a new Plan9 in any 2011 or later version of Parallels (including the 9front or the many 9atom variants).  This is why it is important to document the explicit versions of the host OS, the VM software, and the 9 kernel, of *working* configurations.

--lyndon

Re: [9fans] Welcome Plan 9 community

[Peter Hull]

On 3 Mar 2014, at 20:52, Alexandru Gheorghe <alghe.global@gmail.com> wrote:

> should we gather some configuration steps/examples for known stable
> builds of vbox and post them in a wiki somewhere(?) at least people
> could resort to those and omit the minor releases,until a major (for
> which we write yet another entry in wiki if necessary and breaks plan9).
I will try and reinstall my setup and note down the configurations for the wiki.
Pete

Re: [9fans] Welcome Plan 9 community

[Alexandru Gheorghe]

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On 03/03/2014 10:53 PM, Lyndon Nerenberg wrote:
> 
> On Mar 3, 2014, at 12:52, Alexandru Gheorghe <alghe.global@gmail.com> wrote:
> 
>> should we gather some configuration steps/examples for known stable
>> builds of vbox and post them in a wiki somewhere(?)
> 
> Yes!  That's what the wiki is for.
> 

sure, I agree. I am only enquiring so as to brainstorm if we should
actually (and be better of) providing a sort of how-to in debugging
network setup on plan9 (besides what is already on the net).

i.e., even if somebody runs into trouble (ultimately), it is better off
posting his output of:

cat /net/ndb

ls /net | grep ether (optional)
ls /net/ether*

ip/ipconfig -DGP


in case he/she is running in recv timeout for 15 secs; shortcut:

ppid=`{ps | grep ipconfig | awk '{print $2}'}
echo kill > /proc/$ppid/note

sorry for the `   as I am writing from GNU/Linux


this may not fully represent what is needed, but this is what I could
gather in few minutes of man pages and some trial and error, after only
30 minutes of Plan9 experience. so I am sure far more experienced users
from the mailinglist can contribute to the article

I will try to tackle it this weekend from this approach/point of view,
maybe I can come up with something rather useful, if not, at least
networking setup for the build I use of vbox/os/version etc.
-- 
; Alexandru Gheorghe
; alghe.global {at} gmail {dot} com
; OpenPGP key ID 0xCAF985D2


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Re: [9fans] Welcome Plan 9 community

[Alexandru Gheorghe]

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On 03/04/2014 12:19 AM, Alexandru Gheorghe wrote:
> On 03/03/2014 10:53 PM, Lyndon Nerenberg wrote:
>>
>> On Mar 3, 2014, at 12:52, Alexandru Gheorghe <alghe.global@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> should we gather some configuration steps/examples for known stable
>>> builds of vbox and post them in a wiki somewhere(?)
>>
>> Yes!  That's what the wiki is for.
>>
> 
> sure, I agree. I am only enquiring so as to brainstorm if we should
> actually (and be better of) providing a sort of how-to in debugging
> network setup on plan9 (besides what is already on the net).
> 
> i.e., even if somebody runs into trouble (ultimately), it is better off
> posting his output of:
> 
> cat /net/ndb
> 
> ls /net | grep ether (optional)
> ls /net/ether*
> 
> ip/ipconfig -DGP
> 
> 
> in case he/she is running in recv timeout for 15 secs; shortcut:
> 
> ppid=`{ps | grep ipconfig | awk '{print $2}'}
> echo kill > /proc/$ppid/note
> 
> sorry for the `   as I am writing from GNU/Linux
> 
> 
> this may not fully represent what is needed, but this is what I could
> gather in few minutes of man pages and some trial and error, after only
> 30 minutes of Plan9 experience. so I am sure far more experienced users
> from the mailinglist can contribute to the article
> 
> I will try to tackle it this weekend from this approach/point of view,
> maybe I can come up with something rather useful, if not, at least
> networking setup for the build I use of vbox/os/v

ersion etc.
> 

Hmm, actually related to this, I encounter dhcprecv read timed out.
I searched and seems there are some interrupt related "issues", this
happens with VirtualBox (4.1.18_Debian r78361) for me, not on bare
metal. NIC is in NAT, tried with a second NIC in bridged; definitely not
the NIC as the below code also points out in  !0  and  !1

dhcp.c:
-------
void
dhcprecv(void)
{
[...]
        uchar buf[8000], vopts[256], taddr[IPaddrlen];
[...]
        memset(buf, 0, sizeof buf);
        alarm(1000);
!0      n = read(conf.fd, buf, sizeof buf);
        alarm(0);

        if(n < 0){
                rerrstr(err, sizeof err);
        !1      if(strstr(err, "interrupt") == nil)
                        warning("dhcprecv: bad read: %s", err);
                else
                        DEBUG("dhcprecv: read timed out");
                return;


n <- ipconfig.h:
----------------
typedef struct Conf Conf;
[...]
struct Conf
{
[...]
	/* dhcp specific */
	int	fd;


Any ideas? I don't seem to find plan9.ini to try the fix Akshat Kumar
pointed out in [1]; all the other answers from erik and ron are bare
metal hardware related (like the original post). How to deal with this
in VirtualBox?

Chipset is PIIX3 [2]


References:
[1]
https://groups.google.com/forum/?_escaped_fragment_=topic/comp.os.plan9/9nlmIoY4-C8#!topic/comp.os.plan9/9nlmIoY4-C8

[2] https://www.virtualbox.org/manual/ch03.html#settings-motherboard
(under Chipset section) -- there is another option "ICH9" and the MSI
seems a plus; not sure how this will interact with Plan9 but I'll give
it a go
-- 
; Alexandru Gheorghe
; alghe.global {at} gmail {dot} com
; OpenPGP key ID 0xCAF985D2


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Re: [9fans] Welcome Plan 9 community

[Peter Hull]

On Wed, Mar 5, 2014 at 8:23 PM, Alexandru Gheorghe
<alghe.global@gmail.com> wrote:
> On 03/04/2014 12:19 AM, Alexandru Gheorghe wrote:
>> On 03/03/2014 10:53 PM, Lyndon Nerenberg wrote:
>>>
>>> On Mar 3, 2014, at 12:52, Alexandru Gheorghe <alghe.global@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> should we gather some configuration steps/examples for known stable
>>>> builds of vbox and post them in a wiki somewhere(?)
I've got some instructions for running Plan 9 on Virtual Box, I was
going to post them on the wiki as Alexandru Gheorghe suggested. I got
onto the wiki and tried to edit the sandbox as a first step but got a
curious error when I tried to Put:
Wiki commit 1028330739 12 -1: '/sys/lib/wiki/d/2.hist' permission denied.

Anyway here are the instructions for future reference.

PLAN9 INSTALL
=============

VirtualBox
----------

Set up VM in Virtual Box v4.3.8, OS X 9 host, recent (2014-03-02) CD Plan9.iso

64MB RAM
2GB hard disk
NAT network, Intel PRO/1000 MT Server (82545EM)
PIIX3 chipset
PS/2 Mouse
No USB
No Serial
No Sound
VT-x/AMD-V enabled
Storage PIIX4 IDE controller

Install from CD
---------------

Monitor: 1024x768x8 VESA
Mouse: PS2INTELLIMOUSE
Accept all defaults
Location of archives: /
Plan 9 boot, install MBR
Remove the virtual CD from the virtual drive
Reboot (type CTRL-T CTRL-T R)

Login
-----
Accept default on 'Root is from:'
User: glenda
Get familiar with rio/acme

Net Access
----------
Open /rc/bin/termrc in acme
Uncomment the lines
# if (! test -e /net/ipifc/0/ctl)
#      ip/ipconfig
and reboot.

Re: [9fans] Welcome Plan 9 community

[Alexandru Gheorghe]

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On 03/05/2014 10:23 PM, Alexandru Gheorghe wrote:
> On 03/04/2014 12:19 AM, Alexandru Gheorghe wrote:
>> On 03/03/2014 10:53 PM, Lyndon Nerenberg wrote:
>>>
>>> On Mar 3, 2014, at 12:52, Alexandru Gheorghe <alghe.global@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> should we gather some configuration steps/examples for known stable
>>>> builds of vbox and post them in a wiki somewhere(?)
>>>
>>> Yes!  That's what the wiki is for.
>>>
>>
>> sure, I agree. I am only enquiring so as to brainstorm if we should
>> actually (and be better of) providing a sort of how-to in debugging
>> network setup on plan9 (besides what is already on the net).
>>
>> i.e., even if somebody runs into trouble (ultimately), it is better off
>> posting his output of:
>>
>> cat /net/ndb
>>
>> ls /net | grep ether (optional)
>> ls /net/ether*
>>
>> ip/ipconfig -DGP
>>
>>
>> in case he/she is running in recv timeout for 15 secs; shortcut:
>>
>> ppid=`{ps | grep ipconfig | awk '{print $2}'}
>> echo kill > /proc/$ppid/note
>>
>> sorry for the `   as I am writing from GNU/Linux
>>
>>
>> this may not fully represent what is needed, but this is what I could
>> gather in few minutes of man pages and some trial and error, after only
>> 30 minutes of Plan9 experience. so I am sure far more experienced users
>> from the mailinglist can contribute to the article
>>
>> I will try to tackle it this weekend from this approach/point of view,
>> maybe I can come up with something rather useful, if not, at least
>> networking setup for the build I use of vbox/os/v
> 
> ersion etc.
>>
> 
> Hmm, actually related to this, I encounter dhcprecv read timed out.
> I searched and seems there are some interrupt related "issues", this
> happens with VirtualBox (4.1.18_Debian r78361) for me, not on bare
> metal. NIC is in NAT, tried with a second NIC in bridged; definitely not
> the NIC as the below code also points out in  !0  and  !1
> 
> dhcp.c:
> -------
> void
> dhcprecv(void)
> {
> [...]
>         uchar buf[8000], vopts[256], taddr[IPaddrlen];
> [...]
>         memset(buf, 0, sizeof buf);
>         alarm(1000);
> !0      n = read(conf.fd, buf, sizeof buf);
>         alarm(0);
> 
>         if(n < 0){
>                 rerrstr(err, sizeof err);
>         !1      if(strstr(err, "interrupt") == nil)
>                         warning("dhcprecv: bad read: %s", err);
>                 else
>                         DEBUG("dhcprecv: read timed out");
>                 return;
> 
> 
> n <- ipconfig.h:
> ----------------
> typedef struct Conf Conf;
> [...]
> struct Conf
> {
> [...]
> 	/* dhcp specific */
> 	int	fd;
> 
> 
> Any ideas? I don't seem to find plan9.ini to try the fix Akshat Kumar
> pointed out in [1]; all the other answers from erik and ron are bare
> metal hardware related (like the original post). How to deal with this
> in VirtualBox?
> 
> Chipset is PIIX3 [2]
> 
> 
> References:
> [1]
> https://groups.google.com/forum/?_escaped_fragment_=topic/comp.os.plan9/9nlmIoY4-C8#!topic/comp.os.plan9/9nlmIoY4-C8
> 
> [2] https://www.virtualbox.org/manual/ch03.html#settings-motherboard
> (under Chipset section) -- there is another option "ICH9" and the MSI
> seems a plus; not sure how this will interact with Plan9 but I'll give
> it a go
> 

OK, bad idea. I got it fixed finally.

Chipset for motherboard certainly: PIIX3

NIC info:
- Attached: NAT
- Adapter type (changing this made it working): Intel PRO/1000 MT Server
(82545EM)
- Promisc. mode: Deny
- No port forwarding


Can ping IPs (Google dns: 8.8.8.8 for example), now I have to setup dns.

-- 
; Alexandru Gheorghe
; alghe.global {at} gmail {dot} com
; OpenPGP key ID 0xCAF985D2


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Re: [9fans] Welcome Plan 9 community

[Peter Hull]

On Wed, Mar 5, 2014 at 8:23 PM, Alexandru Gheorghe
<alghe.global@gmail.com> wrote:
> Hmm, actually related to this, I encounter dhcprecv read timed out.
I got those kind of errors for every type of network card apart from
'Intel PRO/1000 Server (82545EM)' Which one are you using?
Pete

Re: [9fans] Welcome Plan 9 community

[Alexandru Gheorghe]

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On 03/05/2014 10:43 PM, Peter Hull wrote:
> NAT network, Intel PRO/1000 MT Server (82545EM)
so it seems this nic model works best with Plan9 within VirtualBox
> PIIX3 chipset
and this as well

thanks!
-- 
; Alexandru Gheorghe
; alghe.global {at} gmail {dot} com
; OpenPGP key ID 0xCAF985D2


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Re: [9fans] Welcome Plan 9 community

[Szymon Olewniczak]

> Hi,
> I've just registerd to this mailing list, so hello everyone.
>
> I've read about Plan 9 several months ago and fascinated with ideas
> behind this OS. Now I've decided to try the system on my own and although
> I don't know much about it yet, I believe that it can be something that
> I would like to work for(I'm an IT student, so if I find myself clever
> enough to understand the power of Plan 9, I will try to help the project
> during the GOSC).
>
> But to begin with the main issue that brings me to write this message. I
> know that before I can do anything on Plan 9, I need hardware that
> cooperate with it. I've read the Supported PC Hardware[0] and
> realised that there is not much of it. Is there only one reliable motherboard
> (ASUS A8R32-MVP without NIC) that can run Plan9? I've also read there that
> there are several laptops pointed in this page without any additional
> comments in brackets. Does it mean that they are fully supported? I've
> also read that RaspberryPI can run Plan 9. I have RP rev. 2 so maybe it
> should be the hardware which I can use to start my Plan 9 adventure.
>
> What hardware can you recommend? What hardware do you use? Is there is
> any PC that can run both Plan 9 and Inferno?
>
> [0]http://www.plan9.bell-labs.com/wiki/plan9/Supported_PC_hardware/index.html
>
Sorry for post duplicate.

[9fans] Welcome Plan 9 community

[Szymon Olewniczak]

Hi,
I've just registerd to this mailing list, so hello everyone.

I've read about Plan 9 several months ago and fascinated with ideas
behind this OS. Now I've decided to try the system on my own and although
I don't know much about it yet, I believe that it can be something that
I would like to work for(I'm an IT student, so if I find myself clever
enough to understand the power of Plan 9, I will try to help the project
during the GOSC).

But to begin with the main issue that brings me to write this message. I
know that before I can do anything on Plan 9, I need hardware that
cooperate with it. I've read the Supported PC Hardware[0] and
realised that there is not much of it. Is there only one reliable motherboard
(ASUS A8R32-MVP without NIC) that can run Plan9? I've also read there that
there are several laptops pointed in this page without any additional
comments in brackets. Does it mean that they are fully supported? I've
also read that RaspberryPI can run Plan 9. I have RP rev. 2 so maybe it
should be the hardware which I can use to start my Plan 9 adventure.

What hardware can you recommend? What hardware do you use? Is there is
any PC that can run both Plan 9 and Inferno?

[0]http://www.plan9.bell-labs.com/wiki/plan9/Supported_PC_hardware/index.html